Out of State hunters.

[longranger]

For the past 3 years I have been assisting our local shooting range in helping out of state hunters get their rifles sighted in.
Our local range opens up to the general public for a few days before the general hunting season begins.(many towns in WY do this)I have noted a few observations that may be of some value to future out of state hunters coming to Wyoming.

1.Antelope/deer do not require 340 Weatherby Magnums to harvest humanely.(70 shooters yesterday more than half were big magnums)

2.Pick a cartridge you can shoot comfortably,308 Win,243 Win,270 Rem..257 "bob",25-06,just don't need big magnums for the task at hand.

3. Most of the magnum shooters could not shoot their rifles well enough @ 100 yds.to be effective hunting.

4.If you are 4-6" high @ 200 yds. you are going to overshoot everything.Most of these guys were happy with being on paper @ 200 yds.

5.If you do not know how to use your scope,bring your owners manual with you.Better yet spend some time shooting and using your scope,know how to adjust it.Many of the higher end european scopes are confusing,beautiful glass,just complicated.

6. Have some clue about proper gun handling on a range with others,i.e; no handling of firearms or bench equipment during cease fire and target posting.Actions open,magazines removed.

7. Buy/reload fresh ammunition,I have seen some pretty nasty ammo folks have had for 20 years.Very little factory ammo is going to give you accuracy you seek in any particular rifle unless you shoot some of each and see what works in your rifle 3-4" groups @100 yds. are misses @ 200 + yds. or worse crippled animals.

I love meeting all the folks from all over a few showed up that could actually shoot and required little or no assistance.We want folks to be sucessfull and comeback again you are an important part of our economy and we just plain enjoy your company.

 

[smith17]

Good info. Thanks.

 

[Steve in Vermont]

I like # 6. It should be moved to # 1.

 

[venomballistics]

thank you for an interesting perspective. in my experience it is normal to find resentment of out-of-state hunters in the Rocky Mountain states.

waiting until arrival to sight-in is really foolish. i guess i can't expect every hunter to be a rifleman but a trip as described represents an investment in time and money wasted. load selection and group placement should be decided/set even before sending money for the tag drawing. a day at the range is a day not scouting.

robert w.

I've always allowed a little latitude for "last minute sight in" These guns have traveled, and were knocked around in the process. Odds are good POI isnt where ya left it

 

[cass]

All of those rules should apply, regardless which side of the state line you're from.

 

[S&WIowegan]

This is a very good post and would be even better if it could reach more hunters. Hunting out West is a big bucks game now for most people. Big bucks guys may not have much experience hunting but they do it because they can brag later.

I used to have an FFL and a Wall Street friend wanted a .300 Weatherby to hunt with(he never had before). I managed to talk him down to a .270 Weatherby and helped him sight it in. Next thing I knew he bt. a .300 W. and went to Canada and gut shot a caribou. At least the PH made the two hunters help chase the beast down in the slough.

I'm afraid it's always going to be the way longranger describes it.

 

[oldman45]

I've always allowed a little latitude for "last minute sight in" These guns have traveled, and were knocked around in the process. Odds are good POI isnt where ya left it

OK, I will trust that statement. My question would be if the rifle is zeroed in, why would change of locations cause it to be off?

I normally shoot either a .270 or 7mm mag. Both are great guns with nice scopes. The volume I shoot in 20 yrs may be what most here would shoot in a season. I am a handgun shooter and limit my rifle time due to a separated shoulder and totally severed rotator cuff on my right shoulder. When I transport any of my scoped guns, it is in a cushioned rifle case. Do I need to re-zero at a new location? My shoulder does not like a lot of impact any more than neccessary.

 

[keith44spl]

OK, I will trust that statement. My question would be if the rifle is zeroed in, why would change of locations cause it to be off?

QUOTE]


Elevation and temp.

Once sighted a 338 in at 1000' above sea level at avg.fall temps...hunted at 7500 to 10,000 ft level in sub-zero temps.

Makes a differance in POI fur sure.

I always re-check my zero in the condtions I'm huntin' in.

Su Amigo,
Dave

BTW, when hunting in extrem cold conditions, I always de-grease them bolt innards...Slow lock time = poor ignition

 

[Bob R]

These guns have traveled, and were knocked around in the process.

This is very true, especially if traveling by air. Have you seen the way luggage with handles gets thrown around?

Do I need to re-zero at a new location?

It really depends on how you got the gun there. If flying I would most definitely reconfirm zero with a few shots once I reached my destination. You have put a lot of money and effort into a successful hunt, it would be a shame to miss your quarry because your scope was off by about a foot or so from a nice hard knock the case took.

bob

 

[williamlayton]

With decent care and thought a rifle should not come off zero on a road trip from Main to Montana---should not.
Would I trust this thought to the actual doing? I would not, unless, circcumstances prevented me from checking the zero.
Now, I don't hunt anymore--for a variety of reasons that are really not worth discussing, but I will give a hint thru a personal experience.
I used to never check it during the season--only before. Once, I took the gun to the Davis mountains for an opportunity hunt--it was during the season.
I had no chance to fire a check shot. I shot at a deer about 200 yards from me and never hit the deer or could not even see where the bullet hit.
Back at the camp I found a screw completely out of the base--found the screw in the rifles bag.
Now---how in blazes did it come out? I still don't know---but it did and I had hunted with it and killed a deer not three weeks earlier.
Blessings

 

[oldman45]

Maybe I need to make myself more clear. I do not travel more than 125 miles to hunt. The elevation will not change 100 feet. The temps may range from 30-70 degrees. Colder than 30 or warmer than 70 and I am likely not going to be out there.

I have two cases I transport long guns in. One is hard shell fiberglass the other is aluminum. Each holds one gun per side.

A friend and fellow hunter that was a reloader (he was killed two months ago) reloaded me 40 rounds each of .270 and 7mm mag in 1993. I still have 37 rounds of 7 and 35 rounds of 270 left so I do not shoot a lot.

 

[Bat Guano]

A few years ago I watched a young lady at sight-in do an exemplary job of checking her zero; her gun handling was good and she knew how to shoot. I had to ask her where she learned all that. She said "in the Army".

Quite a contrast to the usual. As a high-power shooter friend of mine commented, "We're a nation of 'rifle-bumblers' ".

May the Cabelas be with you.

 

[LVSteve]

Once, I took the gun to the Davis mountains for an opportunity hunt--it was during the season.
I had no chance to fire a check shot. I shot at a deer about 200 yards from me and never hit the deer or could not even see where the bullet hit.
Back at the camp I found a screw completely out of the base--found the screw in the rifles bag.
Now---how in blazes did it come out? I still don't know---but it did and I had hunted with it and killed a deer not three weeks earlier.
Blessings

I see you had a visit from the EGF, Evil Gunsafe Fairy. For me the EGF has removed all my FAL mags from my gunbag as I left the house and even managed to swap an Argentine Mauser in a gunsock for a Turk. Another day it took all my targets out of the truck and put them back on the shelf in the garage. I knew I had not done it as the stack was too neat.

 

[longranger]

I would encourage a couple of sighters before hunting is a good thing.In 3 days I saw 1 rifle(Win 70 .270) that shot a 3 shot group @100yds 1.5 high you could cover with a dime.with no adjustments.It varied from not on paper @100yd. to not on paper @200yd.Your scope adjustment at home is different here,count on it.

 

[thndrchiken]

I live in NJ and hunt PA. 4hrs on Rt 80, even though I know exactly where poi was before the trip I will always verify before the hunt with at least 3 rds. Now in the case of a trip for a paid hunt, you'd be stupid not to. A box of ammo is much cheaper than paying for a hunt with a missed shot because your scope is off.

 

[Old Corp]

At the range that I belong to, a few years ago, observed a 'once-a-year sight-in hunter' having a devil of a time getting his big MagnumBoomer sighted in.
Heard him say to his buddy "I just don't understand it - when I close my eyes at trigger-time the crosshairs are right in the middle of the target!"

 

[Frank237]

Living in the middle of a great deer and elk area with some antelope hunting thrown in on my north side...I see a lot of hunters during the September to near December big game season.

I also took hunters out for many years on a large Ranch nearby for mostly elk but deer as well. I "guided' in the sense that I assisted them in the hunt...but took NO money or gifts in return. My "guiding" was my pay back to the land owner for my opportunity to hunt his 2000+ elk herd.

And as a State Trooper here we were considered Ex Officio Game Wardens. We enforced not only traffic and criminal laws but the F&G laws too. I spent a lot of time on the road during hunting season.

All that said...Todays AVERAGE hunter is a poor shot, as well as borderline unethical. Note I stated AVERAGE.

We surely have MANY very competant and ethical hunters out there, but IMHO they are not as plentiful as the incompetant and unlawful hunters.

GETTING that animal...especially if it's a TROPHY animal ...by any means...seems to NOW be the deal. That 12 point 150" whitetail is on private property... Shoot it from the road, cut the fence and away we go.

Today for many HUNTING is slowly cruising county roads, find an animal, shoot it from the truck or the edge of the road, trespass on the property to retrieve it, and thats the hunt.

And with Elk especially a good bull...the extent someone will break the Law is surprising.

It would be interesting if there was a way to calculate how many game animals are taken 100% legally. Actually shot by the license holder, shot on property he had access to, etc. I fear the actual stats would be frightening.

Big gamehunting in the past was an ethical sport, with PRIDE in being a good hunter, having woods skills and being a good marksman.

Today hunting is a big money game. Five figure whitetail hunts are not unusual, same for bull elk. As soon as money enters the equation the rules go out the window for many guides and hunters.

FN in MT

 

[slumpy]

I think if you have to think twice about pulling the trigger because of the kick, maybe you should go a little smaller more manageable caliber, I bought my 300 weatherby mag because the price was to good, put a 400 dollar scope on it, paid almost 2 dollars a shell, shot it maybe 10 times to sight it in, now it sits in the safe as a investment lesson.

 

[kraigwy]

I too work the range for our "sight in days" for out of state hunters. Most are great guys to talk too.

Last thursday, before our Oct 1. openning day hunting season.

One guy from Wisconsin shows up with a brand new rifle, a Bernelli auto in 270 WSM, and new scope. He just got it a Cabala's on the way to Newcastle (70 miles away). Cabala's did bore sight the new scope for him.

I was watching him in his sight in process and was talking to his hunting partner. I happened to mention that I wouldn't take a brand new rifle on a hunting trip 1000 miles away without shooting it a bit.

His partner laughed and told me the "real story". This guy does this all the time. He takes off on a hunt, convently forgetting his rifle. Then tells his wife he had to buy a replacement to keep from having wasted an out of state hunt.

I thought that was funnier then hell. Turns out the guy knew what he was doing. Didn't take him long to get zeroed then comenced to banging gongs at verious distances.

 

[venomballistics]

I too work the range for our "sight in days" for out of state hunters. Most are great guys to talk too.

Last thursday, before our Oct 1. openning day hunting season.

One guy from Wisconsin shows up with a brand new rifle, a Bernelli auto in 270 WSM, and new scope. He just got it a Cabala's on the way to Newcastle (70 miles away). Cabala's did bore sight the new scope for him.

I was watching him in his sight in process and was talking to his hunting partner. I happened to mention that I wouldn't take a brand new rifle on a hunting trip 1000 miles away without shooting it a bit.

His partner laughed and told me the "real story". This guy does this all the time. He takes off on a hunt, convently forgetting his rifle. Then tells his wife he had to buy a replacement to keep from having wasted an out of state hunt.

I thought that was funnier then hell. Turns out the guy knew what he was doing. Didn't take him long to get zeroed then comenced to banging gongs at verious distances.

well this former WI native has been pondering the same angle to acquire an AR under the wifes nose