Packing Hot Shield vs Sig P938

[RussC]

I pack daily my Shield in pocket with a shell in the chamber and I feel the striker fire design is safe.

I am not real familiar with the "cocked and locked" design of the Sig P938. (I have never owned a 1911)

Is it as safe to pocket carry hot as the striker fire design of the Shield ?

Russ

 

[LimaCharlie]

A 1911 style pistol is safe to carry cocked & locked (condition one) if you practice safe gun handling and have a holster and carry position that you trust not to wipe off the thumb safety. When I get a new 1911 style gun or holster, I carry them around the house for a few days completely unloaded but cocked & locked. Once I am more comfortable, I carry the gun outside the home with the magazine loaded, without one in the chamber, but cocked & locked. Once I am comfortable with the carry position, gun, and holster, I carry it in condition one. When I take off the gun, I automatically check to see if the safety has wiped off during carry.

You have to practice wiping the safety down and off as you come on target until it becomes second nature. I do not mix in carry guns with a safety that does not act exactly the same as a 1911. I don’t want a safety that goes up instead of down, has multiple positions, or requires a different finger to operate. I often carry a Glock 20SF 10mm or a revolver instead of the 1911, but nothing is hurt if I automatically wipe the safety with my thumb.

My usual concealed carry is a 1911 .45 ACP on my hip and a Sig P238 .380 AP in a pocket holster with both cocked & locked. I am considering trading the P238 for its big brother, the P938.

 

[VMaxSplat]

The 1911 is my favorite defensive pistol design but I'll only carry it one way, Condition 1 and in a proper holster that covers the trigger guard. My 1911s are NEVER carried in a "loose" way such as pocket (who has pockets that large anyway?), "mexican" (inside waistband, no holster), or a glovebox. Honestly, I wouldn't carry an M&P by such methods either...

 

[M29since14]

Of course no loaded gun is "safe," but a properly maintained 1911 carried C1 is not likely to discharge unless someone does something to cause it to discharge. The same applies to well-made striker-fired designs, I'm sure.

The real problem with C1 carry is what to do with the pistol once you take it off your belt. Most people I know will lower the hammer, and that is where trouble can start, though it rarely does - with an experienced user. I think the correct thing to do is remove the magazine and unload the gun, but seem to be in the minority on that. And unfortunately, that requires re-chambering a round, which is not the greatest thing to be doing in a normal home. The striker system removes that temptation to lower the hammer, since there is none.

 

[robkarrob]

If you think about it, there is not much difference. One has the hammer back, ready to drop. The other has the striker back, ready to release. Hopefully the striker fired gun has a striker block, that would prevent firing if dropped, and modern 1911's have firing pin blocks. Other than that they are both quite similar, cocked, locked, and loaded. Both hot and ready to fire. Need to unload and make safe. Both are similar, drop the mag and rack the cartridge out, or in the 1911 you could drop the hammer carefully.

Bob

 

[thndrchiken]

If you think about it, there is not much difference. One has the hammer back, ready to drop. The other has the striker back, ready to release. Hopefully the striker fired gun has a striker block, that would prevent firing if dropped, and modern 1911's have firing pin blocks. Other than that they are both quite similar, cocked, locked, and loaded. Both hot and ready to fire. Need to unload and make safe. Both are similar, drop the mag and rack the cartridge out, or in the 1911 you could drop the hammer carefully.

Bob

Actually your a little off on that assessment. A striker fired gun is only partially cocked when at rest, the striker is fully cocked by the the trigger pull.

 

[robkarrob]

Depends on the gun model. My Springfield XD striker is fully cocked. The sear does not move the striker back any further with the trigger pull. The M&P's have a very slight bump on the face of the sear, at a point just before the sear releases. The trigger pull moves the sear down, and the bump on the sear causes the striker to cock an additional 1/32 inch, until it releases. This is called double action by S&W, due to the striker being minimally moved an extra 1/32 inch, by the sear, with the trigger pull.

This action has been debated over ane over on whether this slight rearward movement of the striker is really double action. We know a rerolver can be DA/SA. There are some pistols that are true DA/SA. My Ruger LC9 pistol's hammer starts out in the 1/2 cocked position. The trigger pull moves the hammer fully back (another 1/4 inch) until it releases, a true double action.

So if that 1/32 inch of rearward striker movement makes it double action, then my installation of an Apex sear (which does not have the bump) in my M&P reverts the trigger action back to single action. The trigger pull releases the sear, but does not cock the striker any further. There is only one action, the trigger pull moves the sear until the striker releases.

Bob

 

[pyro]

From a practical standpoint, if you have a striker fired pistol with a short travel, crisp 4.5lb trigger, it isn't much different from a cocked 911 pistol. In fact if you do not use a safety with the striker fired, it is probably less safe than a 1911 that is locked. The striker isn't exposed like the hammer on a 1911, so maybe that is a safety feature. I may be all wet on this, but that's the way it looks to me.

 

[Deadeye Dick]

I would not carry either design in my pocket without a pocket holster that covers the trigger.

 

[kisportolt]

my worry with pocket carrying a 1911 (if you can...) would be having the hammer get caught on something coming out of your pocket and slowing your draw. striker fired guns take this worry away, which would be why I would only carry those in pocket. still, it would be in a holster, and I would prefer IWB over pocket for either type gun

as for safety, that is a judgement call for you. having one in the chamber may always have a chance of something going wrong, but proper handling will minimize that.

 

[gnystrom]

IMHO hammer guns are not generally a good idea for pocket carry due to potential the snagging possibility on the drawstroke. IF YOU CARRY A 1911 cocked and locked in ANY holster, IWB, AWB, OWB, or pocket, I would recommend that you get one that totally covers the trigger guard and equally important, get one that has a sweat shield with a indent tooled into the leather, that help keeps the safety in the "safe" position. I have a Milt Sparks SS and it will keep that safety in the "safe" position during daily activities. On my Kimber Ultra CDP II I even changed the ambi safety lever to the shorter one, available from Kimber, on the right side of the gun as added insurance.