fiasconva
US Veteran
I saw an ad for a "pre-war" 38 special. The serial no. is 308227 and I think the birth date is aprox. 1950 but others said was it is much older. Any help is appreciated. My little research sheet was where I got my info.
Pre model 10 dispute. Who's right?
- Thread starter fiasconva
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If that's the correct serial number (and not an assembly number), it's prewar. Postwar should have a letter preceding the number.
OP
fiasconva
US Veteran
The picture of the grip shows that serial number. Just wondering about the birth date.
Assuming that number is correct you may be looking at the late 19-teens. I am confident somebody with better info will jump in.
That's not a Model 10, it's a .38 M&P Model 1905, 4th Change, from ~1919. So, yes it's "pre-war" and also "post war."
.38 M&P serial 291705 was shipped in April 1918.
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It's late 19 teens, probably 1918 or 1919. Definitely not 1950.
Absalom
SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
To reiterate what Flygas already referred to:
There is no letter anywhere off to the left of that number, possibly spaced quite far away, like maybe a C? If there were, it would indeed be 1950s.
If the serial is centered on the butt, it's indeed 1918/19.
Just FYI: Assembly numbers do not exceed 5 digits; only 3 to 5 digits.
DWalt
Member
307447 shipped on 7/24/19. That one would probably be close. S&W would have called it simply the "Military and Police (M&P) Model" at that time. While some collectors would call it a Model of 1905, S&W stopped doing that around 1915.
Targets Guy
US Veteran
30890x shipped 11/1919. It has a nickel finish.
cgt4570
Member
Also, by 1950, it would have the modern 'short action'.
If pre-WW2, it will have the long action hammer, which went away just after WW2, once the long action frames were used up.
If pre-WW2, it will have the long action hammer, which went away just after WW2, once the long action frames were used up.
Yes. Early in the year 1948, to be more precise. The earliest shipment I've found was in March, 1948. The one with the lowest serial number shipped on April 7, 1948, to Brazil.
I recently acquired SN 305291. Was told it was shipped mid-1919.
OP
fiasconva
US Veteran
Thanks y'all. I knew you research experts would come through. I stand humbly corrected.
Derf77
Member
1947 Serial#S
I have my Grandfathers old revolver. 1947 original grips pre-model-K .38 with serial # starting with S. Super clean gun and a lot of fun to shoot. Can't load pics for some reason.
I have my Grandfathers old revolver. 1947 original grips pre-model-K .38 with serial # starting with S. Super clean gun and a lot of fun to shoot. Can't load pics for some reason.
I believe another debate in your original post could be had and that is whether to call all K frames "Pre". All models of K frame revolvers made before model numbers were established had a proper name that quickly and accurately identified what we are dealing with. As Guy stated above, if you call your revolver by it proper name, everyone here would know what you have. In your case the 38 Military & Police 4th Change was made for a very long time, from 1915 to 1942, starting with serial number 241,704.
Even post-WWII K frames had proper names and they should be used instead of whatever a pre-model-K means? For example, there were different K frame revolver models made in the late 1940s but none of them were originally named pre-model anything. It could be a 38 Military & Police, 38 Masterpiece, 38 Combat Masterpiece, or even a 38/200 M&P.
Even post-WWII K frames had proper names and they should be used instead of whatever a pre-model-K means? For example, there were different K frame revolver models made in the late 1940s but none of them were originally named pre-model anything. It could be a 38 Military & Police, 38 Masterpiece, 38 Combat Masterpiece, or even a 38/200 M&P.
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Your grandfather's revolver is a postwar .38 Military & Police model. The S prefix units were shipped in 1946-48. The S prefix started at about S811xxx, picking up where the V (and SV) prefix wartime guns left off. Production ended in about March, 1948, at S999999. That gun shipped in June, 1948, to Minneapolis.
If you can provide the full serial number, I can give you a close estimate as to when it left the factory. Please also include the barrel length.
Derf77
Member
I think we have talked on another forum.
It is a 5.5 inch barrel and last digit is 9
Here you go.
Vr
Derf
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DWalt
Member
It would have probably shipped in 1947-48. I can't get too precise as my list shows nearby SNs as shipping in both years. That would have been at about the time that the long action was replaced by the short (high speed) action. Can you tell which yours has? I would guess it has the short action. You can tell by the shape of the hammer.
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Units with serial numbers very close to yours were shipping in August, 1948. One that is about 300 numbers lower in the S992000 range shipped in July.
Since yours has the high speed hammer, it cannot have shipped in 1947. None of those shipped until March, 1948.
The barrel is either 5" or 6". They did not fit them with 5 1/2" barrels. I'm not sure how you are measuring it, but the barrel runs from the front of the cylinder to the muzzle. If I remember correctly your pictures from the other forum, the barrel is 5". I have it recorded that way in my database.
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