Problem loading 45ACP with cast bullets

[Baltimoreed11754]

Some .45s have tighter chambers than others. Coated bullets have larger ogives than when they were uncoated as the coating covers the entire bullet and because of that are very sensitive to oal. Try a semi wadcutter profiled bullet. Either the round point short one or the squared point long one. They should work better for pc.

 

[Mbrgr1]

If the cartridge does not fit,
You must size it a bit.

Indeed! ........

 

[LoboGunLeather]

Seating the bullet deeper may solve your problem.

It could also make it worse. The case walls are tapered, thinner at the mouth and considerably thicker at the web and case head.

I'm thinking the basic problem is the 250-grain bullet, necessarily longer than anything considered "standard" in .45ACP, when seated to OAL that will function in the magazine and feed into the chamber the OP might be dealing with a bulged case well behind the case mouth area that could resist chambering fully.

If that is the case there are two possible solutions. One would be having the chamber reamed to provide additional clearance. The other would be inside neck reaming of the cases to allow deeper seating without bulging the case walls.

 

[kwh]

Agree the problem is a throat that is too short. Bullet ogive engages barrel rifling so cartridge can not fully seat.

 

[Baltimoreed11754]

A 250 gr bullet is too much bullet in a 1911. I use 255 gr in my .45 colt cas guns. As the 1911 pistol and it’s ammo was designed by JMB a jacketed or plain lead 230 gr rn is the correct bullet. However imo a 200 gr is a better bullet, it generates less recoil, does not seat as far into the case which can cause bulges and chambering issues and each bullet weighs less so they should be less expensive. A heavier bullet would work fine in a revolver if you don’t mind the recoil.

 

[Dale53]

Here is the "plunk test":

https://hosting.photobucket.com/albums/jj80/Dale53/.highres/1911Headspace.png

A cast bullet .45 ACP round should be flush with the barrel hood of the exact same 1911 barrel when "plunked".

FWIW
Dale53

 

[oldbrownhat]

I'll be re-reaading this thread when I make up the next batch of .45 ACP for my Ruger SR45, which has been giving me feeding problems since I got it (used). My STI Spartan 1911 feeds everything just fine. I'm loading Berry's 200 gr. RNFP with Lee dies and the FCD. When I was at the range today I had the "not quite-going-into-battery" probllem, so something is sticking. I thought I did a plunk test and the rounds passed but I will be checking finished case diameter as well as length and also marking the cases to see where the resistance may be.

 

[oldbrownhat]

Spent a while in the reloading room today (when I should have been doing other things) trying to figure out my Ruger SR45 problem. I had been shooting some plated 200 gr. TC the last time out, and previously Berry's RNFP which I think I'm now out of. None has been 100% reliable. But I do have some hard cast RNFP that I think were cast in Magma molds, so decided to load up a few of them to see if they will work.

They are ..452 and I can only just taper crimp them to .470/1. (Lee Cast progressive & dies + FCD.)

They clear the barrel hood and will just plunk. When I ran one in from the mag, though, there was some damage to the bullet nose, so something's not right. The gun does go completely into battery, however, which seemed to be the problem last week with the TC rounds.

It could be that the chamber is a bit tight. They drop in and out perfecty in my STI Spartan 1911, which eats anything I feed it. I'm going to load some up and take them to the range with the SR45 and see what transpires.

 

[AlHunt]

Spent a while in the reloading room today (when I should have been doing other things) trying to figure out my Ruger SR45 problem. I had been shooting some plated 200 gr. TC the last time out, and previously Berry's RNFP which I think I'm now out of. None has been 100% reliable. But I do have some hard cast RNFP that I think were cast in Magma molds, so decided to load up a few of them to see if they will work.

They are ..452 and I can only just taper crimp them to .470/1. (Lee Cast progressive & dies + FCD.)

They clear the barrel hood and will just plunk. When I ran one in from the mag, though, there was some damage to the bullet nose, so something's not right. The gun does go completely into battery, however, which seemed to be the problem last week with the TC rounds.

It could be that the chamber is a bit tight. They drop in and out perfecty in my STI Spartan 1911, which eats anything I feed it. I'm going to load some up and take them to the range with the SR45 and see what transpires.

Based on my vast experience of loading for 1 .45 caliber firearm, I'd be looking at the start of the barrel for freebore. My particular 1911 has none so it's imperative to seat the bullet deep enough that I have a few thousands clearance between the bullet and the lands.

I've had a time getting Lee dies to seat consistently in mixed brass. Not a knock on Lee, just a fact. There's an o-ring on the seating stem inside the die. Varying neck tension of mixed brass (in 9mm) gave me inconsistent seating depths. If your clearances are close, possibly you're getting a few just a tad long.

I'll be interested in your solution.

ETA: I also notice you're taper crimping AND fcd. It looks like there's a wavy sort of top on the one case in your pic. My process that seems to be working for me is to seat and then FCD. No crimping when seating. Just a thought.

 

[oldbrownhat]

...

I'll be interested in your solution.

ETA: I also notice you're taper crimping AND fcd. It looks like there's a wavy sort of top on the one case in your pic. My process that seems to be working for me is to seat and then FCD. No crimping when seating. Just a thought.

Well, I don't know if I've found the solution but I made an interesting observation when I was at the range yesterday. In the interim I had polished the feed ramp, underside of the hood and the entrance to the chamber, using the Dremel (actually a Milwauikee M12) and a fine Cratex cone, followed by Flitz on a felt bob.

At the range I started having the same problem again. Drat! After a few failures-to-fully chamber (or so I thought), I was looking at the gun in my hand before clearing a round, thinking.... when the trigger reset, seemingly of its own accord. I'm not quite sure what that told me, but it's possible I had been "riding" the trigger instead of fully releasing it, which would suggest that the problem was with the trigger reset. And banging on the back of the slide, rather than fully seating the round, was in fact completing the reset. (The slide was visibly so close to being closed that I wasn't even sure.) I also have an SR9 and have not had any problems with it, so I don't know. But after I made sure to fully clear the trigger, the rest of the 30 rounds fired without a hitch, although this time I had two or three rounds smack mein the forehead rather than ejecting over my shoulder, so there could be some issue with the extrractor as well, although this has rarely happened. I had previously disassembled the slide, removed the striker and extractor and thoroughly cleaned and lubed it all.

After I got home I flushed out the trigger mechanism and re-lubricated it. The next range session hopefully will tell me if that has solved the problem.

Your observation about the case in the pic is well taken. The rounds I actually took to the range were much cleaner and plunked perfectly. I probably don't even need to use the FCD.

 

[bruce381]

IMHO your bullets are bigger than .452 maybe ,4525 thats enough that they are bulging the case down at the bullet heal making them no chamber.
I bought a new sizer that is ,4515-.452 and problem is gone good luck.

 

[Baltimoreed11754]

Do you have a .45acp case checker to actually check the load? I have one with 6 holes and a Wilson. Kerplunk test is ok but a case checker also checks the rim for damage. I also run loaded .45acp through a lee bulge buster die. Even rds that look fine will be difficult to run through it as it’s resizing the whole case, base and rim. After doing that they fall right through the 6 hole checker and seat flush in the Wilson. I never have a feed problem with any of my 45s except the cmmg rotary bolt pcc doesn’t like swc loads.

 

[oldbrownhat]

More on the SR45

Looks like my problem is almost certainly with the trigger reset, which I from what have read is a common problem with the SR series, with many being sent back to Ruger for correction. The slide is definitely going fully into battery. I noticed at the range yesterday that one round that refused to fire had a very tiny firing pin mark on the primer, which indicates that the striker isn't resetting properly. And I could see that from behind as the end of the striker wasn't visible.

Stripped the slide completely, cleaned all parts, flushed out with brake cleaner, reassembled & lubed and have "tweaked" (bent ever so slightly inwards) the trigger bar as suggested by Galloway precision in one of their videos. Yet another range trip should tell me if that has helped.

This is annoying, although perhaps just another of those "darned learning experiences". My SR9 is totally reliable but this one seems to still have a gremlin or two hiding in the innards.

 

[epj]

H&G 68 style semiwadcutter, seated with about a thumbnail from the top of the shoulder. Used this one in many many different 1911’s and never a problem.

 

[BE Mike]

So let me follow up with this and put a cap on the solution because don't we hate it when some nitwit starts a thread like this and never posts the fix? So, dear future reader with my exact problem, this post is for you.

As stated earlier, some barrels have no leade and one of them is mine (meaning the rifiling starts RIGHT at the chamber).

My powder coated bullets have flaws and lumps on some of the noses. Never a problem in numerous 9mm. But in this case, those little bumps were contacting the rifiling and causing some rounds to not go into battery.

I got my hands on some Lee TC-452-230 powder coated and some of the same in Hi-Tek. All nicely done with clean noses. A little smaller nose on these bullets. I was able to seat these into about 1.185 and they chambered and ran fine.

My 250 grain bullets are really a bit large, but I sorted some with clean noses and (see attached pic) cut a couple of small slots into a case and tinkered with it until the empty case would chamber and I could just start a bullet into it. The slots are to allow the bullet to move easily. Then I pushed it into the chamber until the case was flush with the barrel hood. Had to tap it out (like a squib). This gave me the max cartridge length to the lands of the rifiling, 1.242. I assembled another dummy round without the slots and started seating it. I really thought it would plunk test somewhere in the 12.30-ish range but had to get down to 1.205 before it would drop in and out of the chamber and give me that satisfying brass on steel sound when it bottoms out.

Which brings me to my last point - the case gauge is fine but doesn't have a barrel attached! All it tells you is that your CASE dimensions are in spec. The bullet can (and did) hit the lands causing a failure to go into battery. Use your barrel as a case gauge, as mentioned earlier in this thread.

The other solution, by the way, is to have someone ream the throat and the guy mentioned earlier in this thread is apparently the go-to guy for that. But, it's 60 to a hundred bucks and seemed (to me, anyway) that if the factory could build ammo that chambers, I should be able to as well. I'm happy I stuck with it.

So, I thank the numerous contributors to this thread. I never imagined, after the scads of 9mm I've loaded that 45ACP would be such a problem.

Good follow-up. There are a lot of imported, inexpensive 1911's out there and the tolerances are all over the map. I think that is one piece of the puzzle. The other is that you are using bullets that appear to be an unusual design and according to you, they aren't of the highest quality regarding the coating. These things can present problems for gun owners and reloaders, so this is very helpful for a lot of folks who are in the same boat. Unfortunately, newer gun owners/ reloaders can get really frustrated when they try to get these kinds of guns to work with these kinds of bullets. Good for you for having patience and figuring it out.

 

[dla]

Probably the best thing I can tell you new reloaders is to start with known good components and recipes for 45acp. I've been watching this thread as folks thrash about trying "fix" problems caused by simply using the wrong bullet type.
The 45acp only works with certain bullet profiles. Buy the right bullets and you can spend more time shooting and less time troubleshooting.

 

[epj]

Probably the best thing I can tell you new reloaders is to start with known good components and recipes for 45acp. I've been watching this thread as folks thrash about trying "fix" problems caused by simply using the wrong bullet type.
The 45acp only works with certain bullet profiles. Buy the right bullets and you can spend more time shooting and less time troubleshooting.

Absolutely agree. And the bullets that are known to work are the 230 gr. round nose and the 200 gr SWC in the H&G68 style. Also, some JHP that have a profile similar to the 230. Those 250 gr. were likely designed either for the .45 Colt, or .45 auto rim.

 

[Roy8202]

I have followed this thread for some time as I was having the same problem. Loading LSWC 200 gr cast bullet with gas check wax not powder coated. Cases were having a slight bulge and not chambering in my 1911. Purchased a different brand of cast 200 gr LSWC wax with gas check. No problems. Did not measure bullets, just let the 1911 decide if the problem was corrected. New bullets reload and shoot fine.

 

[epj]

I have followed this thread for some time as I was having the same problem. Loading LSWC 200 gr cast bullet with gas check wax not powder coated. Cases were having a slight bulge and not chambering in my 1911. Purchased a different brand of cast 200 gr LSWC wax with gas check. No problems. Did not measure bullets, just let the 1911 decide if the problem was corrected. New bullets reload and shoot fine.

I would think that a Lee FCD would have solved this problem.