Range time with my Olympic chamber .22 S.S. Target pistol

[Hammerdown]

Hello
I am very lucky to have a 10" Olympic chamber Pistol barrel. It was a gift from Forum member Ralph Tremaine. It came to me unfinished in the white missing it's extractor cam, front sight blade and rear sight latch assembly. I sent it off to David Chicoine of Gastonia, North Carolina and he fitted and finished the barrel for me to place it on my Second series Target Pistol.


I recently took it to my local range and played with it a bit. I shot the six shot group shown from the 20 Yard line with it using Vintage Western Super Match ammo as shown in the picture. This gun will shoot far tighter groups than I am able to hold it. It will take me some time to get used to it due to it's slender shape and light trigger pull, as you can see I Pulled the shots a little to the right in my group.



I have wondered if any other's here on the forum have actually fired their Olympic chamber barrels ? If you have let's hear about your range experience with them and Please show yours in this thread. Does anyone know roughly Just how many of these Olympic chamber .22 LR caliber barrels were made ? Regards, Hammerdown

 

[rct269]

As some may recall, I fired both of my Olympic Chamber pistols (along with a standard chamber pistol) as "research" for my SWCA Journal article on the Olympic Chamber-----it was as good an excuse as any.

The Olympic Chamber guns were an early one (really short chamber) and a later one (longer chamber, but still short---shorter than those used on the early Straightlines). The range was 25 yards. The ammunition was Aguila Super SE Extra (sub sonic). The set-up was seated, two hand hold-----on a rest. I fired 25 rounds from each pistol. The performance of both Olympic Chamber guns was indentical----all X-Ring. The standard chamber pistol shot all Ten-Ring----with pronounced vertical stringing------the group was the width of the X-Ring, but strung from the top to the bottom of the Ten-Ring.

The factory letters on Third Models state: "The total production of Olympic barrels is unknown." If someone wants to start a count of the survivors, I have two.

Ralph Tremaine

 

[H. M. Pope]

Hammerdown,
That's decent shooting, I don't think you "pulled" any shots to the right, if you pulled any shots they would most likely not be in the group, all you probably need is a sight adjustment to the left.

I have shot all of my Olympic chambered SS's, and all of my First, Second, and Third models, plus my Straight-line, but only at a 50 ft. indoor range. I have also shot my Straight-line in State Championship Matches and won a few slow fire events with it back in the late 50's and early 60's. For me to do really good offhand shooting with those long skinny barrels I had to tape some lead weights at the mid way point on both sides of the barrel, it balances much better.

As to the number made with Olympic chambers I don't think anyone really knows, I personally know of about 30 of them, most seen to be above the 10,000 serial number range in the Third Model and some that don't have them probably should but I've been told by a lot of older shooters that a lot of them did not like the pushing it took to get the ammo seated in the chamber so had it opened up to a standard chamber.

I haven't done any shooting with the Olympic chamber at the standard outdoor 50 yd. slow fire range but the guys I've talked to that have tested Olympic chambers at that range said that there was no "real" accuracy gain that would make a difference in the winning or loosing of a match.
Just about all of my shooting and testing is done with Eley 10-X.

I think I've already up loaded photos of some of the targets I've shot with them so won't waste space doing it again, the guns all look about the same, your gun looks just like my gun, I guess if you seen one First, Second or Third model you've seen them all, same for the Straight-line but I don't think I ever up loaded a photo of the one I shoot so here it is.
Regards
H. M. Pope

 

[Hammerdown]

Hammerdown,
That's decent shooting, I don't think you "pulled" any shots to the right, if you pulled any shots they would most likely not be in the group, all you probably need is a sight adjustment to the left.

I have shot all of my Olympic chambered SS's, and all of my First, Second, and Third models, plus my Straight-line, but only at a 50 ft. indoor range. I have also shot my Straight-line in State Championship Matches and won a few slow fire events with it back in the late 50's and early 60's. For me to do really good offhand shooting with those long skinny barrels I had to tape some lead weights at the mid way point on both sides of the barrel, it balances much better.

As to the number made with Olympic chambers I don't think anyone really knows, I personally know of about 30 of them, most seen to be above the 10,000 serial number range in the Third Model and some that don't have them probably should but I've been told by a lot of older shooters that a lot of them did not like the pushing it took to get the ammo seated in the chamber so had it opened up to a standard chamber.

I haven't done any shooting with the Olympic chamber at the standard outdoor 50 yd. slow fire range but the guys I've talked to that have tested Olympic chambers at that range said that there was no "real" accuracy gain that would make a difference in the winning or loosing of a match.
Just about all of my shooting and testing is done with Eley 10-X.

I think I've already up loaded photos of some of the targets I've shot with them so won't waste space doing it again, the guns all look about the same, your gun looks just like my gun, I guess if you seen one First, Second or Third model you've seen them all, same for the Straight-line but I don't think I ever up loaded a photo of the one I shoot so here it is.
Regards
H. M. Pope

Hello H.M. Pope & RCT269
Lot's of good information in your response here thanks so much for responding. I will have to get some of that Eley-10X ammo and try it. Perhaps it is a sight adjustment that is needed on mine but I have had a bad habit in the past of pulling some shots placing too much finger on the trigger and these go off so easy I felt that may have been the issue, or maybe the Older vintage ammo did not get along with this barrel ? It is neat hearing that only around 30 of these barrels have been seen out there, that shows How Rare they really are.








Sadly, mine was a left over that did not get finished or serial number stamped by the factory but Old D.B. Wesson sure would be very proud to know it finally did get finished and is being enjoyed the way he meant them to be. As far as the Burden of seating a round, they can be seated by setting the hammer in the first click safety Notch and simply closing the gun's action, but perhaps that was not considered Protocol or Macho when these were popular in range competitions. Do you know when these Pistols started to die off in Competition use ?

 

[H. M. Pope]

Hammerdown,
The old guys liked to make sure that the ammo was seated as far into the chamber as possible, if it wasn't seated all the way in the firing pin would seat it when it hit but that was not a good way to get top accuracy.

Cant say for sure when these Pistols started to die off in Competition use, I haven't shot in competition since 1995, the last event I used one in was a International Free Pistol match, did not do very well, came in ninth, it's very hard to compete with one of the older S&W's when your shooting against real Free Pistols such as the Swiss 150 series Hammerli and the Russian TOZ 35 with there one oz. triggers and more modern barrels and form fitting grips.

I found some photos of some 50 foot targets, one was fired with an Olympic chamber and the other with a standard chamber, as you can see there's not much difference, they will both shoot 100's.
Regards
H. M. Pope

 

[SDH]

To wring-out the upmost in accuracy, would you rest the barrel, or the bottom of the grip?
These are difficult guns to shoot because of the long, light front end and I've vowed to discover the true potential of my 3rd model, normal chambered gun. Any shooting suggestions would be appreciated...
Off-hand it feels like waving a magic wand, except the results aren't the same!

 

[rct269]

As noted, my shooting was two hand hold----holding the gun with my right hand----and holding my right hand with my left hand. The left hand was on the rest---but no part of the gun was on the rest. I would imagine a machine rest would tell the tale. Brownells has them (or had them last time I was looking through their catalog). They were a little on the "pricey" side, but it only costs a little more to go first class!!

And you're right about the magic wand feel----------------only I always likened them to a fly rod-----having held neither a magic wand nor a fly rod!

Ralph Tremaine

 

[Hammerdown]

Hello
When I shot mine, I rested the front portion of the barrel in a V-Rest made for Pistol shooting. I tried sand Baging the rear portion of the gun, but it felt as though the barrel was out there too far with no support......

 

[H Richard]

Well my groups look a little different, as they were shot one handed in a bullseye match at 50 ft. The group is about as respective as I currently am able do with any of my other bullseye guns with iron sights. (Thank God for red dot sights). My 3rd model shipped in 1917, and the 8" barrel (not an Olympic chamber) was from a gun shipped in 1911. How they came together is unknown.

 

[SDH]

Thanks guys, I'll try to post some targets, but it might be a while, Spring is yet to happen in the Rockies!

 

[H. M. Pope]

SDH,
This is how I test my Single Shots for accuracy.

Rest the bottom of the grip on sand bags, then rest the frame just in front of the trigger guard on another sand bag, never let the barrel touch
anything. Set back as far as possible with your arm in the normal shooting position so that your eye is at the max distance from the sights, about the same as you would be if you were shooting off hand, do not use your non-shooting hand for anything, if you use it to hold the bags or gun your aiming eye will be to close to the sights
and the closer your eye is to the sights the easer it is to mis-align them, this is of course for guys with normal eye sight.

It's almost impossible for me to use the thin front sights on some of the S&W SS's so I fit a 1/8 inch post front sight with a rear sight cut so that I can see a thin strip of light on each side, taking a 6:00 o'clock hold, it gives me good contrast and the width of the front sight appears to be the same width as the black bull, makes alignment much easer for me.

Of course this is only for testing gun and ammo accuracy, shooting in Covenantal or International matches you are only allowed to use one hand and as you know there not balanced very well for off hand shooting. I found it best to tape some lead weights on both sides of the barrel about mid way, some guys like them closer to the muzzle some like them closer to the hand, the balance point is a personal thing, I used lead wire, an old guy told me he used some 38 cal. bullets taped on both sides of the barrel and depending on the balance point he wanted he could add or subtract them as needed.
Regards
H. M. Pope

 

[SDH]

Thanks Harry, I'll give that a try when the weather improves. I think I can replicate your rest set-up, and have several different brands of standard-v and target ammo.
Eyes are part of he problem and mine aren't the best but eye relief always helps.
My 3rd model has a small bead front and round notch rear and I'm not likely to change them, next to patridge they seem OK. I used the type sights you describe when I shot competitively, mostly muzzleloading rifles but also shot revolvers for money back in the day...
I've seen, as I'm sure you have, old single shots with forend weights either mounted with holes drilled side to side through the rib (ouch!) or under a forend like those TC pistols have. Again, I'll probably shoot unaltered, just to see...
(BTW: I still love to see higher resolution pic of your Gagne grips and have even contemplated sending for a letter as I know you are not enthused with the idea. Waddayatink?)
Best,
Steve

 

[H. M. Pope]

Hi Steve,
I never had any luck with those bead front sights and round notch rear sights.
I have a very hard time doing any kind of precision shooting with them on regulation targets, but they seem ok for quick acquisition on such things as tin cans and game animals where you don't need to shoot 10 ring or X ring.

It's very difficult for me to use them, I have a hard time getting good windage and seems harder to do a 6:00 o'clock hold, for me it's like trying to balance a plum on a plum, and if I try an take a center hold on a regulation black target it's almost imposable for me to hold exact center every time.

The important things I check when searching for a high degree of accuracy or to see just how good those old SS's or target revolvers will shoot, is to be sure that the sights are capable of being used for precession shooting, and I'm comfortable with them for my eye sight, I also make sure that the barrel does not touch anything, this way I get closer to the true accuracy of the gun and ammo combination same as if I was shooting it in the off hand position. I test all of my Revolvers the same way, never let the barrel touch anything. And of course ammo becomes a very important part of the testing. My guns always seem to shoot much better using the high end ammo such as Eley 10-X or RWS-R-50.

Did I mention to take a tip from the Bench Rest shooters, they are always shooting very tiny groups, and they do it with free floated barrels.

Yes I have seen some of the older single shots with holes drilled side to side through the rib to hold the weights, and like you I always say ouch !. I guess it works ok but I'm not about to do that to any of my SS's, tape works just fine.

As you can see I'm not much of a picture taker and the ones of the Gagne grips were the best I could do with what I have.

Your correct, I'm not that enthused about sending for a factory letter.
One of the reasons I'm not that interested in getting a letter is because I already have the info of when and who it was given to, also have the info on the
U S R A events he used it in and the scores he shot with it. None of this info is in a factory letter but it is a matter of record and in print.

Another reason is because I already have a handful of letters from both S&W and Colt that did not have much info in them other than when it was shipped, or who it was shipped to, and we already know that info.

Being retired and on a low income, before I would spend the kind of money that R J or Colt wants for that kind of info I would sooner buy ammo than Info, it would be more useful to me, but if you think R J could provide more info please be my guest and send for a letter, I could be wrong but my opinion is that he wont find anything that we don't already know.
Regards
H. M. Pope