The new one's don't even look right, since they redesigned the frame to make room for the lock. It is sad that S&W does not go back to making the really good revolvers that they used to manufacture.
S&W Model 19 Coming Back
- Thread starter Road Rat
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Nobody ever post a pic of the front of the barrel where the zerk fitting is.
Wonder why that is?
Wonder why that is?
Like this? Gun is dirty due to firing hot 125 gr. 357s. I'm trying hard to wear it out.
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Walkingwolf
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I have decided that I am buying no more handguns. BUT the two IL Smiths that I have I love. For the most part I do not buy handguns for a romantic relationship, I buy them for tools. Right now I have too many tools.
As far as old vs new, many think that there were not production problems on vintage firearms. WRONG! Truth is that CNC machining is very accurate, MIM parts have proven to work and keep costs down. The two piece barrel was something Smith should have done a longgggg time ago. DW proved the accuracy, and durability of two piece barrels.
Around here there are not any vintage 19's that I have seen for a fair price, so if I have to have one I would not hesitate to get one of the classics. My model 21 IL classic is a work horse.
As far as old vs new, many think that there were not production problems on vintage firearms. WRONG! Truth is that CNC machining is very accurate, MIM parts have proven to work and keep costs down. The two piece barrel was something Smith should have done a longgggg time ago. DW proved the accuracy, and durability of two piece barrels.
Around here there are not any vintage 19's that I have seen for a fair price, so if I have to have one I would not hesitate to get one of the classics. My model 21 IL classic is a work horse.
Walkingwolf
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Then don't buy one if you think it will break. Sometimes solutions are very simple.
Walkingwolf
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Rest assured, I won't.
But I do reserve the right to comment.
The DW approach actually works very well.
The Smith approach....works.
Usually.
Denis
Any citations to back up that it only works "Usually" or is it just opinion?
Rest assured that I don't accept comments on my purchases without documentation. So they mean little to me, as mine probably does to others without it. I do believe Smith has documented their testing/research/development using the two piece barrel.
The positive points:
1. Great trigger (have have stoned the rebound slides and the corresponding contacts points in the frame on my other revolvers and did not feel the need to do it on this one);
2. Adjustable trigger stop which was set up perfectly;
3. Came with wooden grips and rubber grips;
4. Tritium insert on front sight;
5. Full sized forcing cone;
6. Did I mention the awesome trigger? I'm mentioning it again because it's really sweet!
The negatives:
1. As a carry gun, it's a bit heavy for the amount of firepower it has. If I'm limited to 6 rounds, I'd rather have a single stack 9, .40 or .45 which is easier for me carry extra rounds and reload.
I am ambivalent about the lock, well maybe I'd rather not have it, but if it really bothered me I'd remove it.
The main reason I bought this is because I lusted after the 19 carry comp that came out in the mid '90s but didn't buy it back then. When this version came out, I decide that I'd buy it if I found it for under a grand.
Walkingwolf
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Google North Carolina DOC S&W Revolvers breaking barrels off.
Did Smith use two piece barrels in 2006, how long were those guns in service? Sooooo it seems you are actually making the point that the new Smiths are more reliable. As far as current, I live in NC and do not believe NCDOC issues revolvers anymore. In truth they have been phasing them out as many other corrections agencies have.
Most of the trade in K frames I have come across have one piece crush fit barrel, I have one myself. The revolvers in service at the time you bring up had been in service for some time. I have lived in NC for over two decades, and I rarely have seen DOC officers with anything but semi auto pistols.
I stopped, and remembered the comments/rumors of crush fit barrels breaking, which makes sense since the process sometimes chokes the throats excessively, the process can also damage the metal of both the frame, and the threads if over done. Smith had been using crush fit for some time, most of it without issue. My former police/DOC model 64 is a performer, but it has the crush fit barrel. In many engineers writings a torque barrel is better than a crushed barrel. Plus the removal of the flat is a clear improvement.
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The NC DOC revolvers were brand new model 64s with two piece barrels. The two piece barrels were snapping off at the frame and going down range during qualifications with the new guns.
s&w sent a "team" down to examine the problems - after it had recieved a lot of local press coverage. Shortly thereafter, s&w issued a press release which declared; "NC DOC is continuing its long association with s&w and will be taking delivery of the new m&p 40 pistols....".
While their QA/QC and designs may not be worth a damn, their Public Relations department is top notch.
s&w sent a "team" down to examine the problems - after it had recieved a lot of local press coverage. Shortly thereafter, s&w issued a press release which declared; "NC DOC is continuing its long association with s&w and will be taking delivery of the new m&p 40 pistols....".
While their QA/QC and designs may not be worth a damn, their Public Relations department is top notch.
Walkingwolf
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The NC DOC revolvers were brand new model 64s with two piece barrels. The two piece barrels were snapping off at the frame and going down range during qualifications with the new guns.
s&w sent a "team" down to examine the problems - after it had recieved a lot of local press coverage. Shortly thereafter, s&w issued a press release which declared; "NC DOC is continuing its long association with s&w and will be taking delivery of the new m&p 40 pistols....".
While their QA/QC and designs may not be worth a damn, their Public Relations department is top notch.
Documentation that they were NEW 64's with two piece barrel, mine was purchased at the switch, and it is crush fit barrel.
Walkingwolf
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NO! MY money I spend how I want. YOU want me to believe your claims it is on YOU to provide documentation. Otherwise it is just noise.
Walkingwolf
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Them leave me alone! You seem to want to form MY opinions for me. That does not work with me, and with most people with open minds. I am willing to look at documentation if someone wants to provide it. But have no respect for product bashing, especially on a forum of members who own those products, and take pride in them.
Critical (analytical) discussions of products is part & parcel of this forum, including the good with the bad.
I make no attempts to form any opinions in your head, I merely state that the Smith system is not the equal of the DW because it's true.
The flange at the muzzle is much less strong than the DW threaded barrel nut.
The Smith two-piece barrel is not interchangeable.
It cannot be serviced (swapped or B/C gap adjusted) by the user or replaced by the local gunsmith.
It HAS broken off at both ends.
If you choose to ignore these facts, that's up to you.
Just don't use the better DW system to justify the Smith system.
Not equal at all.
Denis
I make no attempts to form any opinions in your head, I merely state that the Smith system is not the equal of the DW because it's true.
The flange at the muzzle is much less strong than the DW threaded barrel nut.
The Smith two-piece barrel is not interchangeable.
It cannot be serviced (swapped or B/C gap adjusted) by the user or replaced by the local gunsmith.
It HAS broken off at both ends.
If you choose to ignore these facts, that's up to you.
Just don't use the better DW system to justify the Smith system.
Not equal at all.
Denis
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