Single Stage or Progressive?

[Noah Zark]

I started on a Lyman Turret press in the late 60s, then picked up a RCBS Rockchucker in the late 70s, which I still have and use for rifle cartridges.

I also have a number of Lyman 310 tool setups for various rifle cartridges for which I load low-volume, and which don't require FL resizing, like 45-70, 38-55, and 375 Win.

But for handgun ammo I've picked up two used Dillon SDBs, and have one set up for Large Pistol Primer cartridges -- 45 ACP, 45 Colt, 44 Mag/Spl and one set up for Small Pistol Primer cartridges -- 38 Spl/357 Mag and 9x19. I bought both SDBs used and invested in extra tool heads so that the dies can remain "set up" and need only a quick check after a changeout. With the SDBs, I find that I can get about 350 rds/hr of quality ammo to feed my handguns and 9mm subguns.

The point here is that I learned on single-stage equipment (a turret is a single stage press in my book; it just has multiple dies already set up) and took that experience to a higher level with the progressives. I will quickly add that I need both the Rock Chucker and the SDBs for my current battery and shooting interests. That equipment provides me with the best combination of capability and throughput.

Noah

 

[Skip Sackett]

Well, one thing for sure is that you are a master at asking questions!

The caliber changeover in the XL650 is fast enough between primer sizes that it isn't that big of a deal, for me at least. 15 minutes? Less maybe.

If I am staying in the same primer size changeover is less than a 5 minutes, tops.

Cases are separated by headstamp in my world. They are all loaded but separated just in case they are different lengths. I make adjustments to the machine to compensate for that. Otherwise you will have one with a tight crimp and one with out any crimp.

Primer pockets don't get cleaned either. I haven't found a need for the type of rounds I load.

FWIW

 

[pinkymingeo]

If you try the LnL, you'll find it's a different concept from the Dillons. The design allows caliber changes in about a minute, primer size changes in less than 2 minutes. It's easy to use the press for load development. If you like, you can even run it with a single die, leaving the other four holes empty. Top speed is the same as a 650. One of the best powder measures in the business. Really hard to beat.

 

[Paul5388]

Pinky,

The only problem with the LNL is trying to find one!

I've been looking for one for a friend for over three months and there haven't been any available.

 

[ingmansinc]

For everybody that gave answers, I thank you very much. I picked the brains of the best in the business and with this info I will now decide if I want to spend the extra dollars or not at this time.

 

[Dale53]

Dennis;
I believe a realistic figure of production is a very important question to ask. If you can only do 50 rounds per hour after learning how, who NEEDS a progressive? That, of course, is exaggerated for clarity. On the other hand, your suggestion to "go fast slowly" is right on point!

After using one for a few months and a few thousand rounds, most will be able to reach the realistic expectations given by most of us here.

I do not give "at the rate of" but actual figures of an hour's labor. I no longer load several hours at a time. I typically, will load 400-500 (readily attainable with the Dillon 550B in an hour with most pistol cartridges - rifle cartridges take just a bit longer). My given rate does NOT include loading primer tubes nor moving bullets to the bench, nor cleaning up afterwards. You should be able to factor those in. I often load primer tubes (I have found it a time saver to load up six or so at time and have them ready to go).

I also don't factor in case tumbling (after it's loaded it runs by itself).

However, giving realistic times helps a new perspective reloader to make up his mind.

The suggestion to start with a single stage is NOT a bad idea. However, I would go just a bit further and suggest the Lee Classic Turret press for a "starter press" as the extra caliber needs (extra turrets, etc) are much less expensive than other choices. However, if you are engaged in the action sports, cowboy action shooting, IPSC, IDPA, etc, you might as well go the Dillon 550B or Hornady LnL Progressive route as you WILL end up there.

Just a thought or two...

Dale53

 

[MTKTM]

I have a Dillon 550B that I bought in '93 when I started shooting USPSA/IPSC. No regrets. I load 38/357, 40S&W and 45acp on it. I've never done any rifle rounds on the 550, have used my mid '70s vintage RCBS Rockchucker for that task, but recently picked up some 223 dies for the Dillon and plan to give that a whirl in the near future.....if I can find some dang small rifle primers, that is!!

 

[Andy Griffith]

I'll add to the Hornady bandwagon...

The great thing about the LNL press is that you can go to other rifle cartridges besides .223 or .30 Carbine.

The only way to load .30-06, .30-30 and .300 Winchester Magnum is is quantity once you have your load developed. I don't think you can load long action magnums on some of Dillon equipment.

I do recommend a Rock Chucker or any other single stage press that has a removable insert at the top if for any reason you want to load anything that takes larger diameter dies.
Just a minor detail, but it is something to think about.

 

[johngalt]

I also recommend the Hornady LNL, since I have one.

I've read complaints about the difficulty in changing the primer system on the Dillon 550/650. If you are concerned about that, changing the primer size on the LNL is trivial.

Supposedly it is easier to change the charge thrown on the LNL powder measure also (but I've never used a Dillon).

 

[pinkymingeo]

Midsouth may have the LnL in stock. http://www.midsouthshooterssup...53%53%20%4F%4E%4C%59

 

[Dale53]

andygriffith & johngalt;
I load the .375 H&H Magnum on my 550B without a single problem. That is certainly a LONG cartridge.

While I admit that I have two 550B's (with one for small pistol & rifle and one for Large pistol & rifle primers it is NOT necessary. I have used the 550B (single press) for thirty years or so (had one since they first came out) and load 11 different rifle and pistol calibers. However, I am an impatient guy and now that I am retired and have all of my children living away from home (with much less household expense) I bought the second one last year so I don't have to change primer sizes. It takes about fifteen minutes to change. Not a big deal - and it doesn't require an engineering degree to do it, either.

The 550B Dillon is probably the most reliable progressive press ever built. I have some experience with most of them out there. I doubt that choice of the Hornady would be a mistake but my faith goes with Dillon based on more than thirty years of contact with the company and their truly ennovative "NO BS warranty".

Dale53

 

[Jeff423]

Regarding the LNL, I used to have 3 objections. But now since they've fixed the ejector and it is a true 5 station press I'm down to 2 and they are minor.
I don't believe they have a powder thru expander for .32 (not a problem if you don't shoot .32)
Their Service Dept. used to be closed on Saturday which was when a lot of people were setting up their presses.
I chose the 650 but if I were buying today I might give the LNL a close look. Their previous ejector with the wire across the #5 station killed it for me at the time.

Jeff

 

[bigt5150]

I don't trim my cases although I make sure they are all the same brand and length(I prefer starline cases). I do clean the primer pockets with and RCBS primer pocket cleaning brush. I have 4-5 brushes and I usually invite my shooting buddies for a primer pocket cleaning party. In my opinion the Dillon 550B would probably meet your needs better than a 650 and is cheaper too. Just my 2 cents.
Let us know what you decide.

 

[johngalt]

The usefulness of the LNL bushings tends to be overlooked. I found that it makes setting up the dies very easy. The dies screw into individual bushings instead of a tool head. The dies can then be inserted into the press one at a time and set up. Once the set up, the dies can be moved around willy-nilly without losing the settings.

This is very useful for setting up the powder measure. At the beginning of a loading session, I remove all the dies except for the powder measure. I run cases through the powder measure until it is throwing the correct charge. Next I add the lockout die, which checks for no powder/double charges. Once that is set, then I add the rest of the dies.

I also got extra powder dies for each case size (.38, .357, .45 auto) because the case activated powder measure must be set for each case length. The powder measure body itself easily moves between powder dies.