Smith and Wesson 627 PC Accuracy Issues

[Bushmasterguy]

I purchased a S&W 627PC a few weeks ago and had to send the grip panels back because they were different colors. After getting the grips with the correct matching stains I took it out to shoot this weekend.

Now another surprise. The accuracy at 15 yards using sad bag rests was all over the place. I am talking 4 to 6 inch groups with over 100 rounds fired using 3 different brands of .357. Hornady 125GR Critical Defense JHP, Hornady 125GR FTX Critical Defense, American Eagle 148GR.

I am not a novice shooter and own several handguns including a S&W 625JM that shoots very accurate and a S&W Model 60PC also very accurate. Heck my S&W .38 Airweight snubby is more accurate! I have shot IDPA with my 625JM a few times with good success. I have my own place to shoot and spend time setting up my rest for all my handguns I sight in. I am very disappointed with my shooting session and attempt to sight in this revolver.

See attached photos of rough crown and the barrel looks slightly canted. On both of my other revolvers the crown is recessed but as you can see from the photos it appears the rifling runs right to the end of the barrel. Is this normal? Should I send it back?

 

[Desert Pete]

My 627 is a bit rough cosmetically but it is very accurate. I do shoot hand loads tuned to the gun. The trigger is awesome.

 

[kennyb]

let someone else shoot it and see how it does

 

[Bushmasterguy]

I called S&W today and described the problem. Without hesitation they sent me a return label and I am sending it back for repair.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

That's good. Don't forget to include a letter detailing everything you would like them the address. Let us know how it goes.

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[HarrishMasher]

Before sending it back, I would definitely have someone else shoot it. I am sure you are an excellent shot, just sometimes it is possible to not jive with a gun that is new to you. This has certainly happened to me and it takes a while to get used to the gun.

It took me a while to get used to my first N Frame after shooting K/L frames for so long. I was all over the place the first few times out. Eventually I figured it out and I now shoot tiny little groups with it.

For a gun to be really off like that it is usually something pretty obvious like the timing being really off and shaving the rounds as they go into the forcing cone. Things you would really notice.

 

[regalsc]

Why waste more ammo? You shot from a sand bag rest & got poor groups. S&W said send it back & that's what I would do also.

 

[Bushmasterguy]

I actually have another N Frame 625JM so very familiar with handling that type of revolver. The barrell does appear slightly unaligned as you can see from the photo and the crown does not appear finished. When I relayed this to S&W they told me to send it back. I will provide a range report when I get it back. Thanks all for replying.

 

[Bushmasterguy]

Received the repaired Revolver back. We will see how it shoots next week and if this improved the accuracy issues.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

That's good. Did they clean up the crown & tweek the barrel alignment?

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[Bushmasterguy]

They did re-crown the barrel but they did not polish it. I find that amazing. So far very unimpressed with Smith and Wesson Performance Center. I have several S&Ws revolvers and a 1911pd but this experience has been a huge dissapointment. They did align the barrel. I bought a .357 brass lap and 600 grit silicon carbine abrasive paste online this weekend to polish it myself. Cost me $40 and have to wait a week to get the brass lap and carbide paste in.

See attached photo. Obviously they just reamed it and were too lazy to polish it.

 

[ridgewalker]

You sound like a very experienced shooter so sorry if anything I say is too basic. I have bought a bunch of S&W revolvers and sometimes I can shoot them good from the first session. Sometimes I have to shoot it several sessions to get used to it and sometimes I have to shoot it a lot for it to break in.

The S&W revolver I shoot the most is a 627 Pro with 4 inch barrel. In my own opinion I can shoot it pretty good. But when I first got it I was all over the place with it. Part of it is finding the right ammo and getting the gun sighted in for that ammo. I usually buy in lots of 1000 rounds on the internet. It is a lot cheaper than buying locally.

I also have a 617 with 6 inch barrel. I was always envious of the other shooters on here who spoke of how accurate their 617 was. Finally after a few thousand rounds my 617 has developed into an accurate gun. It just needed to break in.

So my advice is get some cheaper practice ammo and put a thousand rounds through your gun over the next few weeks or months and then tell us how it is shooting. I have had good results with American Eagle 130gr and PMC 132gr 38 special for practice. It looks to me like the recrowning was an improvement. As far as the cant, from the pic of the barrel shoulders, it looks very slight, my guess 1 degree. I agree it should be prefect but it really shouldn't affect accuracy being that small.
Best wishes,

 

[HarrishMasher]

They did re-crown the barrel but they did not polish it. I find that amazing. So far very unimpressed with Smith and Wesson Performance Center. I have several S&Ws revolvers and a 1911pd but this experience has been a huge dissapointment. They did align the barrel. I bought a .357 brass lap and 600 grit silicon carbine abrasive paste online this weekend to polish it myself. Cost me $40 and have to wait a week to get the brass lap and carbide paste in.

See attached photo. Obviously they just reamed it and were too lazy to polish it.

View attachment 192644

Shoot it yet? Mine is very accurate. This is Double Action no rest. If I put it in a rest, they all go in the same hole.

 

[Bushmasterguy]

Thanks Ridewalker for the reply. I would expect the pistol to be accurate out of the box. I have already expended a over a hundred rounds. However we will see how it goes when I get out next weekend. HarrisMasher nice groups! I was grouping 6 inches at 15 yards. I hope to even get close to what you have.

 

[Bushmasterguy]

HarrisMasher would u mind snapping a photo of your crown and posting it so I can see how it compares to mine?

 

[HarrishMasher]

HarrisMasher would u mind snapping a photo of your crown and posting it so I can see how it compares to mine?

Sure I will do it tonight. But I am fairly certain it looks like yours. I also believe my 686PC 2.5" looks similar as well. That just seems to be how they cut them these days.

 

[HarrishMasher]

HarrisMasher would u mind snapping a photo of your crown and posting it so I can see how it compares to mine?

Ok. Here are the pics. The crown is not pretty, just like yours. That is how they all seem to look. Just how they are cut. It clearly does not effect the accuracy on my gun.

I have owned the gun since new, only for a few months, and have about 300 rounds through it.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

They did re-crown the barrel but they did not polish it.

I'm with you. The repair does look rougher than an expensive gun should, especially since it was just in their hands. Hopefully it'll shoot like you expect now though.

.

 

[Bushmasterguy]

HarrishMasher many thanks for posting the Pics. After reviewing your Pics they look exactly like mine did BEFORE they did the work. We will see how it shoots this weekend. I may go ahead and shoot it as is before I try to polish the crown.

 

[HarrishMasher]

HarrishMasher many thanks for posting the Pics. After reviewing your Pics they look exactly like mine did BEFORE they did the work. We will see how it shoots this weekend. I may go ahead and shoot it as is before I try to polish the crown.

You should leave the crown alone and shoot it first. The crowns look like that on all the new guns. It is just how they do them today. All my new guns look like that. That is just how they cut them. All of mine are super accurate.

 

[riverrat38]

Unless there are chips or scratches, I think that what we are looking at is what we get with a barrel that has the cross sectional shape of a stop sign intersects with a muzzle crown.
Any attempts to polish it up to look like the "old" barrel sections would harm accuracy.
Symmetry counts a lot here.

Best,
Rick

 

[Bushmasterguy]

Thanks Rick. Appreciate your thoughts

 

[Bushmasterguy]

Accuracy Issue Resolved. I did go ahead and Polish the Crown Myself with the Brownells Brass Lap. 6 rounds at 15 yards with 5 almost touching! I am happy. See photo.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

Flash to Pass

Good to hear! Sometimes you just have to take the horse by the reins yourself. . .

. . .

.

I bought a 627PC 5"bbl. 8-Times a few weeks ago & the forcing cone was sorely lacking. Circular grooves in it that ended abruptly at the rifling with turned up edges, and, from what I've read, cut too wide. I used the Brownells Revolver Chamfering Tool Kit I bought last year, for another project, to clean it up. Can't fix the "too wide" but now, at least, it has a nice transition to it.

By the way, those kits come with one each brass pilots for 38, 41, 44, & 45 calibers. I bought an additional second pilot for each & I'm glad I did. By putting one near the forcing cone & the other near the muzzle you have a perfectly aligned rod & don't have to concerned about trying to hold the center guide at the muzzle while cutting.

http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-t...lete-38-45-kit-sku080-481-000-26157-2197.aspx

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[Bushmasterguy]

I can't agree more Bluedot! As is the case in many things in life.

I used the Brass Lap that you can use with a Power Drill. Following the directions carefully is the key not to overdue it. My crown came out smooth and perfect. I just wished S&W would have spent the extra time to do this when I sent it back in.

http://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-t...custom-brass-muzzle-crowning-lap-prod855.aspx

See Photo of Crown Polish/Lapping

 

[Frank237]

What a sad story regarding QC at S&W. Especially as a performance Center product!

I have stayed away from the modern revolvers but couldn't resist the PC 627x8 in 5". Mine is an older gun and has been accurate and worthy of the PC Logo.

Glad the OP's issues were resolved.

 

[05CarbonDRZ]

What a sad story regarding QC at S&W. Especially as a performance Center product!

I have stayed away from the modern revolvers but couldn't resist the PC 627x8 in 5". Mine is an older gun and has been accurate and worthy of the PC Logo.

Glad the OP's issues were resolved.

I agree,I have read similar stories far to often on this Forum.The really sad part is that most are PC Guns!

 

[Co Th G]

Smith should change the name of the "Performance Center" to "Profit Center" since that's all it is nowadays.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

I used the Brass Lap that you can use with a Power Drill. Following the directions carefully is the key not to overdue it. My crown came out smooth and perfect.

I like it. That looks good. I thought you had to use a cutter first but I've never researched it. What number grit paste did you use?

.

 

[Bushmasterguy]

600 grit silicon carbide. Worked great!