I won't say what I think until others have posted and what Happen on memorial day when I went to see my wife on her resting place.......
So, what is a combat vet???
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BLACKHAWKNJ
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As with most things military, so long as you have the paperwork to support it....
1. Formally assigned to a combat unit and in a MOS/TOE slot that requires participation in combat operations.
2. In an area officially designated as a combat zone/area of operations.
1. Formally assigned to a combat unit and in a MOS/TOE slot that requires participation in combat operations.
2. In an area officially designated as a combat zone/area of operations.
That sounds about right. One thing is for sure, if you were there you will not forget. I'll not forget the friends I lost. No embellishment required.
Who qualifies as a combat veteran?
Who qualifies as a combat veteran?
How Can I Tell if I'm a Combat Veteran?
Eligibility Explained
The VA lists several different ways in which a Veteran can prove he or she was in combat:
If you received a combat service medal.
If you received hostile fire pay, imminent danger pay, or tax benefits.
If you received military service documentation that documents combat theater.
Who qualifies as a combat veteran?
How Can I Tell if I'm a Combat Veteran?
Eligibility Explained
The VA lists several different ways in which a Veteran can prove he or she was in combat:
If you received a combat service medal.
If you received hostile fire pay, imminent danger pay, or tax benefits.
If you received military service documentation that documents combat theater.
gjgalligan
Member
Disclaimer: I never was in the service.
To me a combat veteran is somebody that was in combat. IE: bullets flying, bombs dropping.
I know a couple of guys that in the service during Viet Nam but never went to Nam. I do not consider them a "combat veteran" but they could have been. Just depends on where they were deployed to.
To me a combat veteran is somebody that was in combat. IE: bullets flying, bombs dropping.
I know a couple of guys that in the service during Viet Nam but never went to Nam. I do not consider them a "combat veteran" but they could have been. Just depends on where they were deployed to.
They are not. I maintained bombers in tankers at three bases in Thailand, Guam, and Okinawa, all "in direct support" of the VN combat, yet I am not a "combat" vet. Wasn't "in country," didn't receive combat/hazardous duty pay, etc. But I do qualify as a VN Vet for my numerous supporting tours. I consider myself a SEA Vet.
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The Brits have an old saying, " to see the elephant". By chance one can not figure it out look it up. I wear a RVN Veterans hat few times a week and when I asked for the Veterans discount the girl asked to see my ID. She said she has seen several guys wearing the hat but were not there. I told her" , "just send them to the local VFW"…….
LoboGunLeather
US Veteran
It may help to consider the structure and functions of the military services as a team. For every grunt with a rifle, every pilot in the cockpit, and every sailor in dangerous waters there must always be another dozen or more personnel in support roles to keep the mission going. Logistics (transportation, food, fuel, clothing, ammunition, everything necessary for operations and contingencies), medical services, training, planning, intelligence gathering and analysis, communications; an endless list of essentials.
This is not to take anything away from the people at the sharp end of the stick, only to point out that the entire team is necessary to get the point where it needs to be, when it needs to be there, properly trained, properly equipped, and physically prepared to deliver the punch.
During my 21 months in Vietnam I knew cooks, clerks, and mechanics with Purple Hearts and combat valor awards, I saw unarmed medics run or crawl through small arms fire to assist wounded soldiers, I saw military police man the bunker line and engage attacking forces, and I saw supposedly secure areas (usually considered to be plum assignments) struck with devastating rocket artillery barrages with high casualty rates.
Every position within a combat theater, and every function in support of theater operations, is essential to the effort and always at risk of becoming the next target.
My 2 cents worth.
This is not to take anything away from the people at the sharp end of the stick, only to point out that the entire team is necessary to get the point where it needs to be, when it needs to be there, properly trained, properly equipped, and physically prepared to deliver the punch.
During my 21 months in Vietnam I knew cooks, clerks, and mechanics with Purple Hearts and combat valor awards, I saw unarmed medics run or crawl through small arms fire to assist wounded soldiers, I saw military police man the bunker line and engage attacking forces, and I saw supposedly secure areas (usually considered to be plum assignments) struck with devastating rocket artillery barrages with high casualty rates.
Every position within a combat theater, and every function in support of theater operations, is essential to the effort and always at risk of becoming the next target.
My 2 cents worth.
sigp220.45
US Veteran
I did eight years in the Air Force. The only combat I saw was wrestling drunk drivers and abusive spouses and breaking up fights at the club. My DD-214 says I "deployed in Support of Operation Desert Shield/Storm" but I actually went to Puerto Rico! No combat there. I don't consider myself a combat veteran in the least of course.
deadin
US Veteran
I was stationed on a carrier (not aircrew) that flew combat missions into Laos, etc. I do not consider myself a combat vet.
On 2 May 2005, the Chief of Staff of the U.S. Army (CSA) approved the creation of the CAB to provide special recognition to U.S. soldiers who personally engaged, or are engaged by, the enemy.[3] The CAB is intended to serve as a companion to the Combat Infantryman Badge (CIB) and Combat Medical Badge (CMB) and was created to recognize the greatly expanded role of non-infantry soldiers in active, ground combat.[4]
U.S. Army infantrymen or special forces soldiers with the rank of colonel or below and who are a member of a brigade-sized or smaller infantry or special forces unit, receive the Combat Infantryman Badge (CIB) instead of the CAB.
CIB, posted in honor of Pop..and all the rest who " Saw the Elephant "
U.S. Army infantrymen or special forces soldiers with the rank of colonel or below and who are a member of a brigade-sized or smaller infantry or special forces unit, receive the Combat Infantryman Badge (CIB) instead of the CAB.
CIB, posted in honor of Pop..and all the rest who " Saw the Elephant "
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Jeff423
US Veteran
I spent 9 months on a carrier off the coast of N. Vietnam (Yankee Station). We received "hostile fire" pay (and free postage) and I got hazardous duty pay because I worked on the flight deck but I consider my self a Vietnam Veteran, but not a combat veteran. The pilots and aircrew however, were.
I think you would have to have someone shooing at you in a
combat theatre.
combat theatre.
Agree-Ticonderoga
Did two 9 month cruises '65-'67. Dixie and Yankee stations. No one shot at me and I did not shoot at anyone, but I helped the ship complete its missions. I agree with your statement.
Did two 9 month cruises '65-'67. Dixie and Yankee stations. No one shot at me and I did not shoot at anyone, but I helped the ship complete its missions. I agree with your statement.
BLACKHAWKNJ
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The Marines had (still do ?) a Combat Action Badge, the Marine Corps doctrine in the 60s was that every Marine was a rifleman first and back then Marines went through Infantry Training regiment after finishing Boot
Camp. There have been various attempts over the years to introduce a Combat Armor and Combat Artilleryman's badge in the Army, all have been rejected. One Vietnam vet MP told me his platoon regularly accompanied the grunts as POW handlers, they were put in for the CIB-and turned down. Many rear echelon and base camp types said they endured their share of shellings, rocket attacks, sapper attacks but received no recognition. Paratroopers who landed under fire were entitled to wear a star on their wings. IIRC for Vietnam the CIB was awarded only after 30 days in an infantry unit.
Camp. There have been various attempts over the years to introduce a Combat Armor and Combat Artilleryman's badge in the Army, all have been rejected. One Vietnam vet MP told me his platoon regularly accompanied the grunts as POW handlers, they were put in for the CIB-and turned down. Many rear echelon and base camp types said they endured their share of shellings, rocket attacks, sapper attacks but received no recognition. Paratroopers who landed under fire were entitled to wear a star on their wings. IIRC for Vietnam the CIB was awarded only after 30 days in an infantry unit.
Folks have been self-identifying as combat vets for decades - Most of the time, an empty can makes the most noise and are fairly easy to ID.
Personally, I'm a nobody, I don't claim to be anything and I don't care what others do or say as long as it doesn't affect me.
I've known a guy for decades who claims to be a Vietnam era SEAL. He owns a store and I've done business with him, but I've had my doubts about him and his stories. He's a SEAL, then UDT, then SEAL and UDT and bla, bla, bla,.. Then he showed be pictures of himself supposedly after Vietnam when he said was a 1%er biker. Wearing a leather vest and a Harley T-shirt doesn't make one a biker. In the picture, he had the physique of an anorexic girl, ashtray glasses and he's about 5'5", at best. SEAL!? Yeah, sure.
I was there when an ACTUAL Vietnam era SEAL came in introduced himself and started talking and asking questions. I sat down and listened.
Questions, like what BUDs class were you in?
Did you know so and so, he was in your class or he's in the class after yours?
Where were you at?
What operations were you on?
The answers/body language are predictable from somebody who is a poser. He's a poser.
Anyway, I'm a nobody, but whatever.
Personally, I'm a nobody, I don't claim to be anything and I don't care what others do or say as long as it doesn't affect me.
I've known a guy for decades who claims to be a Vietnam era SEAL. He owns a store and I've done business with him, but I've had my doubts about him and his stories. He's a SEAL, then UDT, then SEAL and UDT and bla, bla, bla,.. Then he showed be pictures of himself supposedly after Vietnam when he said was a 1%er biker. Wearing a leather vest and a Harley T-shirt doesn't make one a biker. In the picture, he had the physique of an anorexic girl, ashtray glasses and he's about 5'5", at best. SEAL!? Yeah, sure.
I was there when an ACTUAL Vietnam era SEAL came in introduced himself and started talking and asking questions. I sat down and listened.
Questions, like what BUDs class were you in?
Did you know so and so, he was in your class or he's in the class after yours?
Where were you at?
What operations were you on?
The answers/body language are predictable from somebody who is a poser. He's a poser.
Anyway, I'm a nobody, but whatever.
I have run into several people who claimed to be Vietnam helicopter pilots. Before I ask where they were stationed I ask them what flight school class they graduated from. EVERYBODY remembers their class number. It is forever etched into your brain. Those that say they don't remember did NOT do it. It's not really funny watching someone tap dance around their lie. It's pathetic.
The Naval Service awards the Combat Action Ribbon (CAR)
to Navy and Marine Corps personnel who render satisfactory performance under enemy fire while actively participating in a ground or surface engagement. The ribbon is also presented to Coast Guard members who are mobilized under U.S. Navy control or command.
Attachments
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I am just a veteran, not a combat veteran.
I was stationed at Osan AB Korea, 1978-81 as Security Police K-9 Handler. Worked the perimeter duty, base police, and Military Customs.
Since technically the Korean War has never ended, still just an armistice, no peace agreement, I received the Korean Defense medal.
Now my father who received the same medal for service in Korea 1951-53 is a combat veteran.
I was stationed at Osan AB Korea, 1978-81 as Security Police K-9 Handler. Worked the perimeter duty, base police, and Military Customs.
Since technically the Korean War has never ended, still just an armistice, no peace agreement, I received the Korean Defense medal.
Now my father who received the same medal for service in Korea 1951-53 is a combat veteran.
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Pisgah
Member
My definition differs from that of the Navy, which calls my absolutely n'er-do-well ex-brother-in-law a "combat vet" for serving as a Clerk Typist on a destroyer that never got closer than 250 miles to the Vietnam coast, never suffered any crisis that wasn't a drill or a paper cut......
I wish my dad were still around to comment. He earned his CIB as a 20-year-old platoon sergeant crossing the Rhine in 1945.
I wish my dad were still around to comment. He earned his CIB as a 20-year-old platoon sergeant crossing the Rhine in 1945.
LoboGunLeather
US Veteran
On 2 May 2005, the Chief of Staff of the U.S. Army (CSA) approved the creation of the CAB to provide special recognition to U.S. soldiers who personally engaged, or are engaged by, the enemy.[3] The CAB is intended to serve as a companion to the Combat Infantryman Badge (CIB) and Combat Medical Badge (CMB) and was created to recognize the greatly expanded role of non-infantry soldiers in active, ground combat.[4]
U.S. Army infantrymen or special forces soldiers with the rank of colonel or below and who are a member of a brigade-sized or smaller infantry or special forces unit, receive the Combat Infantryman Badge (CIB) instead of the CAB.
CIB, posted in honor of Pop..and all the rest who " Saw the Elephant "
Excellent post! For those of us who served in infantry units in combat and received the CIB, it was a source of pride that sometimes bordered on arrogance. Many of us did not wear any other decorations unless specifically ordered to do so; the Combat Infantryman Badge says everything that needs to be said, long before the trite jingo "been there, done that" came along.
Only one way to earn it.
I had to deal with a situation going the other way. For the record, I was never in the Armed Forces either.
I was at a fast food place ordering lunch including coffee. I was wearing some sort of service related wristband or bracelet. I'm the right age to have been a Vietnam era veteran. The nice young man at the cash register said we give free coffee to veterans. I told him that I was never in the service . I might have told him my grandfather served in World War I. He then said he would pay for my coffee, either in recognition of my grandfather's service or my support for the military. I don't want even an accidental bestowing of valor that I never earned.
I was at a fast food place ordering lunch including coffee. I was wearing some sort of service related wristband or bracelet. I'm the right age to have been a Vietnam era veteran. The nice young man at the cash register said we give free coffee to veterans. I told him that I was never in the service . I might have told him my grandfather served in World War I. He then said he would pay for my coffee, either in recognition of my grandfather's service or my support for the military. I don't want even an accidental bestowing of valor that I never earned.
My uncle was a Cpl. in the Second Armored Division during WWII. His fruit salad wasn't as impressive as Audie Murphy's, but it did have a CIB and a purple ribbon. He qualified.
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To be an Actual Vietnam Veteran one had to have Boots On The Ground.
By chance one does not know what color the VC & NVA tracers were, never got knocked down or had to sit down from an ARC Light strike ,never saw the flame from a 122 mm rocket, never had to run to a bunker due to incoming, heard/ saw ammo dump blowing up, saw smelled a POL blowing up, never smelled Nouc Maum , saw shot dead dogs being drug to cook I don't know what to say…..
By chance one does not know what color the VC & NVA tracers were, never got knocked down or had to sit down from an ARC Light strike ,never saw the flame from a 122 mm rocket, never had to run to a bunker due to incoming, heard/ saw ammo dump blowing up, saw smelled a POL blowing up, never smelled Nouc Maum , saw shot dead dogs being drug to cook I don't know what to say…..
LoboGunLeather
US Veteran
Nuoc mam is going too far. That stuff will gag a maggot, drop strong men to their knees from 50 yards downwind. Vietnamese people grow up with this as a part of their daily diet, perhaps even a delicacy to be savored and enjoyed.
For the uninitiated, nuoc mam is a very common condiment throughout Vietnam. Probably as many recipes and methods as there are villages and tribes, but the primary ingredients are fish heads and entrails combined with veggies, herbs and spices in an earthen crock, buried on the sunny slope of a hill and left to ferment for months. Usually served over rice or noodles, whatever is making the meal of the day.
Predictably, like everything else we consume the essence becomes part of our bodies and is exuded through the pores of the skin as a distinctive bodily odor.
The coastal areas of Vietnam have very active fishing industries, and I suppose some trade takes place with outlying areas. In much of the country the source of fish is the rice paddies, commonly used for human waste disposal as fertilizer.
Tourists may wish to exercise some restraint in their culinary adventures while in Vietnam.
OP
Interesting opinions here.
I just don't think ground pounders are the only ones who see combat.
Does the NGFS of the big "J" on the Ho Chi Minh trail count as combat?
Maybe by some here but they did move the trail further in by 50 miles!
And I do know of one DD that took on NVA artillery and did take a hit on mount 53 killing some sailors....
Was that combat? I think so......
I just don't think ground pounders are the only ones who see combat.
Does the NGFS of the big "J" on the Ho Chi Minh trail count as combat?
Maybe by some here but they did move the trail further in by 50 miles!
And I do know of one DD that took on NVA artillery and did take a hit on mount 53 killing some sailors....
Was that combat? I think so......
riverrat38
US Veteran
......"fish heads and entrails combined with veggies, herbs and spices in an earthen crock, buried on the sunny slope of a hill and left to ferment for months....."
Sounds like Viet Nam Haggis!
73,
Rick
Sounds like Viet Nam Haggis!
73,
Rick
Dad spent a year and a half on the USS Rathburne in WWII. Shelled the beaches at Leyte Gulf. Took a kamikaze thru the front of the ship.
Uncle landed with the 4th Marines on Tinian, Sai Pan, Roi Namur and Iwo Jima. Left Iwo with mortar shrapnel in his back.
Cousin spent 12 months in the jungle in Vietnam.
Son spent a a year hanging out of the open door of a Chinook helicopter behind a machine gun, flying missions in Iraq.
Those are combat vet. Not minimizing the effort of others who supported. but combat vet seems to be very clear.
I was 18 in 1973 and my government didn't call me. I am forever grateful to those it did, even if they did not end up directly in harms way.
I eat dinner each month with three Vietnam vets. When we get up to pay, they get the veteran discount. I make sure the cashier knows that I did not earn that and don't take it.
Uncle landed with the 4th Marines on Tinian, Sai Pan, Roi Namur and Iwo Jima. Left Iwo with mortar shrapnel in his back.
Cousin spent 12 months in the jungle in Vietnam.
Son spent a a year hanging out of the open door of a Chinook helicopter behind a machine gun, flying missions in Iraq.
Those are combat vet. Not minimizing the effort of others who supported. but combat vet seems to be very clear.
I was 18 in 1973 and my government didn't call me. I am forever grateful to those it did, even if they did not end up directly in harms way.
I eat dinner each month with three Vietnam vets. When we get up to pay, they get the veteran discount. I make sure the cashier knows that I did not earn that and don't take it.
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BTW, their tracers were green. 12.7 tracers look like big green footballs when they are bouncing past you.
BLACKHAWKNJ
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Plenty of frauds and poseurs within the military. In 1970 an Assistant Division Commander of the 1st Cav received the Silver Star for a fictitious event. The clerk was told to write up the citation, when he protested he was told to shut up and do as he was told. He took another citation, changed names, place names, dates. On the day the supposed act of valor took place, that general was not in-country. That led to a torrent of allegations of unearned and undeserved awards.
With the War on Terror having made military service fashionable again and a resume enhancer all sorts of attempts by people to pass themselves off as "combat vets". There was that Senator Harkins from Iowa, he flew damaged planes from Vietnam to Japan for repair, tried to claim he was a Vietnam vet. Jesse Ventura made a big deal of his being a Navy SEAL, finally admitted he had never been in combat.
With the War on Terror having made military service fashionable again and a resume enhancer all sorts of attempts by people to pass themselves off as "combat vets". There was that Senator Harkins from Iowa, he flew damaged planes from Vietnam to Japan for repair, tried to claim he was a Vietnam vet. Jesse Ventura made a big deal of his being a Navy SEAL, finally admitted he had never been in combat.
