Some more 357 mag. questions.

[HAWKEYE10]

I am loading some 357 mag bullets and I am concerned about the over all length. I am shooting these in a revolver so it might not make any difference. My Lyman hand loading book says the over all length for a 158 grain cast bullet is 1.590. I am seating and crimping the bullet in the crimping groove and getting an over all length of 1.624. The bullet isn't sticking out the end of the cylinder. So will this be okay or not? Here is a link to the bullet that I am using. Don

http://www.missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=41&category=5&secondary=10&keywords=

 

[sjmjax]

If you're using the crimping groove, you're probably just fine.

Keep in mind that the reloading information was probably for a very specific brand bullet.

Different manufacturers of the same basic bullet, say a 158 grain SWC, can have a very different ogive profile & OAL as well as a very different balance between amount of lead in the nose and that in the base.

Nice thing about revolvers & the classic high volume cartridges is that they safely allow much more variation in these details for experimentation than semi-autos.

 

[Rule3]

As sjmjax stated.If you are in the groove you are good to go. The manuals also use a trimmed to length brass which is a tad shorter than max length of brass, plus a different bullet.

I use the same bullet and do not think I ever measured them

Hold on I will be right back................

Mine are around 1.602 or so.

When crimped the edge of the brass should be right up to the top of the groove touching the bullet. Shouldn't a fingernail of gap.

 

[HAWKEYE10]

Thanks guys. Now back to the reloading bench. Don

 

[calmex]

I believe the 1.590 LOA was based on the length of the Model 27 cylinders. K-frame magnums have longer cylinders than the N-frame guns and I can't tell you what an L-frame cylinder is like because I don't have one handy.

In my Pre-war 27, if I load longer than 1.6 I am right at the end of the cylinder. Drop the same load into my friend's Model 19 cylinder and there's room to spare.

 

[gwpercle]

Hawkeye,
The beauty of reloading for a revolver is if it will fit into the cylinder and the bullet doesn't protrude out the end it is o.k., dont worry about measurements or overall length.
Crimp in the crimp groove or cannulure and slip it into the chamber, if it fits load up the rest,,, if it doesn,t then you need to drop back and punt. A lot of manufacturers and mould makers give recomendations as to what rounds thier bullets are suitable for. I've never had any problems with 357 mag. bullets not chambering. Dont drive those bevel base bullets too fast, they tend to give best accuracy below 1,000 fps. I get best results 800 to 900 fps

gary

 

[HAWKEYE10]

I believe the 1.590 LOA was based on the length of the Model 27 cylinders. K-frame magnums have longer cylinders than the N-frame guns and I can't tell you what an L-frame cylinder is like because I don't have one handy.

In my Pre-war 27, if I load longer than 1.6 I am right at the end of the cylinder. Drop the same load into my friend's Model 19 cylinder and there's room to spare.

I didn't know that about the cylinders. It's good to learn something new. Thanks Don

 

[Forrest r]

L-frame cylinders are 1.625", at least that's what my 586-1 just measured.

I don't know if I'd want to run those bullets in the 800 to 900 fps range because of the 18bhn. That's a pretty hard bullet with a good design; it has a generous grease groove & large drive bands.

Let us know what you come up with.

 

[Terry C]

Recessed cyl. from 66 no-dash just measured 1.675".

Subtracting 0.060" for the rim gives 1.615" for comparison to non-recessed K-frame cylinders.

OAL includes the rim so 1.624" is GTG with room to spare.

 

[rwsmith]

Be much more concerned

Revolvers are forgiving in OAL but the thing to worry about is setting bullets too DEEP, which causes pressure spikes that can be damaging.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

The OAL listed in a load manual or ammo recipe is useless unless you are using the same exact bullet they use and you trim the brass to the length they list.

Bullets with a cannelure are meant to be crimped in that cannelure so the OAL is set by the bullet manufacturer and is correct for that bullet.

 

[tappedandtagged]

I load that same bullet over a hefty dose of AA 9. I seat to the crimp groove and thats it. I've never once checked the OAL of the finished product.

 

[cp1969]

Crimping in the crimp groove doesn't always guarantee that you're OK.

Here's an example: Seat the Lyman 358429 in the crimp groove and the round is too long for N-frame Smiths and the Colt Python. Works OK in L, K and J frame .357 Smiths, though, at least in the ones I've tried.

 

[Nevada Ed]

The Lyman #358428, 170gr lead bullet was designed as a ..........
rifle hunting bullet when it was designed for the 357 magnum, for better penetratin and energys over the lighter 158 gr bullets,of the day,used in revolvers.

 

[stevehart3578]

I had this discussion with a so-called "reloading expert" at one of my local gun stores. As we all know components can be hard to find right now, so when I couldn't find the LSWC bullets I normally buy he tried to sell me what he had available. They were a version of the Keith 170 gr bullet. I told him that they were too long for my N frames but would work on my L and K frames. I didn't want them because I didn't want to crimp over the forward driving band or get them mixed in with my other rounds. He gave me a look that was insulting and then proceeded to give me the "I have been reloading for 30 years and never heard of that BS before" speech. He then called his buddy over and they had a big laugh. We should start a new thread strictly about jerks that work at gun stores.
P.S. The 170 gr Keiths make great 38/44 loads over 14 gr of 2400.

 

[cp1969]

I had this discussion with a so-called "reloading expert" at one of my local gun stores. As we all know components can be hard to find right now, so when I couldn't find the LSWC bullets I normally buy he tried to sell me what he had available. They were a version of the Keith 170 gr bullet. I told him that they were too long for my N frames but would work on my L and K frames. I didn't want them because I didn't want to crimp over the forward driving band or get them mixed in with my other rounds. He gave me a look that was insulting and then proceeded to give me the "I have been reloading for 30 years and never heard of that BS before" speech. He then called his buddy over and they had a big laugh. We should start a new thread strictly about jerks that work at gun stores.
P.S. The 170 gr Keiths make great 38/44 loads over 14 gr of 2400.

That problem with the 358429 and N frame Smiths and Pythons has been documented for decades. You were dealing with ignorant clowns. Shop elsewhere; if they're that uniformed on this issue, you can bet they're equally uniformed on most other issues as well.

 

[Nevada Ed]

OAl 1.59 in a Magnum.................

I load a 158gr LRN at the OAL of 1.55 in my mod. 49, 38 spl J frame ,with room to spare .......................