sipowicz
Member
I would guess topping off is not really an issue for most CCWers....
Speed Loader vs Strips
- Thread starter ghostrider_23
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I would guess topping off is not really an issue for most CCWers....
David Sinko
Member
My small .38 is carried only as a backup to the primary. I carry a speed strip and two of those cartridges are shot cartridges. I find myself sometimes having to dispatch sick skunks and other rodents in the city and the speed strip is basically a cartridge organizer for me.
I prefer to spend my time practicing to be able to hit what I'm shooting at. And if you aren't reloading behind cover you'll likely be shot no matter which loader you're using.
Dave Sinko
I prefer to spend my time practicing to be able to hit what I'm shooting at. And if you aren't reloading behind cover you'll likely be shot no matter which loader you're using.
Dave Sinko
Double-O-Dave
US Veteran
Seems to me that a belt loop cartridge slide would be just as fast, if not faster than a speed strip. Galco, among others, makes the 2x2x2 covered belt slide that is unobtrusive and works very well. Back in the day when the FBI issued the Model 13, I believe they taught a tactic to reload 2 rounds and get back into the fight. Another advantage of the Galco 2x slide is that it will hold calibers other than the .38/.357. I'd be interested in the thoughts and opinions of others on this.
Regards,
Dave
Regards,
Dave
wjh2657
Member
Speed strips. I carry J-Frames exclusively and every combination of grips I have tried gets hung up on Speed Loader in a hurry. Yes I have tried all of the different types of speed loaders too. If the grip fits my hand right, it intereferes with a speed loader. The grips that work with speed loaders offer little grip control for me. Can't say much about other size revolvers.
stratman
Member
Just my 2 cents worth here, but I still have nightmares about a bad night back in 1976. Partner had been shot, was trying to get with him and return fire. When the BG finally ran I had returned fire and had 1 left in my 28. This was pre-speed loader and I was using strips.
I can think of no training I ever had that prepared me for a reload under those conditions. I never shot less than "Master" when qualifying, but no one was shooting at me then either.I went to speed loaders shortly thereafter and carried them until we converted to Sigs in 86. I still carry a 36 today with a speed loader.
I can think of no training I ever had that prepared me for a reload under those conditions. I never shot less than "Master" when qualifying, but no one was shooting at me then either.I went to speed loaders shortly thereafter and carried them until we converted to Sigs in 86. I still carry a 36 today with a speed loader.
My preferred j frame reload is a .32 Seecamp. Not as much punch as the short barrel .357's, but way faster. If the Seecamp won't fly, I use a $5 Sears Craftsman cell phone holder that neatly stashes 2 speed loaders. I had to put a little piece of black material in the bottom of the cell phone pouch where the corners are open so those shiny hollowpoints wouldn't peek out if my shirt lifted up.
Wrenches! Because if you can reload while dodging a wrench ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0iXP9yoc4VY
Sledgehammer
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SRC - that Ritz camera case is a great idea!
Gearhead Jim
Member
Actual testing showed me some surprises:
1. A speed loader in my Dockers pocket (along with the 340PD in UM pocket holster) is not more obvious than a speed strip.
2. But a speed strip is just as fast, for me, as a speed loader. But
3. In darkness or other situation where I can't see the gun, the speed strip is hopeless after the first two rounds; regardless of how many rds I have in the strip or how they are arranged.
4. The Bantam grips on my 340PD don't exactly block the speed loader, but they tend to cause the cartridges to go in at a slight angle and the case mouths badly hang up on the edge of the chamber. Chamfering is strongly recommended.
1. A speed loader in my Dockers pocket (along with the 340PD in UM pocket holster) is not more obvious than a speed strip.
2. But a speed strip is just as fast, for me, as a speed loader. But
3. In darkness or other situation where I can't see the gun, the speed strip is hopeless after the first two rounds; regardless of how many rds I have in the strip or how they are arranged.
4. The Bantam grips on my 340PD don't exactly block the speed loader, but they tend to cause the cartridges to go in at a slight angle and the case mouths badly hang up on the edge of the chamber. Chamfering is strongly recommended.
I don't think this was addressed, so I thought I'd try. Understand that I am by no means an expert on revolver tactics.
If you tap up slightly on the extractor rod while the muzzle is pointed towards the ground, the unspent cartridges will slide back into the cylinders while the spent cartridges will stay out. You then just remove the spent cartridges and insert new ammo.
The brass casings expand once fired and will not slide back down into the cylinders as easily. It may just be the heat or the detonation of the gunpowder that does it, I'm not sure which one.
SleepyDragonfly
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I carry a k32 s&w long. My "speed strip" is a modified PT138 clip. I closed the top a bit to make contact on the brass full length. It carries 12 rounds.
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Moon clips...
Moon clips are fastest and more trim than speed loaders.
Moon clips are fastest and more trim than speed loaders.
DD357
Member
Speed loaders for me, I don't have a problem carrying them and I am much faster with them.
UncleEd
Member
Read through all the answers and the underlying premise is that you'll need a full reload.
With a speed strip getting two into a J-frame is fairly easy
and then close the cylinder.
Not a perfect solution in a dire moment but better than fumbling to get all five chambers charged whether speed strip or speed loader.
With a speed strip getting two into a J-frame is fairly easy
and then close the cylinder.
Not a perfect solution in a dire moment but better than fumbling to get all five chambers charged whether speed strip or speed loader.
A few thoughts:
1) If you can load a revolver faster with a speed strip than you can with a speed loader, you need to seriously work on your speed loading technique. I have a post here recently in another thread discussing the traditional, FBI, Universal and Stress Fire methods of reloading with a speed loader.
You might want to do a little research on the topic. It's hard to beat the FBI reload for speed, but if you've got a short barrel revolver with a shorter than standard ejector rod, and the cases for your self defense loads stick bit in the chamber you'll want to focus on the Stress Fire reload.
2) There are better options for concealed carry of a speed loader than the traditional police duty belt inspired pouch.
There are a couple models that slip over the belt, so that only 2-3 rounds extend outside the belt.
This one is made by Wild Bill's Concealment in Garner NC for the J-frame revolvers. You can carry it with either 2 or 3 rounds inside the belt:
3) I shot in a local practical pistol match this week, geared toward the casual concealed carry shooter - mostly a local concealed carry instructor trying to get concealed carry permit holders to shoot more under a little stress and time pressure in closer to real world conditions. To add a little challenge I shot my Model 13 with +P loads. It's a challenge in a stage with a long course of fire geared toward high capacity semi-autos.
I recommend that kind of shooting if you plan to carry a revolver for concealed carry as it will get you thinking about what might be the best reload strategy for the situation.
4) The concept of lifting the ejector slightly to lift the fired rounds, in hopes that they'll stick up so you can remove them, and then reload the empty chambers with a speed strip is not the most well thought out idea I've ever heard. I'm trying to be kind here.
When you lift the cartridges with the ejector rod in this manner you run the risk that one of the rounds will drop down under the ejector star, which will a) prevent the cylinder from closing again, and b) will be a real mother of a jam to clear under stress when your fine motor skills are toast.
Try doing it quickly standing still, then try to do it while running toward cover.
Then try doing it in a hurry while running toward cover while keeping your head up and your eyes on the assailant(s).
You'll probably conclude that it is a total non-starter of an idea.
5) The choice when confronted with the eventual need to reload is often not how many to reload, but when. Consider for a minute that you've engaged one assailant and you're moving toward cover to engage another. You obviously fired 3-4 shots and you have 1 or 2 rounds left in your revolver. Do you want to eject them while you're moving to cover and have the time, or wait until you fired again, and take the chance of not having enough rounds left to finish the sight.
One round versus two might make a difference, particularly depending on the circumstances, how many more rounds you have and how many more you think you'll need, since you'll be leaving 1 or 2 rounds of your limited supply on the ground.
It's also going to depend on how well trained you are in using a speed loader. If you've good with the FBI, Universal or Stress Fire reloads, doing it on the move isn't an issue and it can be done by feel with your eyes still in the fight.
6) Loading two rounds with a speed strip and getting back in the fight is better than nothing, I suppose, but it takes as much time as reloading all 5 or 6 chambers with a speed loader. It also has the added problem that you have to index the rounds you just loaded so that they'll be ready to fire the next two times you pull the trigger. It's hard to do that by feel so you'll be head down and unaware while you're doing it.
1) If you can load a revolver faster with a speed strip than you can with a speed loader, you need to seriously work on your speed loading technique. I have a post here recently in another thread discussing the traditional, FBI, Universal and Stress Fire methods of reloading with a speed loader.
You might want to do a little research on the topic. It's hard to beat the FBI reload for speed, but if you've got a short barrel revolver with a shorter than standard ejector rod, and the cases for your self defense loads stick bit in the chamber you'll want to focus on the Stress Fire reload.
2) There are better options for concealed carry of a speed loader than the traditional police duty belt inspired pouch.
There are a couple models that slip over the belt, so that only 2-3 rounds extend outside the belt.
This one is made by Wild Bill's Concealment in Garner NC for the J-frame revolvers. You can carry it with either 2 or 3 rounds inside the belt:
3) I shot in a local practical pistol match this week, geared toward the casual concealed carry shooter - mostly a local concealed carry instructor trying to get concealed carry permit holders to shoot more under a little stress and time pressure in closer to real world conditions. To add a little challenge I shot my Model 13 with +P loads. It's a challenge in a stage with a long course of fire geared toward high capacity semi-autos.
I recommend that kind of shooting if you plan to carry a revolver for concealed carry as it will get you thinking about what might be the best reload strategy for the situation.
4) The concept of lifting the ejector slightly to lift the fired rounds, in hopes that they'll stick up so you can remove them, and then reload the empty chambers with a speed strip is not the most well thought out idea I've ever heard. I'm trying to be kind here.
When you lift the cartridges with the ejector rod in this manner you run the risk that one of the rounds will drop down under the ejector star, which will a) prevent the cylinder from closing again, and b) will be a real mother of a jam to clear under stress when your fine motor skills are toast.
Try doing it quickly standing still, then try to do it while running toward cover.
Then try doing it in a hurry while running toward cover while keeping your head up and your eyes on the assailant(s).
You'll probably conclude that it is a total non-starter of an idea.
5) The choice when confronted with the eventual need to reload is often not how many to reload, but when. Consider for a minute that you've engaged one assailant and you're moving toward cover to engage another. You obviously fired 3-4 shots and you have 1 or 2 rounds left in your revolver. Do you want to eject them while you're moving to cover and have the time, or wait until you fired again, and take the chance of not having enough rounds left to finish the sight.
One round versus two might make a difference, particularly depending on the circumstances, how many more rounds you have and how many more you think you'll need, since you'll be leaving 1 or 2 rounds of your limited supply on the ground.
It's also going to depend on how well trained you are in using a speed loader. If you've good with the FBI, Universal or Stress Fire reloads, doing it on the move isn't an issue and it can be done by feel with your eyes still in the fight.
6) Loading two rounds with a speed strip and getting back in the fight is better than nothing, I suppose, but it takes as much time as reloading all 5 or 6 chambers with a speed loader. It also has the added problem that you have to index the rounds you just loaded so that they'll be ready to fire the next two times you pull the trigger. It's hard to do that by feel so you'll be head down and unaware while you're doing it.
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QUOTE: 4) The concept of lifting the ejector slightly to lift the fired rounds, in hopes that they'll stick up so you can remove them, and then reload the empty chambers with a speed strip is not the most well thought out idea I've ever heard. I'm trying to be kind here.
Yet, that is how we trained pre-speedloaders (Yes, I'm aware of the curiosities from the 19th and early 20th centuries - they existed but weren't readily available or authorized). In fact, it was part of our qualification course which included 2 stages in which a tactical reload of 2 rounds was required. We practiced, and practiced eyes on the target, and practiced in the dark until it was second nature.
All the failures you describe can and do also happen while ejecting an entire cylinder of empties if you don't get the gun completely inverted before hitting the ejector rod.
True enough all those fine motor skills degrade under stress...unless you never had them because they were too much trouble to learn.
After reading all of the varied experiences with both products (and that truly innovative use of a semi-auto magazine) it seems that the first rule of reloading is have a reload.
Yet, that is how we trained pre-speedloaders (Yes, I'm aware of the curiosities from the 19th and early 20th centuries - they existed but weren't readily available or authorized). In fact, it was part of our qualification course which included 2 stages in which a tactical reload of 2 rounds was required. We practiced, and practiced eyes on the target, and practiced in the dark until it was second nature.
All the failures you describe can and do also happen while ejecting an entire cylinder of empties if you don't get the gun completely inverted before hitting the ejector rod.
True enough all those fine motor skills degrade under stress...unless you never had them because they were too much trouble to learn.
After reading all of the varied experiences with both products (and that truly innovative use of a semi-auto magazine) it seems that the first rule of reloading is have a reload.
AZretired
Member
Old thread! But I prefer speed strips. I only carry concealed and strips carry better than speed loaders.
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Sent from my BNTV400 using Tapatalk
SleepyDragonfly
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Notice! This only works with wadcutters! Lead round nose are too long!I carry a k32 s&w long. My "speed strip" is a modified PT138 clip. I closed the top a bit to make contact on the brass full length. It carries 12 rounds.
