3leggeddog
Member
Hello all, I have a great 642 that I'd like to put in a spring kit to help out the trigger. Will doing so Void my warranty ? Please advise... Thanks
spring kit and warranty ?
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Hopper
Member
I don't believe this will void any warranty, but I'd appreciate others commenting to be sure. I put the Apex spring kit in my 640-3, and sent the revolver into S&W to correct an over-clocked barrel. I should have put the original springs back into the gun before I sent it back, but it was handled under warranty with no questions, and the Apex spring kit is still in the gun.
I've not encountered any literature from S&W or anecdotal claims that a spring swap voids warranty.
I also believe that per the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, S&W would have to prove that your spring swap caused whatever issue necessitated repair to void the warranty.
I also believe that per the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, S&W would have to prove that your spring swap caused whatever issue necessitated repair to void the warranty.
Morning 3leggeddog
That is a good question & probably varies on how the springs effect the guns function or how easy it is to tell they are not S&W parts.
I have sent a number of newer S&W's back for warranty repair, most with some sort of trigger work & spring work.
Most I have sent back had a 13 or 14 pound trigger return spring & all but 2 came back with the very same lower poundage trigger spring. 2 did come back with a new production spring & the lower poundage spring in the box that the gun was returned in. (none were refused for warranty work but none were sent in for a problem that weaker springs could have influenced).
I have also removed the lower poundage springs before sending a couple back if I thought the lower poundage springs could have been seen as causing or effecting the problem I sent the gun it for.
For example you don't want to send a Smith back for a trigger pull issue with non production trigger parts or non production springs.
I have also sent a few Smith's in with a recurved mainsprings. One came back with the same main spring & the other came back with a new main spring
but no recurved spring returned.
If you value the spring kit then you should probably remove it before sending the gun back.
You really should talk to Smith's customer reps before sending a gun back with non production parts in it to get their current take on spring kits vs warranty repair work.
Or, if any doubt, just remove the non production parts before sending the gun back.
So far every new purchase S&W I have sent back has been repaired under warranty with little issue. On a few it has taken more than one return trip to get it repaired though.
With Smith's current quality control I have pretty well resigned myself to having to use their warranty on about any new Smith I purchase so the day they start giving me grief on warranty repair is the day I will never buy another new Smith again.
Rpg
Member
Wolverine: sounds like you have had an inordinate amount of warrany work.
How many new purchase S &W's have you purchased? How many have gone back for warranty work ? What was the problem with each?
Based on your comment, sounds like a significant proportion of a large number of new firearms.
How many new purchase S &W's have you purchased? How many have gone back for warranty work ? What was the problem with each?
Based on your comment, sounds like a significant proportion of a large number of new firearms.
Morning Rpg
I would have to check my records to be sure but I think it's 11 newer S&W's that I have sent back in the last couple of years for warranty work. Some have gone back more than once so the total send-backs are quite a bit higher than 11. ( I have sent some back myself but a few were sent back to Smith by my local gun shop for me)
The only Smith (revolver) that I have bought in the last 2 year that hasn't gone back YET (again I would have to check my records to be sure) is my latest purchase 4" model 69 & that is going to be sent back at some time in the future due to a cylinder fit issue, a crown issue, & rather large cyl to barrel gap, & possibly a sight issue (gun shoots very high).
The worst part is I am a retired engineer with a lot of gunsmithing background so do most minor repairs myself. I only send back guns that need parts that I can't buy or repairs that would cost me more time & money than I am willing to give a gun covered under warranty.
Now, to be honest, I have sent a few Smiths back for cosmetic repairs that I would just have accepted on a cheaper $400.00 gun. But on an $800-$1,000 gun I expect decent quality & if not to my expectations I have no problem sending them back for quality issues that the gun shouldn't have left the factory with.
I have also sent a few Rugers back for the same reasons but a lot more S&W's have been returned per unit bought than any other gun purchased.
To me the very worst part is, that, prior to about 2000 or so I never had to send a Smith back for any reason (never). Now I "expect" to have to send every new Smith (revolver) I buy back to Smith at least once & maybe more than once.
BigMoneyGrip
Member
I think if I had to send that many guns back, I'd have to look for another manufacturer. Did you buy most of these sight unseen?
Morning BigMoneyGrip
That is a good observation. Only problem is, most of the guns I have bought from Smith lately are only offered by Smith.
Such as a 7 shot "L" frame sized 357 or a 5 shot "L" frame sized .44 mag.
If some other company (with better quality control) offered a better gun for my needs then I would never buy another Smith.
As it stands now it really isn't a big deal to send the guns back for warranty repair as I have lots of others to shoot while the gun is in for repair.
As to seeing before buying??-- Most I do see first, some I have a few choices so usually choose the best one cosmetically as mechanical issues are usually easier to repair than cosmetic issues.
On the last model 69 I bought I had 2 choices locally (if I wanted one before a couple of months passed). One had a decent trigger pull with a .009 cyl gap & tight cylinder (no end gap). The frame was really rough looking with big wowies in the frame where the ejector rod swung in & very uneven machining on the cylinder edges. Crown was also very burred up with lots of flashing & scratch (or something) in the rifling. It also had 2 cyl holes that my range rod wouldn't enter easily (showing a poor lock up position on those cyl holes). Those 2 holes also locked up very early & I could feel the extra drag in the double action trigger pull on those 2 holes.
The other was the 69 I bought-- It also had a very tight cylinder (as in 0 end play & too tight as it was wearing the frame at rear cyl contact), a crown about as bad as the other one I looked at, a piss poor trigger pull feel, a bad hammer drag on the L/H side of the frame cut out, & .010 cyl to barrel gap.
BUT, my range rod entered all cylinders so the lock up was in the correct place & the cosmetics were a lot better then the first one I looked at.
So I knew when buying it that it would eventually be going back to Smith (no big deal as I have the send-back procedure down to a Tee)
I shimmed the cyl crane so it now has .0015" cyl end play, shimmed the hammer over to the right .005" (it still lightly hits so I am eventually going to have to take a couple of thousandths off the R/H side of hammer hub & shim it over .007" or grind the frame cut out a little on the L/H side.
I shimmed the trigger with a .004" shim on each side (yep it was built with over .008" trigger side slop.
I also recurved the hammer spring & installed a 14# trigger return spring. I did just a LITTLE polishing on the trigger contact parts (very little, only polished where the contact was, not anywhere that didn't contact or rub).
I also had to install a shorter rear sight blade to get the POI anywhere near the POA at 25 yards. (gun actually needs a shorter rear sight blade yet)
So trigger pull is now at 7-3/4 pounds double action & 2-3/4 pounds single action & very smooth & crisp (actually a quite nice trigger now).
I also scraped the muzzle crown to remove the majority of the flashing & burrs (not great, but serviceable until I do send the gun back to Smith).
But the bottom line here is-- I shouldn't have had to do any of that work on a gun that lists for over $800.00.
Then I still end up with a glass-bead finished gun that shows every glove mark & rub mark that can't ever be rubbed out with a Scotch pad.
If I could have bought a 5 shot small frame .44 from Ruger I would l have but at the moment Smith was my only choice.
So even though it took a coupel of hours work & it will eventually have to go back to Smith I think it will make a good range gun & make a good woods carry gun (sure won't ever be a showpiece though)
I read so many of you that have sent in guns for problems to S&W. I've been buying and shooting S&W's for over 30 years and the only gun I ever sent back was a 686 for the recall. Maybe I've just been lucky.
