Square Deal B Owners

joespapa

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I have been reloading for a total of 4 years , all on a Lee classic Turret. I shoot competitively so am wanting to increase production and decrease fiddling . The Lee had been pretty good but the " safety prime" system has always been quirky. I can do about 100 rounds an hour and would love to be able to do 300. I only shoot and load .38 special for competition and would keep my Lee for my smaller volume stuff including rifle. Would love a 650 but need the ability to remove the press and store between sessions and space is limited. Due to the way the SDB has to be operated , i.e.; letting go of the handle, I am having doubts about the speed. Would really like to hear from folks that own both presses.
Am I crazy or what? If I buy a progressive, it will be auto-advance. Help!
 
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I have the Lee Classic Turret as well, and before installing the Safety Prime researched and watched several YouTube videos on set up. I've had no issues with mine and it works 100% for me. I don't shoot competition, so I don't need lots of ammo at a time. All progressive machines are limited to 100 primers at a time; and except for the XL650 with auto case feeder, you are limited to around 75-100 cases to the case feeders or cases in a bin/container to hand load such as the SDB.

I, too, was looking at the SDB, but with no case feeder wasn't sure about hand feeding the cases. I took a chance and ordered a Lee Pro 1000 to try; knowing full well what the issues would be. Surprisingly, I've had very few issues and it worked so well in 9mm, that I now have one in 4 calibers-38 Spec., 9mm, 40 S&W and 45 auto. I can comfortably do 300 rounds/hour in a steady, if not slower than usual pace. Steady and consistent seems to be the key; instead of fast and furious, LOL. And once started, you get a loaded round with each pull of the handle. 100 rounds in 15 minutes is the norm, then you have to replenish primers and cases. So 300 rounds/hour is very do-able.

I still have the "itch" for a Dillon, but for me it would have to be the XL650; as that to me would be a true progressive press. I looked at buying the SDB and adding the other 3 calibers I load as conversion kits, but I was able to buy all 4 Lee Pro 1000's and have dedicated machines for each caliber-for less money. But I also have a dedicated loading room also. The SDB is a space saver, but for only 1 caliber and if you could figure out your storage issue between sessions-I would get the XL650 if at all possible. Good luck and keep shooting :-)
 
2 Square Deal B's w/6 caliber changes here since 1989/90......Bolt 'em" down and load & load & load....Still putting out ammo today......

Didn't have to go to youtube/internet to find out how to fix it to run.......That's BS........You get what you pay for.

BTW...The 650 hadn't been invented yet.
 
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Whenever the discussion of reloading setups comes up, it reminds me of the "one-size-fits-all" phenomenon. One camera that can do close-ups, portraits, macros, AND landscapes. One gun that can be used for self-defense, every-day-carry, hunting, AND target shooting. One car that is sporty, fits a family, is affordable, AND is gas efficient. One...well, you get the idea.

The truth about the "one-size-fits-all" phenomenon is that it is almost always never true. One camera can't do all things perfectly, just as one car cannot fit all roles perfectly, or one gun cannot be right for every circumstance. In the "one-size-fits-all" phenomenon, compromise in some area is generally always required.

So for me, my reloading bench has, from left to right, a Lee Classic press, a Lee Classic Turret (with a couple of caliber changes - my concession to the one-size-fits-all phenomenon), a Dillon Square Deal B (again with a couple of caliber changes), and a Dillon XL650. (I didn't buy them all at once - actually, the 650 was my first press!) But I also have a number Lee Loaders (9 so far); I do almost all of my priming with an RCBS Universal Hand Primer; and I have a number of tumblers, and specific-use thingies and gadgets in my bins and cabinets (deprimers, case gauges, and the like). Each tool has its role and I don't try to get away with using a hammer when a mallet is called for.

As I said above, I acquired my stuff over a period of time. I realize most people can't/don't jump into reloading by buying a large assortment of things all at once. I didn't. But when that is the case, I have always thought a person should start simple (not necessarily with a Lee Loader, but that couldn't hurt) and then work their way up as they learn the technology and science behind reloading.

To directly answer your question, if a person has become comfortable (and knowledgeable) enough) to competently consider a progressive, then the factor that would seem to be most important to me would be the cost (which one can you comfortably afford) compared to the potential increase in productivity of one over the other. Considering my previous opinion that a person should progressively (sorry, pun intended) work their way up, I think your next step up from the Classic Turret should be a SDB. It is cheaper by about 1/2 (if you consider the cost of the 650 as purchased with all of the requisite upgrades that really are the things that speed it up) and it is simpler to use (for the beginner.) And the difference in the amount of ammo you can produce with either would not be overly significant (assuming you have never used either one and that there will be a learning curve for both and that you will not be all out racing and trying to beat the clock in terms of production - which would not be safe).
 
650. Even without a case feeder it will do 400 an hour. And although it will cost more..keep it clean and you'll always get your money back if you ever want to sell it. I have 5 Dillon 1050s and 650s. I mount the 650s on a strong mount and board and when I am done I unscrew the board from the bench and store the loader in a closet. Same with the 1050s. I take the case feeders off first though. Put an old pillow case over them too. I had a SDB once. While it worked fine it was just so tiny. And I got big hands...or maybe I should say I am a bit of a klutz. It did not lend itself to smooth loading for me. I've had a bunch of progressives over the years from the old RDP CH Mk III and IV(still have a mark IV)Lees, Stars, LnLs and others. The 650 seems to be about the most bang for the buck and the least prone to real problems. Any progressive...ANY...can mess up. But usually the biggest mess-ups are user problems. Ask me how I know. The best thing about the Dillon is the usually Great customer service/help!.
 
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I have 4 SDB's and think that they are the best little loader for the money. You don't need to buy the first set of dies, it comes with. Yes, they are proprietary and cost slightly more, but you will save money overall in buying a SDB.
Great loaders and very little to go wrong. Rarely ever an issue and if there is, they are easy to work on.
 
I too keep my Lee Classic turret for rifles.I too get aprox 100 rds/hour on it.Since I only shoot about 500rds/year(mostly 45-70),it does a good job for me.
I also have a Dillon RL300 dating back from 1982 and I have yet to have a glitch with it.If I count the time to replenish my primers,brass and bullet bin,I get between 200/250rds/hour.It is mounted on small primers for handguns.
My Square Deal B is mounted on large primers calibers of course for handguns.Again counting the time to replenish,I get between 250/300 rds/hour.And I tend to reload at a very leisure pace.
I like both of them but had a few issues with the Square Deal(defective casting of the priming assembly).It took a little while to figure out(I don't think the guys at Dillon had never seen the problem before)and since I got my new primer assembly,the thing is purring like a cat.
Service at Dillon is A1.Hope you have hours of fun with yours.
Qc
 
I have owned nothing but an LCT for years and do not like the primer system so I prime all my brass separately using a Lee hand primer while watching TV. This method is really fast and I can prime 500 cases in no time. I then can run 250-300 rounds an hour without having to use the primer system.

I looked at other presses and talked to other people and the common theme among all other people was cantankerous priming systems. In my opinion it is the weakest link in any press. In fact of all the reloading forums I belong to it is still a common complaint, just like your thread. I found it easier to use a different way to prime brass is usually faster than tinkering with a press installed priming system. I also use the Lee ram prime on the small Lee single stage press I have mounted on my bench to prime brass and once you get used to it you can really prime a lot of brass in a short time.

Anyway just some food for thought before you run out and buy a new press just for the priming system.
 
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In my opinion, if you're going to with a progressive press and you're going with Dillon, then you really should bit the bullet and get the 650. The Square Deal has an attractive price, but it lacks features that really should be on an automated device, like a case feeder. In time you will really miss that you don't have them yet you will not have a clear upgrade path. The 650 delivers what you both need and are going to want.
 
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I do not think that you will be disappointed with the SDB, as stated, it's a great little press that can if you want, throw out a lot of ammunition in a short time.
 
. . . and would love to be able to do 300. I only shoot and load .38 special for competition and would keep my Lee for my smaller volume stuff including rifle. Would love a 650 but need the ability to remove the press and store between sessions and space is limited. Due to the way the SDB has to be operated , i.e.; letting go of the handle, I am having doubts about the speed.. . . If I buy a progressive, it will be auto-advance. Help!
Several things to address. The major disadvantages of the SDB are its a 4-hole press with very little working room, it requires proprietary Dillon dies, and cannot do rifle at all. It isn't slow, and you can do 300 an hour (1 every 12 seconds . . . count 12 out).

For very little more you can get the 550 whose sole disadvantages are it's a manual index, 4-hole press. You would think the manual index is a disadvantage, but if you watch how its operated, your left hand is where it needs to be to index the press after placing a bullet. It uses any dies, and can be used for rifle so it can fit into any future you choose.

The 650 is a 5-hole, auto-index press so you get still higher cycle rates, can separate crimping (closing) from seating, add a bullet feeder die, add a powder check die, or any two of those three operations. A case feeder is a natural add-on as well as a bullet feeder, and each gives significantly higher cycle rates. And comfort. But increases changeover time :)

One thing to note - if you use a progressive and do multiple calibers, your changeover time can significantly increase the TOTAL time required to do small batches. You can minimize it by spending money on redundant parts, but its still an often overlooked issue with small batches.

Regarding portability, check out Inline Fabrication's Quick Mount system. You can easily store your press anywhere, and mount it rock-solid in less than a minute.

I use it to swap between a single stage, and Hornady LNL AP with case and bullet feeders, and I long ago lost most of my strength lol. It will EASILY handle a 650, as well as many other tools that need to be bench mounted (eg vise, bench primer, case prep machines, and more).

Any of those presses can meet your modest goals . . . some provide still higher production rates and more room for future growth at somewhat higher costs. Goals, futures, and budget are the issue here, not portability.
 
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I owned a SD-B for over 30 years and reloaded 3 hand gun calibers on it (.38 spl. .45 acp & .45 Colt). I used to produce 400+ rounds per hour for the first two calibers and slightly less for the .45 Colt due to it's larger surface area and more resistance when operating he press. I did pre-load the Primer Tubes to speed things up.

After all those years Dillon rebuilt the entire press to brand new (many parts had worn out) at no charge. I sold it to a friend and then bought the 650 with the automatic case feeder. The 650 press is more than twice as fast! Not only is the 650 much faster but it operates with a lot less friction and effort because of its larger size, better roller handle and smoother action. It is also a whole lot more versatile!

The 650 would be a little harder to constantly store and re-mount but the 650 is such a far superior press I truly feel it's worth the effort to figure out how to do so.

Nothing wrong with the SD-B, but it is ONLY useful for hand gun cartridges. The Dies are special proprietary Dies and not available elsewhere, whereas the 650 will use any standard Dies regardless of brand. If you are only using it for smaller runs of pistol and revolver cartridges you will be fine with the SD-B. That said, after owning both I'd definitely recommend figuring out how to store the 650 when not in use.
 
I have two square deals, one set up with small primers and one with large. I started out bolting it to my bench but ended up just using C clamps. There isn't a large amount of force used and they hold my presses secure. When I went from 9mm to 45 acp I just undid the clamps and changed out presses. I have had square deal since they only cost $135.00. I had a 650 but seldom had a large amount of rifle ammo to do I sold it and use my Rockchucker.
SWCA 892
 
I have a SD,,just a Square Deal not a SD-B.
Got it in the late 70's I think.
I load 38spec on it and have a set of 9mm dies for it.
It now needs the white plastic (Delrin?) parts replaced after all these years as they are starting to crack and break.. Not bad for what it's gone through.

Never did get the upgrades to it,,I have to get around to contacting them an see if they'll send me the plastic parts so I can replace them and get it up and running again,
I guess I could send them the press, but I'd just as soon do it myself.
Great little progressive for pistol cartridges.
I never shoot rifle in any large amt so a couple of single stage for that works out just fine.

If I were shooting greater quantitys of a rifle caliber, I'd get into a 650 or other similar progressive. I just don't have the need.
 
Great little progressive for pistol cartridges.
. If I were shooting greater quantitys of a rifle caliber, I'd get into a 650 or other similar progressive. I just don't have the need.

And you are right. The SDB is a great machine for pistol cartridges. I do have one of the 650s set up in 223. Also have a 308 conversion for it but have never used it...yet. May never need to. I am talking to someone now who has a SDB in 41 mag...I may have to buy it. Love my 41s. Just bought another'n tonight
 
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