Subsonic ready, or modification required?

[Lian]

Hi there

I'm getting my 15-22 in a few months and have read up extensively (imho) on it so far.
However, it's disconcerting how some people have great success with SS rounds, while others have lots of issues, and others have mentioned "yellow JP Spring sets" and other modifications.

I have searched Brownells and have found some spring sets, but it would be cool if someone could explain exactly what is recommended for SS capability? There are simply too many topics where people take certain tips for granted and that it's "common knowledge" among the veteran users here.
A direct link to the recommended springs (and whatever) would guarantee you 2 awesomeness points

Usually there are sticky topics to this end, but unfortunately nothing here.
For example, are the stock components fine out-of-box?
I assume certain brands are better than others.
Some people mentioned the bolt not ejecting properly (spring set solves this? which spring, link?)
Trigger not resetting properly? (also spring set?)
etc etc etc


thx!

 

[DownRange&Upwind]

Hi there

I'm getting my 15-22 in a few months and have read up extensively (imho) on it so far.
However, it's disconcerting how some people have great success with SS rounds, while others have lots of issues, and others have mentioned "yellow JP Spring sets" and other modifications.

I have searched Brownells and have found some spring sets, but it would be cool if someone could explain exactly what is recommended for SS capability? There are simply too many topics where people take certain tips for granted and that it's "common knowledge" among the veteran users here.
A direct link to the recommended springs (and whatever) would guarantee you 2 awesomeness points

Usually there are sticky topics to this end, but unfortunately nothing here.
For example, are the stock components fine out-of-box?
I assume certain brands are better than others.
Some people mentioned the bolt not ejecting properly (spring set solves this? which spring, link?)
Trigger not resetting properly? (also spring set?)
etc etc etc


thx!

The 15 22 manual specifically says NOT to use ANY subsonic rounds. That being said, alot of people have great success with them AFTER getting a suppressor installed( back pressure and all that) Beltfed makes a good point at the bottom of page 1 on this link http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-m-p-15-22/119727-best-subsonic-round-15-22-a.html

 

[Hobie1]

SS ammo and things

Greetings,

I recently purchased both the 15-22P and it's big brother, the MOE 15-22. I didn't like the triggers right away. However, I'm spoiled as all my other guns have exceptional triggers.(Les Baer, Clark MK11, S&W mdl 41). So, I bought the J&P trigger group springs to lighten the pull weight and with some moly grease, the triggers have smoothed out nicely. But, they have no impact(no pun intended) on the sub sonic rounds as far as functionality except perhaps striking the rim hard enough for reliable ignition(The hammer part of the kit). I've had exactly one failure to fire to date with all the different ammo I've tried. I turned the round 90 degrees and it fired.

I'm thinking that since S&W doesn't recommend standard or sub-sonic rounds has more to do with the recoil spring being stiff to handle Hv ammo and not allowing the gun to cycle reliably.

That being said, I have successfully cycled match ammo through both guns and was was very pleased with the results.

I'd suggest gathering up some ammo you want to use, go to the range and see what happens before you worry about changing things. These guns are for fun, mostly, so have some fun my friend.

One thing I may not be considering is that match ammo may still be faster, maybe still subsonic, but not the really light load involved.. I'm new here....

 

[jsimmons]

Sub-sonic rounds do not generate enough gas pressure to operate the action. You absolutley need to run AT LEAST standard velocity ammo, but the manual recommend high-velocity ammo to ensure proper operation.

 

[Lian]

what the manual says and what people have experienced with SS rounds, are vastly different.
@jsimmons: obviously people have done it reliably with no issues, so your statement is completely invalid.

im curious HOW they managed to do it, what modifications (if any) were required.
if the 15-22 was stock standard, or not.
what made it work for those people.

so far, it makes sense the suppressor would put extra backpressure on the smaller charge, making up for it.

 

[UpstateNY]

Sub-sonic rounds do not generate enough gas pressure to operate the action. You absolutley need to run AT LEAST standard velocity ammo, but the manual recommend high-velocity ammo to ensure proper operation.

I picked up a pack of CCI SS hoping they would not be loud, allowing me to fire them in the back of my lot without disturbing my neighbors. Well, needless to say, they were not much quieter than the mini-mags or velocitors I've been shooting. Also, every single one shot with no problems and was able to cycle the bolt just fine.

 

[CajunMouseSniper]

Lian- Wecome to the forum. I've tried Remington subsonics which did not cycle well and Winchester subsonics which cycle great, are much quieter than high velocity rounds, and also very accurate.

Attached is a link to the JP reduced power (yellow) springs I use.
Ar-15 Reduced Power Spring Kit Ar-15 Spring Kit - J P Enterprises

 

[Lian]

Lian- Wecome to the forum. I've tried Remington subsonics which did not cycle well and Winchester subsonics which cycle great, are much quieter than high velocity rounds, and also very accurate.

Attached is a link to the JP reduced power (yellow) springs I use.
Ar-15 Reduced Power Spring Kit Ar-15 Spring Kit - J P Enterprises

brilliant, thx!

i can understand ppl saying the SS rounds are not much quieter. but do those people understand you MUST use a suppressor?

suppressor = kills the sound AT the rifle
SS rounds = kills the sonic boom/crack AWAY from the rifle.

 

[UpstateNY]

brilliant, thx!

i can understand ppl saying the SS rounds are not much quieter. but do those people understand you MUST use a suppressor?

suppressor = kills the sound AT the rifle
SS rounds = kills the sonic boom/crack AWAY from the rifle.

I do realize that a SS round isn't going to be silent, but I was hoping for a bit less noise since the round wasn't going supersonic. Perhaps the perceived noise at my neighbor's houses was a bit less though. Oh well, I'll give the Aguila Super Colibri a try.

 

[VooDuuChild]

I wonder if just headin over to the neighbors and asking them if they minded if you shot on your property from time to time would take care of it? I mean, it doesn't sound like you're plannin on cappin off fifty cals or anything. Ya never know, maybe they're fans of hunting/shooting too givin ya the green light to really let the lead fly. Other than that, not much else you can do other than maybe a bolt action 22lr; they're pretty darn quiet....just not as tacticool as the M&P 15-22. One of my favorites to shoot is the bolt action 22lr, that darn thing will hit anything I aim it at; super accurate even with the cheapest, 20 year old ammo we got sittin around.

 

[jsimmons]

I picked up a pack of CCI SS hoping they would not be loud, allowing me to fire them in the back of my lot without disturbing my neighbors. Well, needless to say, they were not much quieter than the mini-mags or velocitors I've been shooting. Also, every single one shot with no problems and was able to cycle the bolt just fine.

Okay, I have on hand the following subsonic ammo (up to 1079 fps):

RWS Subsonic 40gr hollow point (1000 fps)
RWS Target Rifle 40gr (1035 fps)
Wolf Match Target 40gr (1050 fps)
SK Standard Plus 40gr (1050 fps)

The following standard velocity ammo (1080-1199fps)

Eley Sport 40gr (1135 fps)
Federal Gold Medal 711B 40 gr (1080 fps)


And the following high-velocity ammo (1200-1399fps):

Federal Auto Match 40gr (1200 fps)
CCI MiniMags 40gr (1255 fps)
Federal Game- Shok 40gr (1260 fps)
Winchester Super Speed RN 40gr (1300 fps) (added on 12/20)

I'll be happy to shoot a hundred of each to see what's what.

 

[UpstateNY]

Okay, I have on hand the following subsonic ammo (up to 1079 fps):

RWS Subsonic 40gr hollow point (1000 fps)
RWS Target Rifle 40gr (1035 fps)
Wolf Match Target 40gr (1050 fps)
SK Standard Plus 40gr (1050 fps)

The following standard velocity ammo (1080-1199fps)

Eley Sport 40gr (1135 fps)
Federal Gold Medal 711B 40 gr (1080 fps)


And the following high-velocity ammo (1200-1399fps):

Federal Auto Match 40gr (1200 fps)
CCI MiniMags 40gr (1255 fps)
Federal Game- Shok 40gr (1260 fps)

I'll be happy to shoot a hundred of each to see what's what.

That's a good mix you have there. Are you thinking just in terms of each being able to cycle the bolt? Or noise level?

 

[Lian]

Okay, I have on hand the following subsonic ammo (up to 1079 fps):

RWS Subsonic 40gr hollow point (1000 fps)
RWS Target Rifle 40gr (1035 fps)
Wolf Match Target 40gr (1050 fps)
SK Standard Plus 40gr (1050 fps)

The following standard velocity ammo (1080-1199fps)

Eley Sport 40gr (1135 fps)
Federal Gold Medal 711B 40 gr (1080 fps)


And the following high-velocity ammo (1200-1399fps):

Federal Auto Match 40gr (1200 fps)
CCI MiniMags 40gr (1255 fps)
Federal Game- Shok 40gr (1260 fps)

I'll be happy to shoot a hundred of each to see what's what.

that would actually be friggin awesome. please also add exactly what (if any) modifications were done to your rifle?
or if it's simply a stock standard rifle.
or if suppressor was added.

 

[grimreaper21]

while you're at it, shoot for accuracy so we can get some real data to see if the slower travel is generally more accurate than the faster.

 

[jsimmons]

That's a good mix you have there. Are you thinking just in terms of each being able to cycle the bolt? Or noise level?

I don't care about noise. I'm interested in two things - cycling the bolt reliably, and then accuracy. I personally don't have much hope of the subsonics being able to reliably cycle the bolt, but since someone else said he didn't have any problems with subsonic, I'll give it a shot (no pun intended).

I'll stop by WalMart and see if they have any of the new CCI AR ammo, too.

 

[Lian]

I personally don't have much hope of the subsonics being able to reliably cycle the bolt

it makes sense that a normal stock standard 15-22 will fail to run SS rounds, but it would be cool if someone with a suppressor could test the SS rounds, with (extra back pressure) and without the suppressor... to see if the suppressor really works as theorized.

 

[jsimmons]

it makes sense that a normal stock standard 15-22 will fail to run SS rounds, but it would be cool if someone with a suppressor could test the SS rounds, with (extra back pressure) and without the suppressor... to see if the suppressor really works as theorized.

You mean a REAL suppressor, or a fake one?

 

[Lian]

You mean a REAL suppressor, or a fake one?

would what the point be of a fake one?
unless that's a problem in your state/area?

 

[jsimmons]

would what the point be of a fake one?
unless that's a problem in your state/area?

The problem with a real one is that you have to pay the BATFE tax ($220) before you can spend $300-600 on a suppressor. The fake ones are only $30, but like you, I wonder what the point is of putting something on the rifle that will only add weight and serves no other tangible purpose (that I know of). I'm not one for putting stuff on my rifle simply because it looks cool (or like something that it isn't).

 

[jsimmons]

I added Winchester Super Speed RN 40gr to the list of ammo I'm going to try. Went to wal-mart and bought 500 rounds of it ($30).