The Polish Radom pistol - a fascinating history

[Texas Star]

As the OP pointed out the words Fabryka Bronyi Radom which translates to Radom Arms Factory appear on the pistol. The VIS designation is from the initials of the designers Wilniewczyc and Skrzyipinski. (yes, I have noted Wilniewczyc starts with a 'W' - don't ask me)

According to Ian Hogg's 'Military Small Arms of the Twentieth Century' (1973 edition) it is acceptable to refer to the pistol as either a Radom or a VIS. W.H.B. Smith just flat out calls it a Radom.

I haven't held one of these in 20 odd years but they appear to have the VIS insignia on the right grip panel and FB on the left. I'd be interested to find out if this is in fact correct.

I've read that VIS is a Latin abb. for something. Never read that it's the designers' initials.

BTW, I've found some errors in Ian Hogg's books. But he's correct about the names as you gave them. The Germans called it the P-35(p). Pistole 35, Polish. (Polnisch, if my memory of German is okay.)

 

[MarkC]

I've read that VIS is a Latin abb. for something. Never read that it's the designers' initials.

BTW, I've found some errors in Ian Hogg's books. But he's correct about the names as you gave them. The Germans called it the P-35(p). Pistole 35, Polish. (Polnisch, if my memory of German is okay.)

Had a look on Wikipedia (yeah I know but I got lazy) and found the following;

"The handgun was prepared in late 1930, and at the beginning of 1931 the first pistols were ready for testing. Initially it was named WiS (an acronym of the Polish designers' names), later the name was changed to Vis, meaning "force" in Latin, with the wz. abbreviation for wzór ("model").[3]"

So, initially Wis but by the sound of it, by the time it went into production the name had well and truly been changed to Vis.

 

[DEERE G]

PlI recently inherited a Radom from my wifes grandfather. I'm trying to learn more about these pistols. Is there a way to determine an exact date (year) of manufacturing?
I believe it to be a later model from the information I have read here.
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[M3Stuart]

The coolest thing about that gun is the name "Radom". Given that 'Radar', 'Radium', even 'Radome' are all cool to say.

Radom, Radom, Radom...

Thanks for the cool history lesson!

 

[Marshwheeling]

Yep. Gotta get me one o' them Polish Random guns. Just for the name.

 

[DWalt]

Way back long time ago, I bought one for, as I remember, about $20. I liked it and it shot fine. I think I traded it off for a P-38. I haven't seen one at a gun show for a very long time.

 

[PALADIN85020]

PlI recently inherited a Radom from my wifes grandfather. I'm trying to learn more about these pistols. Is there a way to determine an exact date (year) of manufacturing?
I believe it to be a later model from the information I have read here.

It is definitely a late war model - the lack of a takedown latch and the staked roll pins to replace it is the giveaway. The plating (or polishing?) was not done at the factory. It's difficult to give an exact dating. The eagle over 77 waffenamt stamp (a short form of the earlier eagle over Wa77) was being used by Radom in '44. The serial number is in the second alphabet series, which I believe started in '44. It went A through K, with the final pistols being made by Steyr, not at the Radom plant since the Soviets were about to invade Radom. Since yours has an A prefix, it was probably made at Radom. The elimination of the takedown latch started in the second A series; with and without were intermixed. I've seen a picture of a pistol in the second A series (# A6836) with a later number than yours that still had the latch. While simplified, pistols of this era were still quite usable as weapons.

The Soviets invaded Radom in December of '44, so my best guess is that the year of manufacture for your pistol would be 1944.

John

 

[gmiller0737]

I still regret selling My 1938 Eagle Radom even though I sold it for 10 times what I paid for it.

 

[Tony G.]

Hi, I just inherited one of these. I'm trying to read up and educate myself on what I have. Mine has F. B. Radom VIS Mod. 35 Pat Nr. 15557 then an eagle (all on one straight line) on the left side. The right side has the serial number. The serial number begins G450*. FB is on left grip panel and VIS on right on what appears to be brown checkered plastic. When I read about Polish vs German this appears to be from about the time the Germans took over the plant and started producing them (Grade 2). Am I correct? If not, can you either help or lead me to an url with more detailed info? I've seen several pics that are really close but no cigar. I've attached a picture of the holster also if that gives you clues. Any other clues I should look for? Thanks!

 

[DWalt]

I saw a Radom at the local gun show on Sunday. It appeared refinished, and had black plastic grips which could have been replicas, as they looked too new and shiny to be original. It had an $800 price tag on it. Not often you see any Radoms.

 

[PALADIN85020]

Hi, I just inherited one of these. I'm trying to read up and educate myself on what I have. Mine has F. B. Radom VIS Mod. 35 Pat Nr. 15557 then an eagle (all on one straight line) on the left side. The right side has the serial number. The serial number begins G450*. FB is on left grip panel and VIS on right on what appears to be brown checkered plastic. When I read about Polish vs German this appears to be from about the time the Germans took over the plant and started producing them (Grade 2). Am I correct? If not, can you either help or lead me to an url with more detailed info? I've seen several pics that are really close but no cigar. I've attached a picture of the holster also if that gives you clues. Any other clues I should look for? Thanks!

The lack of a takedown latch (staked roll pins substituted) marks this as a late war example, probably 1944.

John

 

[K-framer]

I had a roommate at university that had a P-35 Radom. This was between 1979 and 1984. We shot it often. It was a "bringback" from Europe, given to him by his father (who served in the U.S. Army during WW2). At the time, I had no idea of the history of the firearm - I only knew that it was Polish.

I remember it being quite accurate and utterly reliable. We probably put nearly a thousand rounds through that pistol, with no malfunctions whatever.

 

[DWalt]

Scoutwookie: I recently read a book about a young American officer in WW-II who took a piece of plexiglass off of a downed aircraft and made grips similar to yours for his issued 1911. He then placed a photo of his wife and child under the plexiglass grips and carried it that way throughout the remainder of the war. If I can find the book again (it was from the public library) I will post a reference to it. To me, I think the original or previous owner of your Radom did a very similar thing.

Regards,

Dave

Those so-called "Sweetheart" Plexiglas grips were fairly common during WWII on both semiautomatics and revolvers, and they used to be frequently seen at the gun shows of 40-50 years ago. It's been a long time since I have seen one.

 

[Ck1981]

Polish Vis P35

This is my Vis P35, I inherited it from my Dad who was a WWII veteran. He liberated this pistol from a Nazi solider in the Heurtgen Forrest battle. He was in the 8th infantry Division.
The pistol has the shoulder stock grove, one black FB grip on the left one wooden checkered grip on the right. WAA77 stamps, all serial numbers match. B2xxx Serial number.Original holster also. It is a great shooter I have had some range time with it.

 

[OLDSTER]

VIS35

Great thread; educational and informational I own this VIS 35, "D" block, circa 1943 . I would like to find a decent ( for a decent price, of course) earlier 3 lever with or without the shoulder stock slot( hint-hint)

 

[OLDSTER]

When was the shoulder stock notch discontinued ? Sometime prior to the take-down lever being eliminated, so an early type II ?

 

[PALADIN85020]

When was the shoulder stock notch discontinued ? Sometime prior to the take-down lever being eliminated, so an early type II ?

Only the very early guns had the slot for a shoulder stock; few of these were made, and the stocks were almost never used. Probably eliminated circa 1936.

John

 

[Vipervenom]

My dad has one of these, I will try to get some pictures of it today, it has stamped markings all over it, some I recognize, and some that I can't find anything about.

 

[Tom n]

I just picked up H1625

 

[malph]

I thought you might be interested in seeing a Polish P.35 9mm Radom pistol. At first glance it might appear homely, but the Radom is considered by many experts as one of the best pistols to come out of the WWII period. It was well made and robust.

Poland produced this pistol, which had a blend of features from the M1911 pistol and the Belgian 9mm High Power. It has a grip safety like the M1911, and the barrel is unlocked via a cam like the High Power. The lever on the slide is a decocker - it retracts the firing pin into the slide and drops the hammer on the hammer retaining plate. The lever to the rear of the grip frame is not a safety - it's a slide retaining latch to aid in disassembly. The slide release is just above the trigger on the left side. There is no manual safety; the design relies solely on a half-cock notch or the floating firing pin which allows safe carry with the hammer down. The decocker was put on the gun in response to a request by the Polish cavalry to help in operating the pistol one-handed; the other hand had to control the reins of a horse. Men on horseback wielding pistols were not a good match for German tanks, however.

When Germany overran Poland in 1939, it took over the Radom plant and began to produce the pistol for its armed forces, including the Navy, fallschirmjaegers (paratroopers), police and the SS. The native Polish workers promptly began smuggling parts of the pistol out of the plant to arm resistance forces. When the Germans found out about this practice, they executed a dozen plant workers in front of their co-workers. Later, to stop sabotage, the Germans started making barrels for the pistols in Austria, and later moved all the machinery to Austria.

This particular pistol was made in Poland in 1942, and bears the German waffenamt acceptance stamps. Later guns dispensed with the takedown latch. Earlier ones were slotted for a shoulder stock. The "VIS" on the right grip panel is Latin for "power" or "force." The "FB" on the left grip panel stands for Fabryka Brony (Weapon Factory), the Polish government manufacturing facility in Radom, Poland.

This gun is in excellent shape for being 70 years old, and could still give good service. It will fire any commonly available 9mm Luger ammo.

John

Hello. Just a few quick points. Everyone had calvary in 1935. The Poles yes but so did the Germans, US, Brits, Russians, ...

The Poles in 1939 did not deploy their calvary in saber and pistol charges against tanks. That is a myth. It did not happen. Calvary in 1939 could best be thought of as mounted infantry. Deploy or redeploy on horseback but fight dismounted as infantry. Basically horse mobile infantry.