Tom Threepersons

[bracebeemer]

I was able to purchase a really nice H.H.Heiser Tom Threepersons holster that was impressed on the back "M&P 4" . I happen to have an M&P 4" from 1949 with a round butt and Pre War style round butt stocks numbered to the gun. It also comes with the numbered gold box. I love the minimalist style of these holsters.
Bill

 

[quinn]

Absolutely beautiful! I think I have the same holster in 3.5" N frame size... and love it. Came on a 27-2. Congrats on your find.

 

[crazyphil]

I have that same style holster except mine is older. It has the elongated
HHH brand and no model number. I think it is the best gun to holster fit
I have ever had. Nice find.

Obviously I pulled up the wrong photo. I'll try again.

 

[crazyphil]

There, that's better. The first one was a snub model 10 in
a Bucheimer Sheriff.

CORRECTION: The first one (above) was not a Bucheimer. It is a Lewis clip on.
I can't seem to get anything right this morning. Maybe I better go back to bed.

 

[DevilDog72]

man I like that holster.... and gun combo. nice find

 

[Sourdough]

That Bucheimer reminds me of a Bianchi Model 5 I bought after getting to Vietnam. The Mod 5 was a thumb-break, was the main difference I recall. The design was very good, and the quality was certainly acceptable. Carried my issue Model 15 in it on nighttime perimeter posts for a year. Just before leaving gave it to another cop who worked day shift in the command bunker.

First morning he wore it the commander came about 2/3 unwrapped. He understood it was more comfortable than the SP issue holster, and more practical for someone working at a desk but it wasn't uniform!

 

[crazyphil]

bracebeemer I have seldom heard the Heiser referred to as a Threepersons
although it is close to identical. I have most often heard the Heiser referred
to as their FBI model. Either way it was and is a great old design.

 

[rednichols]

bracebeemer I have seldom heard the Heiser referred to as a Threepersons
although it is close to identical. I have most often heard the Heiser referred
to as their FBI model. Either way it was and is a great old design.

The 457 was Heiser's answer to Myres' 614 Threepersons and they have all the same feature elements. So in my view the Heiser is a threepersons style and likely that's what the OP meant. Agreed Heiser -- nor any significant holster maker of the 20th century other than Myres -- did not call it a threepersons. That name to indicate a holster type is a 21st century practice and isn't found in 20th century text books, for example. To be a threepersons style, at a minimum it must have a welt inside the seam, which the 457 has. Best in class: the Brill with its triple welts and other very unique features not incorporated since the 1950s. Fantastic holster that is still today the most engineered holster for revolvers outside of the various spring holsters of Hoyt and Berns-Martin et al.

 

[crazyphil]

The photo at left shows the front of Myres 614 Threepersons on the left
and the Heiser FBI model on the right. This one has the elongated HHH
logo and no model number yet, but later became 457.

Photo at right shows the back of the Myres on the left and Heiser on
the right.

 

[crazyphil]

Does anyone know?
On a Heiser the first number designates finish such as
4 = smooth
5 = basket weave
7 = floral carved
9 = smooth lighter weight leather

The 2nd number designates action type:
1, 3, 5, etc. odd numbers for revolvers
2, 4, 6, etc. even numbers for semi-autos

The 3rd number is my question. Does anyone know what the 3rd
number means? For instance the OPs holster in this thread is a 9.

Most typical FBI or Threepersons style Heisers have a 3rd number 7.

??????

 

[turnerriver]

The poster's holster is mis-numbered. 459 was the model number for the FBI holster with a hammer protector.


Regards,
turnerriver

 

[crazyphil]

Thanks for that explanation John. Do you have any clues about the
meaning of the third number in the Heiser code? Other than that
the 9 represents hammer protector? Maybe 7 means the FBI or
Threepersons style?

The 713 for example has lace and a retention strap. Could 3 mean
one of those? All of my Heisers have either 7, 3, or 9 for the third
number. I see now since you told us, my Heiser's with hammer
protector all have 9 as their third number.

 

[rednichols]

Geez you're good, turnerriver, I didn't even notice the 459 marking on the OP's 457 holster, until you pointed it out. That error is the equivalent of the factory putting a Firebird badge on a Camaro in the '60s

I like Phil's line of thinking with his no-number 457: an early version for lack of the number and the very straight welt area. My image collection of the 457 shows its evolution into one with quite an extreme 'waist' below the frame.

Bit of trivia I learned from turnerriver: his Evaluators 459's stamp, third line, 'quick draw', has a a blank where it once said 'fbi quick draw'. The same stamp change appears on Evaluators' 457s.

 

[crazyphil]

It is obvious, now that you point it out, that fbi is missing from the space
where it should have been, or I should say where it was.

Notice ALSO how the belt loop on the OPs holster goes up a little
higher than my earlier model.

Here is a comparison of my "early" 457 shown below on the left
with a 757 on the right. Quite a difference in height of top of
belt loop.

They could probably choose ride height when ordering?

 

[rednichols]

Notice ALSO how the belt loop on the OPs holster goes up a little
higher than my earlier model.

Here is a comparison of my "early" 457 shown below on the left
with a 757 on the right. Quite a difference in height of top of
belt loop.

They could probably choose ride height when ordering?

More likely different pattern makers? I know from my experience developing new products for dozens of holster companies, that my predecessors' patterns were very inconsistent from model size to size (such as K frame vs Python frame) and from holster model to model (such as 457 to 459). At Bianchi this would depend on which of four men -- John, another John, Richard (another Richard), and me -- put his hands on the project. I changed all that on my own initiative, to get more predicability from the designs and more parts and tooling interchangeablity (sp?).

The OP's is "very Bucheimer", and designer Al Kippen worked first for Heiser until 1945, then when Heiser was sold he formed Colorado Saddlery with partners, when that didn't work out (or was sold and thereby became Hunter) he went back to Heiser, then on to Bucheimer, then on to Smith & Wesson's new holster brand (formerly Blazer). Kippen has his name on a few holster patents but is largely an unknown even by industry insiders, because he's from so long ago (would've been over 100 y/o by now).

 

[bracebeemer]

I started off with a Heiser "Threepersons Style" holster so I'll add a S.D.Myers Threepersons holster for a 5" M&P, This particular M&P is a .32 Winchester from 1911.
Bill

 

[boykinlp]

Just for a little change of pace, our own turnerriver let me know this holster is a SD Myres Ranger Threepersons Model. He said it was probably a special order uncatalogued holster. It is one of my favorites. It is kind of a "fancied up" threeperson's holster.



Of course, El Paso Saddlery has their Threepersons version too:

 

[rednichols]

Just for a little change of pace, our own turnerriver let me know this holster is a SD Myres Ranger Threepersons Model. He said it was probably a special order uncatalogued holster. It is one of my favorites. It is kind of a "fancied up" threeperson's holster.

Indeed that's an odd-but-lovely one: a Myres 'threepersons' holster nested inside a Myres 'ranger' fender-and-cuff (rangers had the trigger guard surround with cutout for the trigger). I see it is the later 'El Paso' marking (vs the early 'El Paso TX' marking) The former is where the unusual/expermental/one-off models appear (e.g., the Myres 'Berns-Martin Speed Holster').

 

[rednichols]

Tom Threepersons' personal holster -- and the only one

Recently I acquired Tom's own holster, and it fits all the criteria that we know today as a 'threepersons' style holster, including the welt design that retains the SAA without a safety strap via a tapered, double-thick wedge that today we call a 'welt'.

It restored nicely and its condition is one of a 50 year old holster -- but it's 100. Its unusual construction was used only by a maker known as A.B. Egland that operated in Douglas, Arizona -- which town, according to the A.T.F. (the only one of 5 agencies he worked for that claims him online), was Threepersons' first appearance at rodeo in 1916.

I acquired it from the widow of Fred Wells, a noted rifle-smith in Prescott, Arizona, along with its provenance documents. This acquisition led me to a thorough search about Tom and I was helped along the way by crazyphil and by turnerriver. Here are two pics:





The documents shown come from the A.T.F.'s website, which is the most thorough of those I've seen because it omits common errors (he was neither a Mountie nor a Texas Ranger) and admits what it doesn't know (his birth is reported variously).

Apologies that the pics are upside-down, because they're right side up before loading! The belt is not original to the holster but is equally old: A Heiser in 38 cal (Tom's was .44 W.C.F.). And the revolver is a Nichols (no relation) capgun from 1960, cut down to 4-3/4" (standard is 6-1/4") that is surprisingly on-size. And those aren't rubber bands holding the set in place; it's leather lace.

 

[6518John]

Apologies that the pics are upside-down, because they're right side up before loading!

I figured it was because they came from Australia!

Beautiful display! Thank you so much for sharing.