Triple Lock, but which one?

[Lefkiguy]

Here's a triple lock I just picked up. It looks like it's been to England and back, but... the markings seem to be commercial proofs, no unit or military markings on it (broad arrow etc). Stampings on left side show a x with an H and B over 2, which my investigations show it was so marked in 1957. Serial number on barrel, frame butt and extractor match, the cylinder has been shaved since this is now a 45 ACP gun, and the crane and just inside the crane on the frame have a different number (I'm assuming assembly). There are buffing marks on left side of frame, and you can also see where the side plate was rounded at the bottom edge. It has been reblued, and the hammer and trigger have no case color, third lock was blued along with the crane. I apologize for all the lint noticeable in the pictures below, I grabbed the wrong rag. Serial number is 5036. I'm going to get it lettered, but my question is do you think it's a 44 Hand Ejector or the 455 Hand Ejector?
Ted

 

[murphydog]

Since it's a British re-import with a .45 matching barrel, presumably it was a .455. The caliber roll mark on the left barrel was probably polished off. The commercial proofs were placed after military service, prior to commercial sale.

 

[cgt4570]

Many of these were privately purchased. If they weren't bought through military channels, then they wouldn't show military proofs.
Looks like that one got refinished and rechambered on its return to the states.

 

[glowe]

I think I see a 45 AR (Auto Rim) stamped on the left side of the barrel. The gap between the back of the cylinder and the frame look too big for a 455, so there would be no serial number at the back of the cylinder. Looking at the barrel stamps, it looks like the one farthest out on the barrel has been polished, indicating that the original 455 stamping was removed and restamped. My experience with British stampings is that there seems to be no uniform method of stamping these guns. Some have very few stampings on them, while others have stampings everywhere. The revolver was proofed in Birmingham, England as indicated by the BV and NP stamps.

The gun has been refinished, maybe when converted. Lots of 455s were rechambered for 45 Auto Rim or 45 Colt after the Great War.

 

[DCWilson]

Theoretically there were no .455 HE First Models numbered above 5000 in their own series, so TL 5036 would have to have been numbered in the .44 HE series. Number 5036 in the .455 series would have been a Second Model, and therefore not a Triple Lock.

A bunch of .44 HEs were converted to .455 TLs by the factory, but none of these are known to be numbered near the 5000 zone (Neal & Jinks, pp. 203-205).

This gun may have been modified a couple of times. Perhaps it was first converted to .455 on special order, and then later further modified to take .45 AR (or ACP).

My gentleman's bet is that this gun will letter as a gun in the .44 Hand Ejector series.

ADDENDUM: Those chambers look kind of long. Any chance this gun chambers .45 Colt despite being marked for .45 AR? That could be a third modification.

SECOND ADDENDUM: Well, maybe I'm wrong. I have found references to .455 TLs numbered above 5000 that appear NOT to be guns from the .44 HE series.

 

[Lefkiguy]

Thanks DC, 45 Colt does not drop all the way in, 45 Auto Rim and 45 ACP in half moon clips seat fine. Also, there are no numbers marked inside the grips, don't know if S&W did that back then. Thanks to all the previous posts on these models, helping me get as much background information as possible. It's nice having a Triple Lock, you don't see them very often here in California.
Ted

 

[DCWilson]

Ted, I was lucky to connect with a converted .455 TL in Orange County a couple of years ago; you are right that you don't see these on consignment shelves that often in California. I won't repost pics now, but here's a link to the old thread if you are interested. Mine went to .45 Colt, and the thicker cartridge rim was accommodated by recessing the charge holes to half the rim thickness.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-ha...iple-digit-triple-lock-bandwidth-warning.html

 

[Waidmann]

Your Birmingham proofs are of the 1925-1954 era so I suppose this H is for July 1, 1928 to June 30, 1929 not 1957.

 

[Lefkiguy]

I was using the following as my guide for proof dates. If there's other data, I stand corrected, thanks.

I'm leaning towards it being a .455 Mark II HE 1st Model, as SCS&W 3rd ed. notes on page 166 that few will have the caliber stamped on the barrel, and the 45 AR on there would be the first stamping (rather than having the second 5 buffed out). Those also went to a possible 6000 serial number. As I said above, it doesn't have any of the other military marks seen on other examples.