Ultrasonic case cleaning adventures

[TucsonMTB]

Well . . . Midway had an ultrasonic cleaner from Frankford Arsenal on a closeout sale for $36.50.

Being a sucker for gadgets . . . I ordered one.

It is not impressively fast with home made vinegar, salt and detergent solution, but does work. At first I thought it was a dud because it takes several 8 minute sessions to get 38 special cases clean inside. I never got around to using the small sample of cleaning solution that came with the device.

Then, I found some plain Citric Acid from DudaDiesel on eBay. It arrived in today's mail before I could get to the grocery store to look for Lemi-shine. They offer the same free shipping and excellent prices if you go directly to their web site too.

I used a left over plastic scoop to "measure" and add some of the powdery acid to two quarts of water. The resulting concentration is a little greater than 3% by weight. The only other ingredients are a healthy squirt of dish washing detergent and the ultrasonic cleaner. Here are the results . . . picturing a view of the bases, a side view, and a top view of some Fiocchi brass and Federal nickle plated cases respectively.

Run times in the Frankford Arsenal ultrasonic cleaner were about half what the vinegar mixture required while processing 25 cases at a time with the cases were held vertically by the leftover S&B 45 ACP plastic cartridge box inserts that you can see in the pictures.

I am a happy camper!

Note: Edited to change the concentration calculation to 3%. When I was originally doing the math, I overlooked the fact that I was only mixing a 2 quart batch, not a gallon batch.

 

[BLUEDOT37]

Squeaky clean

Looks squeaky clean !!

 

[TucsonMTB]

Looks squeaky clean !!

Yep! However, sizing with carbide dies after cleaning seems to require almost the same level of force as uncleaned brass.

Still, the effort on the press lever does seem to be more consistent, case to case. That could be my imagination because I am looking for a benefit from the time spent cleaning.

Admittedly, clean brass does seem to provide more consistent results at the range, but that could just be my learning curve on crimping.

Too many variables! Being a "newbie pistol caliber reloader" is not for the faint of heart.

 

[Rule3]

I bought a bag of citric acid from them some time ago. I still dry tumble but wash range brass at times.

Pure citric acid is more economical than Lem Shine but folks still think that is the greatest thing for some unknown reason.??

Might as well put in a packet of Kool Aid mix

(Blue of course)

 

[Bajadoc]

Three hours in my old tumbler makes me feel like a cave man. I'm going to update with your method, thanks.

 

[TucsonMTB]

Three hours in my old tumbler makes me feel like a cave man. I'm going to update with your method, thanks.

Glad to help, but I can't claim to be much of an innovator. I decided to try this after reading posts on several forums many of which were more than five years old.

Oh, and . . . hang onto that tumbler. While it cleans nicely, there is NO polishing action in ultrasonic cleaning. The gleam on the nickle plated Federal cases came from the factory.

The shiny quality of the outside of the Fiocchi cases came from the last time I tumbled them with corn cob media and a little car polish in my vibration style tumbler. Ultrasonic cleaning uncovered the shine, but did not add to or create it.

YMMV

Besides, I think cave men had it right. Use a club to retrieve a wench with no verbal skills required. Yeah. That would be fun.

Oh, excuse me . . . I think I hear my wife calling . . .

 

[kbm6893]

I bought a bag of citric acid from them some time ago. I still dry tumble but wash range brass at times.

Pure citric acid is more economical than Lem Shine but folks still think that is the greatest thing for some unknown reason.??

Might as well put in a packet of Kool Aid mix

(Blue of course)

I have the hornady sonic cleaner and use the hornady one shot cleaner. I've heard he vinegar and dish soap method can cause the brass to turn pink and must be neutralized with a baking soda and water

 

[TucsonMTB]

I have the hornady sonic cleaner and use the hornady one shot cleaner.

Do me a favor please, kind sir. Could you look at the contents label on your Hornady One Shot Cleaner to determine the citric acid content? There was one post somewhere during my "research" from a fellow who said Citric Acid was a major ingredient in his container of Hornady cleaner.

I've heard he vinegar and dish soap method can cause the brass to turn pink and must be neutralized with a baking soda and water

Yep! I read the same thing on the Internet, so it must be true. And, one of my online friends in a different forum related his alarm at turning 30-06 cases pink with Lemi-shine. He was sure they were ruined. Another fellow on the same forum responded that he occasionally experienced pink spots on his brass but that it shot just fine. The word from several Internet "experts" is that the pink polishes right off in their tumbler. So, they didn't consider it an issue.

Hey, my wife might like pink brass. I will have to see if I can do that . . . but, so far, no such luck.

 

[AveragEd]

I don't clean my handgun brass (too many to be bothered) but do polish my rifle cases. I bought one of the Hornady UltraSonic cleaners a few years ago and wasn't impressed. It took three cycles to get 20 cases "sorta" clean but even with a higher comcentration of the Hornady solution the third time, the cases came out kind of sticky, requiring an hour or so in the media polisher to remove whatever was on them. Then there's drying the cases when they come out of the UltraSonic cleaner...

I returned the Hornady cleaner and went back to cleaning the necks with Flitz and the rest of the case bodies in the media polisher. Primer pockets require a few spins of a brush but I have an RCBS Case Prep Center, so that just takes a second or two per case.

Ed

 

[Rule3]

Do me a favor please, kind sir. Could you look at the contents label on your Hornady One Shot Cleaner to determine the citric acid content? There was one post somewhere during my "research" from a fellow who said Citric Acid was a major ingredient in his container of Hornady cleaner.


Yep! I read the same thing on the Internet, so it must be true. And, one of my online friends in a different forum related his alarm at turning 30-06 cases pink with Lemi-shine. He was sure they were ruined. Another fellow on the same forum responded that he occasionally experienced pink spots on his brass but that it shot just fine. The word from several Internet "experts" is that the pink polishes right off in their tumbler. So, they didn't consider it an issue.

Hey, my wife might like pink brass. I will have to see if I can do that . . . but, so far, no such luck.

MSDS

MSDS - Hornady Manufacturing, Inc


Less than 15%. The have several formulas So this is for the case cleaner.

Any mild acid will turn brass pink/purple if left in to long, If you do not mix the solution to strong and TRIPLE rinse it you will not have discoloration.

Most tap water has a alkaline pH so you do not need to make it more so with baking soda if you rinse it correctly.

Vinegar (acetic acid) is what 5%? Add 1 cup in water to make 1 gal and how strong can it be??

 

[TucsonMTB]

. . . Less than 15%. The have several formulas So this is for the case cleaner.

Any mild acid will turn brass pink/purple if left in to long, If you do not mix the solution to strong and TRIPLE rinse it you will not have discoloration. . . . .

Thank you, sir! I am guessing that citric acid actually is the useful ingredient, along with whatever detergent they use in their product.

At a 3% acid concentration by weight in my final cleaning solution, citric acid has yet to cause any entertaining colors. It does seem to improve the performance of the ultrasonic cleaner and the fine particles of powder residue stay in suspension rather than settling out the way they did in the vinegar/salt/detergent formula. Not necessarily an advantage but it keeps them off the brass until it is rinsed.

I work in the laundry sink in the garage and rinse very thoroughly. Whatever the case, this method definitely works for me on 38 special cases.

As an American Crow (the bird, not the Indian tribe) in a former life, I like shiny things, so clean is good!

Thanks again . . .

 

[Nemo288]

Re: increased carbide die tension from ultra clean cases.

While my cases don't get THAT clean, I do use a very slight squirt
of case lube on all revolver brass. Nickel especially.
Redding even recommends this in the directions for using their dual ring carbide dies.
Currently I use the RCBS One Shot spray.
"A little dab'll do ya". (Remember that one?)

---
Nemo

 

[Bkreutz]

I think I've gone through every method. Started by not cleaning 9mm brass but decided quickly that was too messy (soot on my hands and everywhere else). Then I used a vibrator type tumbler. That worked well but it was taking a long time to process all the brass I shoot (1000 - 1500 per week). Then I got an ultrasonic cleaner (Hornady). It cleaned the brass well, but again I was limited by the capacity of the unit. Then I tried stainless steel pin tumbling. I liked the result but the size of the tumbler again limited me to a couple of hundred cases at a time. All of these methods were eating up a full day during the week to prepare brass (except the not clean option ) Then I upped the scale of my stainless steel pin method, I took a Harbor Freight 1.25 cu ft cement mixer and fixed a plastic bucket into it, I glued some strips of PVC to the inside of the bucket to agitate the brass as it turns, I use a squirt of Turtle Wax Zip wash (wash and wax in one) and cold water. Tumble for one hour, rinse a bunch of times, and lay out on a table to dry (1 hour in the summertime if the sun is shining, 3 days inside in the winter). Total time to process the brass is less than 2 hours not counting drying time, and the actual work part is about an hour. The pictures show the results.

 

[TucsonMTB]

. . . The pictures show the results.

It is nice to know that there is another level if I ever have the opportunity to reload on that great a scale.

Thank you for sharing!

 

[TucsonMTB]

3% Solution Test

Several people on this and other forums have expressed concern about the effects of cleaning chemicals on brass, especially the "pink brass" condition that some have reported using the vinegar or Lemi Shine® based cleaning solutions. It occurred to me that the inquisitive Mr. Sherlock Holmes had his own "3% solution" for another purpose and that he would probably approve of a little testing. Dr. Watson was busy, so I decided to do it myself.

This is an old, Federal .380 ACP brass cartridge case that I certainly can do without. It is submerged in a small sample of my 3% citric acid and dish washing detergent cleaning solution for a long term soak, just to better understand the possible effects on brass I do care about. Experts are fine, but a little testing of my own is more convincing to me. I guess that's why so many of us shoot perfectly harmless jugs of water with our carry loads.

Surprisingly enough, to me, after only a few minutes in the bottle and a little shaking, the case is already starting to look fairly nice in terms of less corrosion. I will post again in a day or so after a proper, long term soak.

The next time the ultrasonic is running, setting this jar in the bath should simulate the effects of "normal" cleaning. But, I am starting to think the solution is as important as the ultrasonic agitation. This cleaning solution is just 3% pure citric acid by weight, a dollop of dish washing detergent, and tap water.

 

[Jaymo]

So, is brass that is dark gray (picked up at outdoor range) safe to shoot after cleaning?
I picked up a bunch and cleaned it in the vinegar/salt/water solution for 5 minutes before drying, checking, and tumbling.
It came out of the bath looking like regular clean, but not polished, brass.
No pits observed.
No zinc leaching observed.
Just dark and full of mud when I found them/ dug them out of the dried mud.

 

[Rule3]

Already been there done that. Plus I really like the TV show Elementary!

Any time you are messing with chemicals (acids) the reaction to other materials is based on the concentration and the time exposed. So mixed correctly and not exposed for to long there is no problem. Acids are used to clean a lot of things. Another popular cleaner is BKF (Bar Keepers Friend) it is Oxalic acid.

My Mother and her mother used Lemon Juice or Vinegar and salt to clean copper pans 100 years ago. Clean pennies with it.