Verification...

[Truckman]

My experience with early 20th Century Smiths is limited so I'm looking for verification of a gun I bought this morning...Using SCSW4 I believe this is a Model of 1905 4th Change...6" barrel, S/N 291908 puts its production between the two Army Ordnance 50 target gun orders for their marksmanship teams...

The stocks are numbered to the frame in pencil, and very well fitted...Are they the correct ones?...All other numbers match also...There are no marks at all on the grip frame which might indicate a return to the factory...Is my memory correct in that trademark logo and address stampings were suspended for the duration of WWI?...Neither appear on this example, and it shows no sign of refinishing to my eye...

I bought this as part of a collection this morning, and this appears to be the oldest of a mixed lot......Ben

 

[Walter Rego]

Hard to tell from the photo but the trigger appears to be blued. That's one hint of a refinish. Also the color appears to be a modern hot salt dark blue. But it also looks like a nice job. How is the sideplate fit ?

 

[Truckman]

How is the sideplate fit ?

Sideplate fit is almost seamless, near perfect...Both hammer and trigger are definitely color case hardened, but do show some wear on the sides...None of the pins have been polished flat......Ben

 

[two-bit cowboy]

Boy, that's a handsome creature. Congrats.

I really appreciate what appears to be an almost extreme bevel on the cylinder flutes. Very nice.

 

[Truckman]

Boy, that's a handsome creature. Congrats.

I really appreciate what appears to be an almost extreme bevel on the cylinder flutes. Very nice.

Thanks, Bob...I'll try to remember some better pics from different angles after I give it a bath......Ben

 

[Wiregrassguy]

Ben, what is the face of the extractor rod finish? If it's in the white, it's not been refinished.

 

[Truckman]

Ben, what is the face of the extractor rod finish? If it's in the white, it's not been refinished.

It's in the white...Do the lack of trademark and address stampings mean it was produced in the war years?...There are no dished areas in the sideplate or frame flats, no rounded edges......Ben

 

[glowe]

Nice 38 M&P that was most likely shipped in 1918. Logos came back sometime in 1919, so your revolver should not have one. I have a 281,XXX that shipped in mid-1917. The gun looks a little soft, but the image is not detailed enough to be sure of anything. Is the pin right below the cylinder on the left side flat or domed? Stocks are from the correct era and were used from 1910 to 1920, but I cannot make out the number below the serial number? Generally if you find a perfect fit to the frame, it could well be original, but the numbers look more like ink than pencil. They are quite neat and aligned, which is not normally what one finds in the teens and if the number below is the assembly number, I might think someone tried too hard to match a set of stocks to the gun at a date later than factory???

If you take more pictures, a closeup of the left side of the frame and a shot of the top barrel roll stamp would be good. Also a bright closeup picture of the butt-frame would be appreciated. Bottom line is that the finish looks perfectly fresh and the trigger and hammer have a seriously faded case color, which does not seem to match the bluing. Time will tell.

 

[Truckman]

Nice 38 M&P that was most likely shipped in 1918. I have a 281,XXX that shipped in mid-1917. The gun looks a little soft, but the image is not detailed enough to be sure of anything. Is the pin right below the cylinder on the left side flat or domed? Stocks are from the correct era and were used from 1910 to 1920, but I cannot make out the number below the serial number? Generally if you find a perfect fit to the frame, it could well be original, but the numbers in ink are not what is usually found in the teens and if the number below is the assembly number, I might think someone tried too hard to match a set of stocks to the gun at a date later than factory???

If you take more pictures, a closeup of the left side of the frame and a shot of the top barrel roll stamp would be good. Also a bright closeup picture of the butt-frame would be appreciated. Bottom line is that the finish looks perfectly fresh and the trigger and hammer have a seriously faded case color, which does not seem to match the bluing. Time will tell.

Gary, all the pins including the one under the cylinder are domed...My amateurish photography probably belies the pertinent facts...The serial number on the stocks is penciled, but I see what you mean about later replacement...I will take more pics after cleanup, but I bought eight guns at one time this morning and right now, photos will have to wait......Ben

 

[handejector]

Nice old gun. I don't see any indicators of a refinish. Looks righteous to me.

 

[Wiregrassguy]

Ben, your .38 M&P was likely shipped in 1919.

 

[sodacan]

Here's a 4th change for comparison. Dates to 1916. This gun is immaculate.

 

[Truckman]

Here's a 4th change for comparison. Dates to 1916. This gun is immaculate.

I think mine looks just like that in every detail except not near as nice and purdy......Ben

 

[Truckman]

I went ahead and ran this one through Dunkin Gunwash first, then let it stand for a photo op before being tucked away in the safe all warm and cozy in its silicone treated gunsock......Ben

 

[Truckman]

One more......Ben

 

[Truckman]

Roy said it was shipped in March 1919......Ben