Victory Model Painted Black?

[10-12]

I have a Victory Model in .38 S&W caliber (.38 Specials do not fit, too long) with 5-inch barrel with all of the obligatory British proof marks. The top strap has the ordinance bomb and .U.S. PROPERTY GHD. The serial number range is V 351XXX. In addition to the BNP, there are some other marks I cannot identify such as FTR. It is obviously a lend lease Victory but it is not Parkerized. It looks as though it has been painted with black paint. I have seen that type of thing on British Arms so is it possible this pistol has been returned to a British arsenal at some point for a makeover? Does this lessen, increase, or have no appreciable affect on its value?

Thanks,

Bill

 

[10-12]

I have a Victory Model in .38 S&W caliber (.38 Specials do not fit, too long) with 5-inch barrel with all of the obligatory British proof marks. The top strap has the ordinance bomb and .U.S. PROPERTY GHD. The serial number range is V 351XXX. In addition to the BNP, there are some other marks I cannot identify such as FTR. It is obviously a lend lease Victory but it is not Parkerized. It looks as though it has been painted with black paint. I have seen that type of thing on British Arms so is it possible this pistol has been returned to a British arsenal at some point for a makeover? Does this lessen, increase, or have no appreciable affect on its value?

Thanks,

Bill

 

[digi-shots]

Sounds like a nice find! Post some pictures if you can.

This one sounds like an Australian service revolver. Is the FTR stamping followed by the letters MA with a 2 digit number? I've seen similar markings on the right side just in front of the "Made in USA" stamping. The 2 digit number signifies the year of rebuild.

The FTR mark is an arsenal rebuild stamp meaning "Factory Through Repair". Many of the Australian's models had a "black paint" applied during the rebuild process.

 

[10-12]

Thanks for the encouraging words. I traded with a dealer so I was sure I came in second best. I don't have a camera but if I can borrow one, I'll try photos. Meanwhile, here is a verbal description I hope will help.

The FTR is on the right side plate just above the rearmost side plate screw above the right grip. There are no markings other than the FTR. Further to the right is the S&W logo. Forward on the right side just below the MADE IN USA is a mark that appears to be a tree with two boughs sloping slightly downward. To the left of the trunk of the tree is the number 75 or 15 and a J to the right of the trunk. On the left side, the barrel near the frame has the crown with BNP under it. Then there is .38 767 over 3 ½ TONS. There is another crown over BNP on the frame where the barrel enters. Each cylinder has the crown and BNP. Just to the rear of the trigger guard is what appears to be two crossed rifles that form an X. At the left is what appears to be the letter H. Underneath is what appears to be the Number 2 and to the right what appears to be the letter B. Near the back of the frame over the left grip is a symbol that appears to be a Crown over another symbol I can't make out which is over a symbol that looks like two sabers with their blades pointed downward. The right grip panel has a O stamped near the top. About ¼ inch higher, the letter 1 is stamped.

I hope this helps. Again, if I can locate a camera I'll post photos.

Thanks for your help.

Bill

 

[digi-shots]

Pics of the gun would probably help quite a bit.

If there's no MA or numbers after the FTR, then I don't think this is an Australian arsenal rebuild.. but is perhaps a British arsenal rebuild (FTR).

Sounds like your gun has both Military and Commercial markings. The Miltary marking done during WWII and the Commercial after the war (1957)

The ".38 767 3 1/2 Ton" is a British proofing, the numbers basically mean they test fired the gun with that particular charge. They normally tested the gun with a higher charge than normal.

Normally you'll see the BNP mark on the barrel and on each chamber of the cylinder (one for each charge hole). The BNP is a Commercial mark meaning British Nitro Proof (smokeless powder).

The X mark sounds like a Commercial "view mark". After proof firing a weapon a visual inspection was made and when it passed it was stamped with the view mark. H = 1957 and the B = Birmingham (England).. Not sure about the 2.

The Crown over markings on the left side sound like a military stamping.
Do you see the letter "E" ?

There's an excellent book by Charles Pate, U.S. Handguns of WWII. There's a photo on page 110 of a S&W .38/200 with a black paint finish called "Suncorite". Also shown is a unidentifed mark 75^J and an FTR stamping... this pic looks like what you have described.

Hope this helps!

 

[digi-shots]

You mentioned a Crown over something over crossed sabers...

There is a "Dominion of Canada Proof":

It has a Crown over DCP with crossed swords/sabers

 

[10-12]

The Crown over markings on the left side sound like a military stamping.
Do you see the letter "E" ?

My old eyes aren't what they used to be so I could be wrong but it looks more like a C to me. I'm unsure but there may be a slash mark under that and an F below that.

"There is a "Dominion of Canada Proof":

Now that is interesting as well.

"There's an excellent book by Charles Pate, U.S. Handguns of WWII. There's a photo on page 110 of a S&W .38/200 with a black paint finish called "Suncorite". Also shown is a unidentified mark 75^J and an FTR stamping... this pic looks like what you have described."

Is that the book that has all of the nonstandard types instead of the 1911? I'm looking for that as a Christmas present.

Wow! I've been handgunning for more than 50 years and the things I learn on this forum.

I'll work on photos.

Thanks,

Bill

 

[BUFF]

The Brits painted a lot of their martial arms with Suncorite from WWII until very recently. It is a very durable finish, even if it isn't very attractive. One of my favorite rifles, an ex-British Army L1A1 (semiautomatic .308 Win/7.62x51 Commonwealth version of the FN-FAL) is painted that way, and you used to be able to buy spray cans of it from D.S. Arms.

My guess without seeing, it is a British military lend-lease or purchase revolver that was given the stamp and paint job when it went through an English arsenal and was "Factory Thorough Repaired" after the war.

 

[The Virginian]

The British, like other combatants in WWII were more interested in function and durability over looks which is really what matters in wartime. No one will care if your gun is beautifully polished with carbonia blue with checkered walnut grips when you are putting rounds through the enemy in an attack. I'm guessing the enemy won't care much either as he is being unexpectedly "ventilated."