Vintage Rifle Scopes

[TheTinMan]

Although I learned to shoot in the 1960s, I didn’t purchase my first firearm until the late 1980s and my first rifle purchase was in 2009. As a result I don’t know squat about older scopes.

Recently I purchased a Sako A III carbine chambered in .270 Winchester.

It is a unique and beautiful (to my eyes) rifle. Putting a modern wiz-bang scope on it just doesn’t seem right. I’ve started looking for a period correct scope for this rifle (1977-1981). A fixed 2.5x or preferably 4x scope would work. A variable scope with at least 2x and no more than 10x also would be good. Leupold M8 and Vari-X scopes seem to fit the bill. A Burris Scope Chief or Weaver K4 as well.

I found a vendor who specializes in refurbished older scopes but have no idea if they are good or not. I am intrigued by the “TV style” scopes that Weaver and Redfield made in the 1970s. Here’s an example:

Vintage Gun Scopes — Weaver K4-W. 1". c.1973-77. Duplex.

I know it’s goofy looking but I like it for some reason. Maybe growing up in the ‘60s and early ‘70s warped my taste.

Does anyone have experience with VintageGunScopes.com? Any other vendors?

I know that there are tons of scopes for sale on EvilBay, but I don’t want to gamble on the condition of the glass, reticle, or function.

P.S. I know that this is a S&W forum; however, I tried asking on the only rifle forum I participate in actively and got 1 response: buy a new Swarovski scope.

See post #48 for what I eventually mounted on this rifle

 

[alwslate]

Realize that any older Leupold scope like a fixed 4x or Vari-X 2-7x can be sent back to Leupold and refurbished at no cost.

 

[Bald1]

That rifles a beauty. Love mannlicher stocks.

 

[NewLiberty]

Is there a specific reason you are looking at older scopes? Are you mostly looking at it for aesthetic reasons? Or for nostalgia?

The reason I ask is, scope technology has come a long, long way from the 70s. The glass is much better now, as are the lens coatings and the adjustment systems tend to be more repeatable and robust.

Something like the Hi-Lux M40 might fit your needs, which has the aesthetics of the older scopes, but many of the benefits of modern manufacturing and technology.

 

[TheTinMan]

Is there a specific reason you are looking at older scopes? Are you mostly looking at it for aesthetic reasons? Or for nostalgia?

The reason I ask is, scope technology has come a long, long way from the 70s. The glass is much better now, as are the lens coatings and the adjustment systems tend to be more repeatable and robust.

Something like the Hi-Lux M40 might fit your needs, which has the aesthetics of the older scopes, but many of the benefits of modern manufacturing and technology.

Aesthetics first and nostalgia second. I am aware of the advances in scope technology. Leupold makes some attractive fixed power scopes. A Swarovski Z3 3-x36 is an option. That HiLux is an interesting alternative I hadn’t seen - thanks.

 

[NYlakesider]

Aesthetics first and nostalgia second. I am aware of the advances in scope technology. Leupold makes some attractive fixed power scopes. A Swarovski Z3 3-x36 is an option. That HiLux is an interesting alternative I hadn’t seen - thanks.

I have had a bunch of Leupolds over the years, both fixed power and variable and I highly recommend them!

 

[CH4]

Beautiful Sako (Socko) As an avid Sako collector, I’d go with an older, gloss Leupold Vari X II 3-9 in vintage Sako or Leupold medium rings. eBay can be your friend. Will be period correct for you rifle.

The AIII is a transitional gun between the L61R and AV. The AIII has the short tang of the L61R and bolt shroud of the AV, which has a long tang. The AIV action was used only with the Safari Grade.

Here’s one of my Sakos:

L61R (pre Garcia) deluxe barreled by PO Ackley in 6.5-06. It wears a Leupold Vari X III 3.5-10 AO in Millet Rings. Not period correct, but I don’t care.

 

[brendonjames65]

Beautiful rifle and certainly worthy of a nice vintage rifle scope. I have many vintage hunting rifles and most have period correct optics like Weaver K4’s, Redfield Accu Trac 3-9, Leupold fixed 4X, vintage 70’s Leupold Vari XII 3-9, 2-7 and several Bushnell Scope Chief’s in fixed 4X and 3-9 to name some. Bushnell made the Scope Chief not Burris.

All the vintage scopes you mentioned are excellent IMO. I’ve not purchased from vintage gun scopes.com but they seem very legitimate. Most of mine either came with the vintage rifle’s I purchased, rifles passed down from my grandfather and father and eBay but only if they accept returns.

I grew up hunting with vintage rifles and scopes in the 70’s and very early 80’s. That is what my grandfather, uncles and dad all used. A lot of it is nostalgia for me but these scopes are still quite viable. I just used my Winchester pre 64 Model 70 fwt 30-06 mfg in 1956, mounted with a fixed 4X Bushnell Scope Chief to shoot a nice buck this past hunting season. Pic attached.

If a had that Sako, I would mount a period correct Leupold 2-7 Vari-XII. I feel that would be the perfect scope for your rifle.

 

[DWalt]

At present I have six older Weaver 1" fixed power scopes, K2.5, 4, and 6. Two K2.5s are on older .22 rifles. Two K4s (60B) are on vintage Winchester Model 70s. One K6 is on an early Remington 700, the other is on an early Remington 740. All scopes are from the 1950s-60s and all are in high condition. True, scope optical technology has advanced well beyond my old Weavers, but that does not mean the old Weavers are obsolete, far from it. If you want retro scopes to go with retro rifles, you can't go wrong with a Weaver. None of my Weavers are mounted on a rifle of magnum caliber.

 

[dwayne.22]

I have done business with the company you are asking g about. They are very knowledgeable in what they do and can help you with matching the scope with the rifle. I continue to be very pleased with them and plan to do business with them in the future.

 

[s&wchad]

Way too much money for that scope...

An older gloss Leupold Vari-X III 2.5-8X, 1.75-6X or a 1.5-5X would be a great match for your gun.

I picked up a an older Zeiss 4X for $300 and put it on a custom Winchester model 70. The optics on the Zeiss and the Leupolds blow old Weavers out of the water and Leupold offers a lifetime warranty. You're on your own with an old Weaver.

 

[clang444]

There used to be a company in Texas called Weaver Scope Repair or something similar that reconditioned old Weaver Scopes for a reasonable cost. I had an old Weaver Marksman 1"x 4x done by them maybe 20 years ago. I still have it and it still works great. They did replace the crosshairs with a duplex reticle.

I think Weaver Scope Repair went out of business years ago.

 

[rockquarry]

I've had probably twenty or more of the older Weavers; still have three or four. Two-thirds have been K-4s. The adjustments are often not repeatable on these older scopes, but once zeroed they generally hold that zero well. Optics aren't the best but even a K-4 is adequate for 300 yard shots on deer-sized game.

Lowered-powered scopes are not popular today and many scoff at their use, but most of the critics have no experience with them. Nevertheless, K-3s, K-4s, and K-6s remain quite useful. K-6s were advertised in the 50s and '60s as being "long-range" scopes.

 

[gdogs]

I have several older Weaver K4's, always on the lookout for a post and crosshair K6. I also have some older Redfields that were made in Colorado and are excellent vintage scopes. Can never go wrong with Leupold.

 

[Glynn863]

I have also done business with Vintage Gun Scopes. They had adjustment knob covers available for an old Weaver Marksman that I was gifted. Fairly priced, and quick shipping.

 

[mckenney99]

+1 for a gloss finished Leupold 1 inch tube 2x7 or 3x9. They are hard to beat and they stand behind their scopes.

 

[BB57]

The vintage steel tube K-4 and K-6 scopes are bullet proof and are classic designs. They are perfect for a vintage rifle.

 

[BB57]

I've had probably twenty or more of the older Weavers; still have three or four. Two-thirds have been K-4s. The adjustments are often not repeatable on these older scopes, but once zeroed they generally hold that zero well. Optics aren't the best but even a K-4 is adequate for 300 yard shots on deer-sized game.

Lowered-powered scopes are not popular today and many scoff at their use, but most of the critics have no experience with them. Nevertheless, K-3s, K-4s, and K-6s remain quite useful. K-6s were advertised in the 50s and '60s as being "long-range" scopes.

Yes sir, back in the day the K-4 and other 4x scopes were considered ideal for hunting east of the Mississippi and the K-6 and other 6x scopes were considered ideal for hunting west of the Mississippi.

If you do some research on Weaver’s range finding reticle you’ll find it was designed to allow accurate range estimation and hunting to ethical hunting ranges out to 500 yards.

Given the long standing and still valid half second rule, and the realities of bullet expansion and terminal performance below 1600 fps, very few cartridges today can make consistent, clean, ethical kills beyond about 500 yards and those that do only exceed it by 150-200 yards. And those hunters still need to be aware of the limits involved with game startling due to muzzle flash or birds spooking due to the gun shot and the related 1/2 second rule.

I’m old school and even for long range shooting 1x per 100 yards is ample magnification.

Unfortunately way too many shooters mistake magnification for resolution and think more magnification will give them a clearer view of the target. That’s not the case. Resolution depends on objective diameter and lens quality. Period. Full stop.

In fact if you over magnify the image the exit pupil of the scope becomes too small to fully illuminate the fovea on your retina and the resulting image starts looking dim and grainy.

Exit pupil is determined by the objective diameter and magnification. So a 4-14x56 scope will offer an exit pupil of 4mm which is well matched to the size of your pupil on a heavy overcast day or around dawn and dusk. Most adults only have an exit pupil around 5-6mm so earlier or later in the day they could still use 9x with a 56 mm objective and have a 6mm exit pupil.

In contrast the tacticool wannabe with a 4-32x50mm scope will only be able to use 12x on a heavy over cast day before the image gets dim and grainy and at or just after dusk the limit will be 8x.

Worse, if they chose a first focal plane reticle they will be working with a reticle that is only 37% to 25% of its regular size at 12x and 8x. That will be a tiny, hard to see reticle and the hawk marks will be near useless for hold offs.

In short, more isn’t better.

The old K-4 and K-6 scopes with 38 mm objectives still gave 6.3mm exit pupils for the K6 and 9.5mm for the K-4. Despite the small objective and less effective anti reflective coating at the time they were still very good in low light conditions.

 

[DWalt]

My K6 Weavers are from the late 1960s. Optics and sharpness are very good, and I consider 6X to be a little more magnification than I need. While I have several variable power scopes, I can live without them just fine. My hunting usually does not involve taking shots at much more than 100 yards. As I mentioned, I have two K2.5 Weavers mounted on .22 rifles using 1" mounts. They are ideal, far better than any 3/4" .22 scopes. I know about parallax differences, but for a scope with only 2.5X magnification, that is in no way significant. I once had an older Weaver scope with sort of a post reticle, fairly low power but I do not remember what it was. It was in well-used cosmetic condition and it couldn't be trusted to hold a zero, so I sold it for a few bucks.

 

[TheTinMan]

Wow! Your responses are fantastic - thank you all.