Weird results seating my first 223...any advice?

[typetwelve]

Ok...the data:

RCBS Rock Chucker
Lee 223 seating die
Processed, once fired Fiocchi brass, all at 1.750"
69g Sierra Match King projectiles

I was aiming for Sierra's listed 2.260". I goofed around and no matter how hard I try, They are coming in from 2.256"-2.262" and nothing consistent. I marked the shells to keep track of them, pulled the bullets, mixed them up, then re-seated. Every time I'm randomly getting those seating lengths and where it falls in that rage changes each time. I can run one that seats at 2.261" over and over, then go to the next and it will seat at 2.256", or 58, or whatever. Pull the bullets, start over, get the same random results.

I cycled them through my AR and all are fine, none hang up, all seat just fine.

Am I splitting hairs here? This is my first time reloading where OAL is that tight...perhaps this is normal and I just don't know it.

 

[Sevens]

Many folks have hd success using a small tool called a comparator, you place it over the bullet tip when using your caliber, it allows you to measure a length using the bullet ogive rather than the tip.

I don’t own one. Then again, 97% of my handloading is handguns, I only dabble in rifles. If I were you, I wouldn’t fret much and see what your ammo does at the range.

 

[andy52]

Yes on the spitting hairs. As with all magazine feed guns as long as they feed out of the magazine without jamming it really doesn't much, just try not to set the bullet to deep.

 

[Imissedagain]

No Lee quality jokes but the shape of the bullet might not match the seater die shape or crush the tip a bit.
If it's a medium load the .003" up or down from your desired OAL would not be an issue to me.

 

[Just another 22 shooter]

You're talking .006". Unless you are a super great rifle competition shooter and you have a very high end rifle, yes you are splitting hairs. Take your handloads to the range and enjoy yourself.

 

[lrrifleman]

typetwelve, you are caught by a common error, you are presuming that all of the projectiles are the same length. Sevens is correct with reference to the collometer. You are looking for a uniform cartridge length based off the ogive. With the COAL you are getting, you should be fine, but anticipate some variations in your group sizes because of potentially inconsistent seating depths.

 

[gregintenn]

Weigh each of those bullets and you'll really pull your hair out. They aren't perfect! Load em up, shoot em, and enjoy.

 

[AlHunt]

typetwelve, you are caught by a common error, you are presuming that all of the projectiles are the same length. Sevens is correct with reference to the collometer. You are looking for a uniform cartridge length based off the ogive. With the COAL you are getting, you should be fine, but anticipate some variations in your group sizes because of potentially inconsistent seating depths.

This may be off track a little, but even if the bullet lengths vary, why would COL vary? It should be the same length from the seater stem to the shell holder. It seems like the variance would be how much bullet is inside the casing.

I'd agree that for everyday shooting in an AR, +/- .003 shouldn't matter as long as they cycle.

 

[Culina]

Measure some factory ammo and see how consistent that is. Also, set your calipers at 0.006" and see if how much of a difference you are talking about.

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

This may be off track a little, but even if the bullet lengths vary, why would COL vary? It should be the same length from the seater stem to the shell holder. It seems like the variance would be how much bullet is inside the casing.

I'd agree that for everyday shooting in an AR, +/- .003 shouldn't matter as long as they cycle.

The bullet is seated not from the tip of the bullet, but by where the seating stem engages the Ogive. It grabs the bullet by a specific diameter at a point along the curved nose of the bullet. When the cartridge 6.5 x 284 Win first came out, the bullet to use was SMK 140 grain! I was at a friend's home, he had 3 bowls of bullets and was separating those bullets into them. At that time Sierra had 3 dies they did the final striking with and that left the bullets with 3 different profiles. He would take 500 bullets and separate them, so all the ammo in that batch had the exact same overall length. That ammo was known to shoot 1.5 to 2" at 800 meters (basically 1/4 MOA, at distance!) Was separating the bullets really necessary? Maybe/maybe not! Be he makes some really good shooting ammo!

Some of the competition seating dies have a Micrometer adjustment, for placing where the diameter of the bullet is seated in relation to the inside diameter of the rifling lands. This point is usually called the datum point, and is only critical in very accurate single shot bolt action rifles.

When you come up with really good ammo, you get superstitious about it and will got to any length to reproduce it!

Ivan

 

[rockquarry]

The bullet seating die seats off the ogive, not the end of the bullet. When you find an overall length for a particular bullet you like that shoots well and will fit the magazine, measure with a Sinclair "nut" (inexpensive) and record the measurement for reference. I've used a "nut" for at least thirty-five years and it works at least as well as more expensive gadgets.

 

[Jellybean]

Measure some bullets by themselves, if they give you the same difference as your reloads you'll know it's the bullets.

 

[RodD]

All correct answers. Look closely at the open tip of your bullets. You'll see they are different production lots. Multiple machines at work here

 

[Shotguncoach]

Another vote for inconsistent tips. I use quite a few 69 grain SMK's and have found a large (to me) variation in the shape of the jacket at the very tip. Grab 8 or 10 individual bullets and a magnifying glass....you'll see everything from a perfect hollow point to a crooked smile to a harelip.

My method is to sort through the box until I find a couple that have as close to a perfect hollow point as I can find, then I set the seating die using those. All the others get seated on the same setting and just fall where they may.

That method gets me 1/2 MOA out of two different rifles, so I'm happy with it. If I "need" smaller groups than that I switch to Nosler ballistic tips.

 

[Nevada Ed]

As you load you will lean that the Ogive on the bullets nose as well as the lead tip on Spitzers and different shaped copper HP designs..........................

all seat a little different in a seating die and will even be different out of the same box !!

Relax and don't sweat the small stuff.

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

Rockquarry referred to the Sinclair "Nut", it has been out of production for about 10 years now! Since Brownell's owns Sinclair, they have shown no interest in restarting production. You could make one but getting the diameters correct would be the problem! I have both sizes, and was going tp request a special order for other diameters, but they were bought out!

The loss of Sinclair's store and their unique products is a great loss to the entire shooting community!

Ivan

 

[rockquarry]

Rockquarry referred to the Sinclair "Nut", it has been out of production for about 10 years now! Since Brownell's owns Sinclair, they have shown no interest in restarting production. You could make one but getting the diameters correct would be the problem! I have both sizes, and was going tp request a special order for other diameters, but they were bought out!

The loss of Sinclair's store and their unique products is a great loss to the entire shooting community!

Ivan

Sorry, I was unaware the "nut" was no longer made. What a simple and useful tool...

 

[Johnrh]

Isn't this what Rockquarry is talking about? SINCLAIR INTERNATIONAL SINCLAIR HEX STYLE BULLET COMPARATORS | Sinclair Intl

 

[rockquarry]

Isn't this what Rockquarry is talking about? SINCLAIR INTERNATIONAL SINCLAIR HEX STYLE BULLET COMPARATORS | Sinclair Intl

Yeah, that's it! So they are still in production after all? Good

 

[fredj338]

Ok...the data:

RCBS Rock Chucker
Lee 223 seating die
Processed, once fired Fiocchi brass, all at 1.750"
69g Sierra Match King projectiles

I was aiming for Sierra's listed 2.260". I goofed around and no matter how hard I try, They are coming in from 2.256"-2.262" and nothing consistent. I marked the shells to keep track of them, pulled the bullets, mixed them up, then re-seated. Every time I'm randomly getting those seating lengths and where it falls in that rage changes each time. I can run one that seats at 2.261" over and over, then go to the next and it will seat at 2.256", or 58, or whatever. Pull the bullets, start over, get the same random results.

I cycled them through my AR and all are fine, none hang up, all seat just fine.

Am I splitting hairs here? This is my first time reloading where OAL is that tight...perhaps this is normal and I just don't know it.

Yeah you are splitting hairs. Put 0.005" on a caliper & look at it. Variation in nose profile & mixed number of firings on brass will easily cause +/- 0.005". It isn't going to, affect accuracy imo.