Without a serial number on the bottom of the grip frame, it's probably just contraband...I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but I wouldn't go showing it off to others......Ben
Without pics, it's really hard to tell anything
What do I have
- Thread starter Jason71
- Start date
Without pics, it's really hard to tell anything
Agreed, and from what I've read in this thread, it's probably best left that way...
...BenHopefully I get some pictures on here today the gun was bought from a licensed dealer so if the sn missing on bottom is a big problem I will take gun back and find out what's going on hopefully, I was told the serial number should be somewhere else on the gun somewhere but I don't no if that is true I'm hoping so or the gun store has some explaining to do
StrawHat
Member
I reached out to Jason71. Here are images he sent me.
I don't have an image of the butt, so …
What I found odd was the rib on the barrel. I thought this era barrels were plain, not ribbed. Someone help me out on that point.
Kevin
I don't have an image of the butt, so …
What I found odd was the rib on the barrel. I thought this era barrels were plain, not ribbed. Someone help me out on that point.
Kevin
Attachments
The numbers on the cylinder match the numbers on the underside of barrel I took wood handles of there is a number stamped in the back right side of wood handle I can not read there is also a V and the number 5 stamped on the frame under handle
An aftermarket rib has been added to the factory barrel.
Jason71, I hope you have an understanding gun dealer. Some folks don't like being told they are wrong, but with early S&W revolvers, the number stamped on the frame behind the yoke (the part that holds the cylinder) is an assembly number, NOT the factory serial number. The factory serial number is supposed to be stamped on the butt of your revolver. Since the barrel and cylinder are replaceable parts, the BATF-E does not consider the SN stamps on those parts as the true serial number.
Jason71, I hope you have an understanding gun dealer. Some folks don't like being told they are wrong, but with early S&W revolvers, the number stamped on the frame behind the yoke (the part that holds the cylinder) is an assembly number, NOT the factory serial number. The factory serial number is supposed to be stamped on the butt of your revolver. Since the barrel and cylinder are replaceable parts, the BATF-E does not consider the SN stamps on those parts as the true serial number.
May I suggest you return with it to the seller and see about trading it for a gun you will have a legal basis to own...A legitimate dealer will do this...
...BenYou have a WW II version of the .38 Military & Police revolver, known as the British Service Revolver aka British Victory Model. It is chambered in .38 S&W. Some of these have been rechambered to .38 special. If so, both rounds can be fired in this handgun.
S&W did not adopt model numbers until 1957, so your revolver has a name, not a model number.
Ok really appreciate all the info this site is amazing very good information I think I will try to take it back like ben said and see if they will trade for another gun cause I don't wanna get caught with this one that's for sure thanks guys
Wow, that just highlights what I said in post #22.
To me that would be like carrying a ghost gun so someone is wrong and I'm still to scared to carry it all my other firearms are legal and in my name this one has nothing and they are telling me I can carry it legal that sounds crazy to me am I wrong
Yes and no...Yes, no guns were required to have serial numbers prior to 1968 with the Gun Control Act becoming law, and when I logged one in to my bound book, I wrote in "NSN" for "No Seral Number"...After the GCA became law, all newly manufactured and imported guns were required to have a S/N unique to that manufacturer or importer...No, your gun has no legitimacy because the original serial number applied to the gun by S&W has been obliterated, and is therefore just contraband in the view of the ever-zealous ATF...I personally know some compliance inspectors and enforcement agents who would just look the other way while telling you not to show it to anyone...Others, looking for a quick path to career advancement, would confiscate it and initiate an investigation...The seller in your case, if an FFL holder, knows the law and is just trying to cover his own tracks while leaving you holding the bag...
The simple answer is you can't...I would advise making a big enough noise with your dealer until he feels compelled to refund your money, then take your business elsewhere...
...Ben
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Member
I am not aware of any S&W revolver that left the factory without a serial number. Even the experimental piece had a number from what I have been told.
This "dealer" is not honest or he is just plain ignorant.
Ben, what would ATF do if they found he was making up information to put in the book? Bet they would not be too happy.
Jason, if it were me, I would be back there tomorrow and ask again for a refund. If they refuse, let us know the name and location of the shop.
Kevin
This "dealer" is not honest or he is just plain ignorant.
Ben, what would ATF do if they found he was making up information to put in the book? Bet they would not be too happy.
Jason, if it were me, I would be back there tomorrow and ask again for a refund. If they refuse, let us know the name and location of the shop.
Kevin
I can only guess at that, Kevin...Some of the compliance inspectors I've known seem to be on individual power trips, trying to make a name to move up the ladder...Others just want to do their jobs, assure compliance with the laws and rules...The code governing the behavior of FFL's is so complex, and sometimes contradictory, that no one person can possibly know or comprehend the intent of all...
At one time I knew an inspector from the Houston office whom I could and did call to get interpretations on vague rules...After a time, he began to call me for my opinion of interpretations since he became convinced that I dealt on the up and up...Some of our most spirited discussions involved PLR's (Private Letter Ruling) in which an FFL would write a letter to the ATF concerning a point of law, receive an answer, and the letter exchange became a defacto ruling applied to all FFL's under a certain circumstance...
in the case of the subject of this thread, if the buyer gets no satisfaction from the dealer, and consequently presents the case to his local ATF office, it's almost guaranteed the gun would be confiscated as contraband...My guess is that no action would be taken against the buyer who acted in good faith, and willingly took the gun to the ATF for counsel and advice...
However, the seedy FFL would almost certainly become the subject of a thorough investigation in which he would be examined in every orifice for more infractions...Depending then on results of the investigation, the FFL could face a heavy fine, suspension or loss of license and possibly criminal charges...The FFL would have to be a total moron to deny the buyer a complete refund rather than face the kind of hell the ATF can put him through...
My advice to our member here, the buyer, would be arrange a meeting with the licensee of this gunshop, not just a counterman, tell his story and ask for a complete refund of his money...Unless the licensee is a low-grade moron, he'll get it...If not, my next stop would be the local ATF office...There the worst he could likely expect, since he is voluntarily presenting the evidence, would be the loss of the firearm...That itself is more favorable than being found in a situation in the future holding a defaced gun...He could also sue the licensee in small claims court for the loss...
...Ben
StrawHat
Member
I can only guess at that, Kevin...Some of the compliance inspectors I've known seem to be on individual power trips, trying to make a name to move up the ladder...Others just want to do their jobs, assure compliance with the laws and rules...The code governing the behavior of FFL's is so complex, and sometimes contradictory, that no one person can possibly know or comprehend the intent of all...
At one time I knew an inspector from the Houston office whom I could and did call to get interpretations on vague rules...After a time, he began to call me for my opinion of interpretations since he became convinced that I dealt on the up and up...Some of our most spirited discussions involved PLR's (Private Letter Ruling) in which an FFL would write a letter to the ATF concerning a point of law, receive an answer, and the letter exchange became a defacto ruling applied to all FFL's under a certain circumstance...
in the case of the subject of this thread, if the buyer gets no satisfaction from the dealer, and consequently presents the case to his local ATF office, it's almost guaranteed the gun would be confiscated as contraband...My guess is that no action would be taken against the buyer who acted in good faith, and willingly took the gun to the ATF for counsel and advice...
However, the seedy FFL would almost certainly become the subject of a thorough investigation in which he would be examined in every orifice for more infractions...Depending then on results of the investigation, the FFL could face a heavy fine, suspension or loss of license and possibly criminal charges...The FFL would have to be a total moron to deny the buyer a complete refund rather than face the kind of hell the ATF can put him through...
My advice to our member here, the buyer, would be arrange a meeting with the licensee of this gunshop, not just a counterman, tell his story and ask for a complete refund of his money...Unless the licensee is a low-grade moron, he'll get it...If not, my next stop would be the local ATF office...There the worst he could likely expect, since he is voluntarily presenting the evidence, would be the loss of the firearm...That itself is more favorable than being found in a situation in the future holding a defaced gun...He could also sue the licensee in small claims court for the loss...
Very much what I thought. I agree, the FFL should be willing to refund.
Thank you for your perspective.
Kevin
