ironhead7544
Member
G34. Easy to make hits with at 100 yards.
This will back up my AR-15 in 300 Blackout.
This will back up my AR-15 in 300 Blackout.
What is your Go to War Sidearm?
- Thread starter Echo40
- Start date
Eddie Southgate
Member
What ever 9mm I find in the holster of one of my early victims. I don't own one so i will adopt the first one I find that I like because 9mm will be easy to get off of corpses. I would prefer my 1911 in .45 ACP but there will be more people carrying 9mm so that will be the easiest to keep fed. .
PS : Anything except Glocks , I hate Glocks .
PS : Anything except Glocks , I hate Glocks .
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Eddie Southgate
Member
Until you run out of ammo . Not gonna be a lot of free 5.7x28 laying around for the taking.
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Echo40
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I must say, I really don't understand the concept of carrying a weapon chambered in 9mm for battlefield pickups.
The rationality is based upon the presumption that NATO Forces would be involved in whatever conflict is going on, yet apparently doing so poorly that they're getting wiped out and leaving a decent supply of unexpended ammo behind for civilians to safely scavenge at their convenience, which strikes me as highly unlikely.
However, my rationality is that if there is going to be much ammo available to pick up from fallen combatants, (which isn't for certain) then obviously their weapons will also be available for pickup, so I'd rather start by carrying something that I feel especially confident with than carry something that I'm not simply because I can salvage ammo for it more readily.
Granted, if you're absolutely confident with 9mm Parabellum FMJ, then this won't be a factor, but personally I'm not, so I'd rather start with something I'm more confident with, then transition to whatever I can scrounge up off the battlefield once I've run out of ammo for my sidearm of choice.
Honestly, no disrespect towards the military, but the standard issue 9mm NATO FMJ just doesn't seem like the most effective handgun round out there, and what's more, a lot of soldiers seems to be of the sentiment that the standard issue ammunition isn't of the highest quality either, so to me, the potential availability of salvageable battlefield ammunition wouldn't be a deciding factor in what I carry. Sure, I'd scrounge up any ammo I might find on the battlefield along with any compatible firearms, but it wouldn't be my first choice. Maybe if the military were at least carrying high quality JHP ammunition, then that would be a more convincing reason to carry a 9mm Pistol from the get-go, but they carry FMJ, hot loaded FMJ ammo, but non-expanding FMJ nonetheless. Stuff that zips straight through a target with a wound diameter no greater than the projectile itself, and a rounded tip which parts tissue more than it crushes or tears.
Personally, I would much rather have a firearm of my own choice with an adequate supply of high quality JHP ammo than compromise by carrying a 9mm Pistol which I could just as easily pickup later with whatever hypothetical supply of 9mm NATO I could loot off of fallen soldiers.
The rationality is based upon the presumption that NATO Forces would be involved in whatever conflict is going on, yet apparently doing so poorly that they're getting wiped out and leaving a decent supply of unexpended ammo behind for civilians to safely scavenge at their convenience, which strikes me as highly unlikely.
However, my rationality is that if there is going to be much ammo available to pick up from fallen combatants, (which isn't for certain) then obviously their weapons will also be available for pickup, so I'd rather start by carrying something that I feel especially confident with than carry something that I'm not simply because I can salvage ammo for it more readily.
Granted, if you're absolutely confident with 9mm Parabellum FMJ, then this won't be a factor, but personally I'm not, so I'd rather start with something I'm more confident with, then transition to whatever I can scrounge up off the battlefield once I've run out of ammo for my sidearm of choice.
Honestly, no disrespect towards the military, but the standard issue 9mm NATO FMJ just doesn't seem like the most effective handgun round out there, and what's more, a lot of soldiers seems to be of the sentiment that the standard issue ammunition isn't of the highest quality either, so to me, the potential availability of salvageable battlefield ammunition wouldn't be a deciding factor in what I carry. Sure, I'd scrounge up any ammo I might find on the battlefield along with any compatible firearms, but it wouldn't be my first choice. Maybe if the military were at least carrying high quality JHP ammunition, then that would be a more convincing reason to carry a 9mm Pistol from the get-go, but they carry FMJ, hot loaded FMJ ammo, but non-expanding FMJ nonetheless. Stuff that zips straight through a target with a wound diameter no greater than the projectile itself, and a rounded tip which parts tissue more than it crushes or tears.
Personally, I would much rather have a firearm of my own choice with an adequate supply of high quality JHP ammo than compromise by carrying a 9mm Pistol which I could just as easily pickup later with whatever hypothetical supply of 9mm NATO I could loot off of fallen soldiers.
@ Forte,
Did you just change the scenario? Initially, your scenario read as if we'd be going to battle to defend the United States from an invader (essentially defending the home turf). It didn't read as though we'd be assisting a foreign nation as mercenaries or the resistance!
From the perspective of defending the home turf, follow the tenants of the unorganized militia, which is prescribed by US Code. Employ military style weapons of military caliber, and resupply from friendly forces. If you fall behind enemy lines, utilize battlefield pickups first. Scavenge the enemy for weapons, ammo, and intelligence. When behind enemy lines, become the resistance and harass the daylights out of the enemy's rear area in order to draw frontline forces from combat!
Did you just change the scenario? Initially, your scenario read as if we'd be going to battle to defend the United States from an invader (essentially defending the home turf). It didn't read as though we'd be assisting a foreign nation as mercenaries or the resistance!
From the perspective of defending the home turf, follow the tenants of the unorganized militia, which is prescribed by US Code. Employ military style weapons of military caliber, and resupply from friendly forces. If you fall behind enemy lines, utilize battlefield pickups first. Scavenge the enemy for weapons, ammo, and intelligence. When behind enemy lines, become the resistance and harass the daylights out of the enemy's rear area in order to draw frontline forces from combat!
This has all been covered in depth in the Chronicles of Gecko45.
Forte Smitten Wesson, it's my understanding (and I could be wrong) that the Geneva Convention banned militaries from carrying JHPs, limiting them instead to FMJs. Of course, I'm sure that the Russians are strictly abiding by that in the Ukraine War (sarcasm). Anyone know for sure?
Since there is little doubt I would
quickly receive several battlefield promotions
I will go with this 1911....perfect for a newly appointed
4 star.
quickly receive several battlefield promotions
I will go with this 1911....perfect for a newly appointed
4 star.
hollow points are banned by the hague conventions, not geneva, and notably the us did not actually sign that section.
A few years ago before I retired I purchased Glock 17 & 19 Gen. 3’s and a bunch of spare mags for this purpose. I carried M1911A1’s in the Army and I enjoy shooting mine but carrying a lighter weight pistol that requires almost no maintenance during wartime conditions makes more sense to me. 1*
I have a lot of options.
I’d probably choose of of my Hi Powers. I carried one for over a decade, it’s accurate, reliable, has 15+1 capacity, I shoot it very well and it’ll be shooting widely available 9mm Luger ammo.
Option two would be my CZ-75 SP01 Tactical for the same reasons, plus a few more rounds in the magazine.
In both cases they’ll get me back to my vehicle and something more capable:
Which will get me to something more capable:
I’d probably choose of of my Hi Powers. I carried one for over a decade, it’s accurate, reliable, has 15+1 capacity, I shoot it very well and it’ll be shooting widely available 9mm Luger ammo.
Option two would be my CZ-75 SP01 Tactical for the same reasons, plus a few more rounds in the magazine.
In both cases they’ll get me back to my vehicle and something more capable:
Which will get me to something more capable:
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Bajadoc
US Veteran
Model 19 with Hogue rubber grips.
I don't know about you folks, but if I'm protecting my home turf, I'm sure as heck not going to care about what some bureaucrats, diplomats, and politicians put down in writing as to what kind of ammo I'm supposed to use.
I've shared this quote before, but it bears repeating:
"There is only one way to fight, and that's dirty. Clean gentlemanly fighting will get you nowhere but dead, and fast. Take every cheap shot, every low blow, absolutely kick people when they're down, and maybe you'll be the one who walks away."
So, in a scenario where the proverbial "ship hits the sand," I don't plan on following any convention's rules of fair play.
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Good points, Mule Packer, and you gave me some ideas that I hadn't thought of to ponder.
If battlefield pick ups consist of military-issued FMJ ammo, I'd be reluctant to use FMJs out of the risk of over-penetration harming innocent third parties, or does that really matter, because anyone behind the bad guys is reasonably unlikely to be an innocent third party?
Does anyone know whether the Geneva and Hague Conventions apply to civilians (not political officials or sworn peace officers) fighting off military invaders and/or SHTF/internal civil wars, especially trying civilians for war crimes and crimes against humanity, e.g. shooting surenderees and not taking prisoners due to lack of ability to detain them?
Along those lines, would the normal rule of law be relaxed as to self-defense, say excessive force and reasonable belief of imminent threat to life and limb?
If battlefield pick ups consist of military-issued FMJ ammo, I'd be reluctant to use FMJs out of the risk of over-penetration harming innocent third parties, or does that really matter, because anyone behind the bad guys is reasonably unlikely to be an innocent third party?
Does anyone know whether the Geneva and Hague Conventions apply to civilians (not political officials or sworn peace officers) fighting off military invaders and/or SHTF/internal civil wars, especially trying civilians for war crimes and crimes against humanity, e.g. shooting surenderees and not taking prisoners due to lack of ability to detain them?
Along those lines, would the normal rule of law be relaxed as to self-defense, say excessive force and reasonable belief of imminent threat to life and limb?
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I like the 1911A1... I like the BHP... but for the practically of adaptation I would probably take my SIG P250... 9mm, 40S&W, 357SIG & 45ACP... Compact grip full size slides.. same magazines as P320 M17/M18...
I'm with Muss on this, Ruger 57 with 5 20rd magazines.
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