I usually tell them that I'd like large fries with that! 
When I talk to Liberal Arts and Philosophy majors....
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forindooruseonly
Member
Just out of curiosity, what compelled you post that?
Calaveras Slim
US Veteran
I say, coffee, please. And eggs, over medium
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shaggist
US Veteran
Fast food places will serve ANYONE!
shouldazagged
Absent Comrade
No education is ever wasted. A liberal arts education (a couple of degrees) never made big money for me, but I made a living for 54 years and gained a broad field of interests and a rich view of life.
Never asked anyone but dinner guests in my home if they wanted fries with their entrée.
I don't regret a minute of it. I still, after almost six years retired, try to learn a few new things every day, and the range of subjects remains wide.
By the way, the undergraduate degree was in philosophy and religion.
Never asked anyone but dinner guests in my home if they wanted fries with their entrée.
I don't regret a minute of it. I still, after almost six years retired, try to learn a few new things every day, and the range of subjects remains wide.
By the way, the undergraduate degree was in philosophy and religion.
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Art Doc
SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
A liberal arts education isn't a vocational program. It doesn't prepare the student for a specific job or career. What it does is give the student a broad background of knowledge, and the ability to use information more effectively.
Most college grads do not work in fields related to their degrees. But the college experience prepared them to accept challenges and overcome problems. Some employers demand a college degree even though the position doesn't require a specific college preparation. They see the college graduate as someone who is broadly knowledgeable and able to finish something he started.
I graduated five times with degrees in five different fields. I have an AS in industrial arts, I have a BS in liberal arts (oops, my bias is showing), a BA in fine art (needed for admission to the next one), MA in art history, finally an Ed.D. in higher education leadership. The last one is a vocational degree, like an MD or a DDS. The first one is also a vocational degree. The middle three are liberal arts oriented. Wouldn't trade the experience for the world.
Lots of jokes about liberal arts majors. Mostly made by people who didn't finish college.
Most college grads do not work in fields related to their degrees. But the college experience prepared them to accept challenges and overcome problems. Some employers demand a college degree even though the position doesn't require a specific college preparation. They see the college graduate as someone who is broadly knowledgeable and able to finish something he started.
I graduated five times with degrees in five different fields. I have an AS in industrial arts, I have a BS in liberal arts (oops, my bias is showing), a BA in fine art (needed for admission to the next one), MA in art history, finally an Ed.D. in higher education leadership. The last one is a vocational degree, like an MD or a DDS. The first one is also a vocational degree. The middle three are liberal arts oriented. Wouldn't trade the experience for the world.
Lots of jokes about liberal arts majors. Mostly made by people who didn't finish college.
carpriver
US Veteran
He is a graduate of a tech school and a highly paid welder. I try not to look down on anyone regardless of the education or field of endeavor. After I graduated from collage with a degree in social work I worked in a car wash making $5.25 per hour. It paid the bills was honest work and help me appreciate my new job when it came through. We never should judge someone that might be working in what we might think is a minimum wage job. They are working, paying taxes and like it or not are providing a service.
I have always tried to look at all sides of an issue and understand other peoples perspective. However, understanding it does not mean I agree with it. One professor I had used to say - Education is a wonderful thing as long as you don't believe it is the only thing. I then see the anti's and I don't see any education and certainly no perspective of other peoples views.
Well, I guess you can't fix the world.
Well, I guess you can't fix the world.
Weimar
US Veteran
In the IT Security field, I have found that History and other 'liberal' arts have an open mind and learn security better than some of the folks who have always been IT Computers guys. 
Seldom
Member
A BA or BS is just the beginning. It just proves that you have learned how to study. I didn't use my BA in Economics but wouldn't trade the experience for a ton of unfired S&W classics. BTW if anyone is interested in superb and varied college level classes without the exams, take a look at the Teaching Company's Great Courses website. They are not accredited but will open up new horizons in history, science, business, math, music, art and philosophy for anyone. Or not. But if not, then just consider the following quote by Thomas Carlyle: "The tragedy in life is not what men suffer but what they miss." Deb and I have forty of these wonderful audio and DVD classes.
BTW a liberal arts education doesn't necessarily make one a liberal. All of my Econ profs at San Jose State were conservatives with one exception. The latter was a Communist but his lectures were absolutely spellbinding.
BTW a liberal arts education doesn't necessarily make one a liberal. All of my Econ profs at San Jose State were conservatives with one exception. The latter was a Communist but his lectures were absolutely spellbinding.
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I was a music major, for crying out loud. My other interest was writing and poetry. I ended up as the Security Sergeant at a prison in Fairbanks Alaska! There has to be a formula for life. Maybe: What you want divided by what you know, times what your wife thinks, minus mouths to feed, and multiply it all by whatever line of BS you can think up at your job interview! That, less a few points for self esteem, is what they scratch on your tombstone. What the Hell.
Way back when--unfortunately when I had already completed college--I stumbled across this statement: "The only use of an education is that it helps you understand when a man is talking nonsense".
I got my degree in a nuts and bolts field. Other than getting my foot in the company door, it had almost no value in real life. Today that's even more true. What's really needed in the real world is a good BS detector (see "the only use of an education" above) and oddly enough history, liberal arts, and--get ready--philosophy--got me through some tough times.
"He who does not know what the world is, does not know where he is. And he who does not know for what purpose the world exists, does not know who he is or what the world is. But he who has failed in any one of these things could not even say for what purpose he exists himself..." Marcus Aurelius, "Meditations", (121 AD-179 AD)
I'm a very satisfied customer of those Great Courses; the brick and mortar schools don't know it yet, but they're doomed. All we've got to do is figure out how to verify that useful learning has occurred in a given situation and issue a credential to that effect.
And by the way, you've already done it if you ever got a Boy Scout merit badge...
I got my degree in a nuts and bolts field. Other than getting my foot in the company door, it had almost no value in real life. Today that's even more true. What's really needed in the real world is a good BS detector (see "the only use of an education" above) and oddly enough history, liberal arts, and--get ready--philosophy--got me through some tough times.
"He who does not know what the world is, does not know where he is. And he who does not know for what purpose the world exists, does not know who he is or what the world is. But he who has failed in any one of these things could not even say for what purpose he exists himself..." Marcus Aurelius, "Meditations", (121 AD-179 AD)
I'm a very satisfied customer of those Great Courses; the brick and mortar schools don't know it yet, but they're doomed. All we've got to do is figure out how to verify that useful learning has occurred in a given situation and issue a credential to that effect.
And by the way, you've already done it if you ever got a Boy Scout merit badge...
Well, not much of a sense of humor here tonight...
As they say, you can always tell a tenured professor. You just can't tell him much.......
As they say, you can always tell a tenured professor. You just can't tell him much.......
OP
Art Doc
SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
At the college where I got my BA and MA the art department was right next to the business department in separate buildings. Between classes the students from both would pour out onto the sidewalk and mingle as they made their way across campus. It was very amusing. The business majors in their suits and carrying brief cases along with the art majors in paint-stained sweat shirts carrying portfolio packages under their arms. Each convinced the other was nuts.
Re: College degree in liberal arts, etc. When I went to college, I double majored in business and minored in economics and... majored and minored in Christianity. I've been a full-time vocational pastor since 1983. In that time the composition of and quality of our nation's job base has changed greatly. Once upon a time ours was a production economy, there were good jobs available in the local community and not just talk of jobs somewhere or other. That is not today the case. The economy is now service based. I've had Gulf War veterans tell me how hard they found it to re-enter the civilian job market. One of those men joined my church. He found a job driving a truck delivering fish bait making about 30 hrs./wk. He was not alone.
As to technical type education, let the federal govt. stop spending borrowed money to employ folks in defense and defense related activities and the resultant reality will go down hard for a lot of folks. This has already been experienced by many who saw their companies bought out, the factories closed and the production and jobs moved overseas. Meantime the cheap overseas goods are imported back into the U.S.
Chaos and uncertainty are no longer just the curse of the poor and ill-prepared. Far to many experienced the recession of the last six years, far to many who were not ill-prepared or poorly educated or lazy or whatever the reigning mythology of blame might once have been. For a great many Americans, the present is tense and the future is no better. Retreating into the rural areas or behind the wall of a gated community is not a workable long-term solution, recent protest in major cities of the U.S. demonstrate this.
As to technical type education, let the federal govt. stop spending borrowed money to employ folks in defense and defense related activities and the resultant reality will go down hard for a lot of folks. This has already been experienced by many who saw their companies bought out, the factories closed and the production and jobs moved overseas. Meantime the cheap overseas goods are imported back into the U.S.
Chaos and uncertainty are no longer just the curse of the poor and ill-prepared. Far to many experienced the recession of the last six years, far to many who were not ill-prepared or poorly educated or lazy or whatever the reigning mythology of blame might once have been. For a great many Americans, the present is tense and the future is no better. Retreating into the rural areas or behind the wall of a gated community is not a workable long-term solution, recent protest in major cities of the U.S. demonstrate this.
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All work has value.
No job is so simple it can't be screwed up.
No job is so simple it can't be screwed up.
At the college where I got my BA and MA the art department was right next to the business department in separate buildings. Between classes the students from both would pour out onto the sidewalk and mingle as they made their way across campus. It was very amusing. The business majors in their suits and carrying brief cases along with the art majors in paint-stained sweat shirts carrying portfolio packages under their arms. Each convinced the other was nuts.[/That could be a unique case of two wrongs making a right.
CatSnipah
Member
They WERE both nuts. Because they weren't engineers.
Says the guy (me) who also has an MBA, lol.
Some truth there. I have a liberal arts degree and managed to make it to top corporate management level in a Fortune 500 fast food chain. So, I'm not offended by "fries with that". I'll let my S&Ws speak for themselves.
I admire all of you who got your degree, in whatever it was. I was a college flunkie. As the old saying goes, I couldn't see the forest for the trees. I was POed at having all the same required courses, like English, that I took in high school. It's like Seldom said, it's proving that you can study. I wasn't good at studying, I was pretty fair at partying, so my college days lasted 2 semesters, then I went to work. I am still at work, dammit. I still can't understand why someone would be an English professor.
I started working after I graduated high school and have been ever since. From a poor family, I never had the chance for higher education. I made damn sure I took every opportunity presented to me to learn and better myself and my career. I have been very successful in my life (so far, knock on wood, etc.) and it's only due to work ethic and a sense of urgency.
I have seen the bottom of the barrel with it comes to people. Some of these had every opportunity in the world to move forward but turned into scum instead. I have respect for ANYONE with a job that supports themselves and or their family, at least it shows forward motion.
Practical experience is still the best teacher but nowadays it's hard to get practical experience without having a degree, you simply won't be hired. Hat's off to those who work, go to school and even more to those who do both.
I have seen the bottom of the barrel with it comes to people. Some of these had every opportunity in the world to move forward but turned into scum instead. I have respect for ANYONE with a job that supports themselves and or their family, at least it shows forward motion.
Practical experience is still the best teacher but nowadays it's hard to get practical experience without having a degree, you simply won't be hired. Hat's off to those who work, go to school and even more to those who do both.
Dennis The B
US Veteran
I was fortunate, that when I started my "serious" business degree pursuit, I had already earned an associate's degree in accounting and data processing. Pre-1970, data processing included tab equipment, key punch machines, sorters, collators, and computers. So, my IT started at the very basic of levels. Instructors insisted on systemic, end-to-end thinking.
When I started my bachelor's education, I didn't bother with accounting. I went into finance/banking and economics, since it embraced both macro- and micro-economics. At the suggestion of an econ professor, I took some poli-sci classes to get an idea of how the political-economic models intertwined. I was hooked. It seemed to me, at the time, that there was no way one could isolate liberal arts from business, and vice-versa.
The last several years of my education were a real pleasure. The only downside was the absolute, willful ignorance of liberals in the social sciences department. I ended up having to take an urban sociology course, in which the instructor had real dislike of police officers and conservatives, on a visceral level. Along with four police officers, we did manage to eke out a 3.0 in her class. As a class assignment, I chose to do a couple of ride-alongs with my classmates, and got a very decent grade on the paper I wrote.
The administration of the University of Louisville in the 1970's, was very much oriented to the liberal arts side, and they didn't give a lot of attention to the B school. One of the shortfalls on the liberal arts side, was the ignorance of how the business world operated. Not so much in the large corporate level, but in the small business side of things. Even liberal arts majors need some basic finance and/or business classes, and especially an introduction to commercial law. I found that liberal arts majors were woefully ill-prepared for small business endeavors.
I've been a economics/political science "junky" since 1964, and I find the subject fascinating.
My favorite professor was a lady who was a dyed-in-the-wool Roosevelt New Dealer. However, she was the fairest of all my professors when it came to teaching. She made us think, and she wasn't shy about allowing contrarian views to liberalism into the class room. We had many discussions that ran into the wee hours, after class time.
Challenging the student to learn all there is, is the greatest legacy of any school setting.
When I started my bachelor's education, I didn't bother with accounting. I went into finance/banking and economics, since it embraced both macro- and micro-economics. At the suggestion of an econ professor, I took some poli-sci classes to get an idea of how the political-economic models intertwined. I was hooked. It seemed to me, at the time, that there was no way one could isolate liberal arts from business, and vice-versa.
The last several years of my education were a real pleasure. The only downside was the absolute, willful ignorance of liberals in the social sciences department. I ended up having to take an urban sociology course, in which the instructor had real dislike of police officers and conservatives, on a visceral level. Along with four police officers, we did manage to eke out a 3.0 in her class. As a class assignment, I chose to do a couple of ride-alongs with my classmates, and got a very decent grade on the paper I wrote.
The administration of the University of Louisville in the 1970's, was very much oriented to the liberal arts side, and they didn't give a lot of attention to the B school. One of the shortfalls on the liberal arts side, was the ignorance of how the business world operated. Not so much in the large corporate level, but in the small business side of things. Even liberal arts majors need some basic finance and/or business classes, and especially an introduction to commercial law. I found that liberal arts majors were woefully ill-prepared for small business endeavors.
I've been a economics/political science "junky" since 1964, and I find the subject fascinating.
My favorite professor was a lady who was a dyed-in-the-wool Roosevelt New Dealer. However, she was the fairest of all my professors when it came to teaching. She made us think, and she wasn't shy about allowing contrarian views to liberalism into the class room. We had many discussions that ran into the wee hours, after class time.
Challenging the student to learn all there is, is the greatest legacy of any school setting.
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That might be true for certain jobs, but it's getting harder and harder for college people without the right type of degrees to get gainful employment. That old rule about supply and demand which is apparent that many with degrees do not understand comes into play!
A degree in an engineering/medical subjects goes a heck of a lot farther than a degree in "desk jobs" I see many people working at jobs way below their educational level because they have what I call BS type degrees. See many like this peddling fast food or working at Wally world/home depot type places.
Plus contrary to all the hype that you need a degree to make something of your sell is false in many cases. You work at building/ installing/repairing things like piping, electrical/ mechanical you will make good steady money. Contrary to the BS people you work cannot be outsourced. Yes you will get your hands dirty but you will do OK. Things break and things need to be fixed or installed in a location.
I'm retired (quite comfortably) I might add. (Great pension, it's based on hours worked) Due to health circumstances as stated in another post I took early retirement. Been retired from my union since 2002
If I was still working I would be making $35 per hour in the envelope with another $20 or so in benefits per. + the potential of mucho overtime if wanted. That ant chicken feed folks!
In fact compared to many of the people I went to high school with I'm doing as good or in many cases better than many with college.
Grayfox
US Veteran
College Degrees
A.S.: can't spell. Needs another "S"
B.S.: well we all know what that is.
M.S. : just More ...um...Dung.
PHD: same stuff, just Piled Higher and Deeper.
A.S.: can't spell. Needs another "S"
B.S.: well we all know what that is.
M.S. : just More ...um...Dung.
PHD: same stuff, just Piled Higher and Deeper.
LouisianaJoe
Member
I may be unusual since I have a double major in Math and Computer Science and have been employed using both.
I have been programming computers since the late 60's.
Of course what I learned then is obsolete but going to college should teach you how to learn for the rest of your life.
I have been programming computers since the late 60's.
Of course what I learned then is obsolete but going to college should teach you how to learn for the rest of your life.
