Why all the poor quality in new, expensive guns?

[Class III]

I guess I'm the only one that has bought TWO flawless Kimber 1911's. Both are older Yonkers models. One is a "Custom Compact Aluminum" which was flawless right out of the box and has 5150 rounds through it with no FTF or FTE. The other is a "Custom Compact" with 2550 rounds through it with only one stovepipe because of a light charge/squib in my handload that did not cycle the slide fully. Neither of these two are cataloged guns, as Kimber was known to put out about a gazillion special run 1911's each year through there custom shop before switching over to the "II" models.

Class III

Approx half of the rounds through both Kimbers have been 200 gr "Flying Ashtrays". The rest being 230 gr ball.

 

[kalei]

I have a Kimber Heritage model that is flawless! I carry a .380 Beretta model 34, it runs perectly as well.

 

[sar4937]

A lot of these 380's will never have 200 rounds run through them. False hope.

 

[Vulcan Bob]

Well maybe the Chrysler approch has caught on. Way back our department bought new Dodge Diplomat patrol car's, had a lot of trouble with them. Talking to a Chrysler service rep, he told me that Chryslers approch to marketing vehicles was, design em fast, sell em fast, fix them later. The monthly pile of service updates reflected that. Maybe the new buisness model?

 

[OLDFED]

The only new guns I've bought in the past ten years have been Kimbers...two .45s and one 9mm. Each works just fine and eats everything I've fed it.

 

[jag312]

Well maybe the Chrysler approch has caught on. Way back our department bought new Dodge Diplomat patrol car's, had a lot of trouble with them. Talking to a Chrysler service rep, he told me that Chryslers approch to marketing vehicles was, design em fast, sell em fast, fix them later. The monthly pile of service updates reflected that. Maybe the new buisness model?

I was told at a Chrysler dealership that Chrysler makes more money selling repair parts than from selling cars. Years ago I bought my mother a Chrysler Cordoba. It was a car that she wanted. It broke down so many times that we used to say that it needed repairs every 400 miles or once a month, whichever came first. One day I was fixing her car, and I lost my temper (or came to my senses). I went a Toyota dealer. pointed out a car, and said I'll take it. No further problems. I know a girl with a PT Cruiser. Her complaint is that it is in for repairs about twice a month, and she misses work. She says nobody knows how to fix it. The problem is not that nobody knows how to fix it, the problem is that it is a pile of junk and will never be anything other than a pile of junk, and no mechanic can make it better than what it was designed to be.

Now, my Browning BDA380; I bought it new in about 1985. When .380 ammunition was plentiful and cheap, I shot it a lot. Never a problem, 100% reliability.

ED

 

[feralmerril]

I am pushing 69 years old. I can only guess, but would estimate that I owned somewhere between 150 to 200 guns in my life. Most were fine used guns, maybe 25 brand new. My newest guns was built in the 1980s. The majority I would guess in the 70s?
I can only remember one with a flaw! It was a exspendsive new Browning Safari .308 model made in finnland. It had one of the finest grade pretty wood stocks I ever owned. I was sighting it in with factory ammo and the stock split in two! On the way home I stopped to a friend that was a gunsmith. He inspected it and found where there was a flaw in the stock and a chip had been glued in and the stock cracked from there. Evidently the stock was so high grade the company wanted to salvage it.
My buddy said he could fix it but I wouldnt opt for that and had the company send me a new stock. While they sent a pretty one, it was far from the beauty of the first one!
Now days these companys cant afford to pay and make a profit on all the old time handwork involved on nice guns.

 

[greengael]

I've heard that Nostalgia ain't what it used to be.[smile]. I tend to the belief that the bad old guns did not survive, or were fixed over time, and that the new bad guns have yet to be "fixed" or discarded.

 

[feralmerril]

Bill choats, that gunsmith friend I had, once told me no one will throw a gun out. He said they will junk a old refrigerator or washer when they wear out, but never, ever, a old gun!

 

[greengael]

If these pieces of junk were not discarded then how do you account for all the illegally owned saturday night specials that were around in the fifties and sixties?[smile]

 

[Texas1941]

I've heard that Nostalgia ain't what it used to be.[smile]. I tend to the belief that the bad old guns did not survive, or were fixed over time, and that the new bad guns have yet to be "fixed" or discarded.

Hold your cards please, we have a bingo!

 

[BUCKAWHO]

Poor Quality

Hi ...I recently purchased a used WW II era S&W Victory model in 38 Spl.
It is no gem from a looking standpoint, but it never fails to fire & shoots to POA EVERY TIME ! So, why waste your money on a new PPK, eh? Do you think the bad guy will wait while you fix the jam?
Also have an older S&W 39 that has never failed or jammed (I bought it new). I'd put this against a PPK or Glock any day for reliability and accuracy. Eight 9mms. in the badguys gut beats a jammed Glock anytime, IMHO ! BT

 

[mod34]

I'm not coming down on the side of quality today being better or worse than in days gone by, but rather to provide perspective as to how the amount of information and data available from around the globe at our fingertips may be skewing our perception. Back in the day, we might have talked with a few folks at the range, club, office, shop, etc. and based quality perceptions on the feedback of a few. Today, its a matter of logging on to any number of forums and/or Google searches, blogs, twitters, etc.,etc. to accumulate our info. There's just more information out there, and it only takes a second to get it.

 

[Slider506]

Old is good!

Of the twenty or so pistol and revolvers ive owned, my all time favorites would be (1) 1960's K 38 6" (2) 1963 makarov east German 9x18 (3) 1980's S&W 745 .45acp. They are all very well made, work every time and will no doubt last much longer than I will!
they don't make them like they use to!!

 

[CAJUNLAWYER]

I read that article in the NRA magazins and basicly they could have shortned it up a bit by posting a picture of all the guns with the caption "They all pretty much suck-but some less than others". Every time I look at a case full of new guns, I walk away with the smug realization that my stash is better than their "stash". Course it means that I don't buy much any more but what I got IS good stuff.

 

[canoeguy]

My wife dropped me off at the Hampton, Va. gun show this past weekend while she did some research at the library. I walked the aisles of the show for four hours, as the hours went by I got more and more tired of looking at the plastic junk that passes for firearms today. Probably 500 tables of guns, the only ones worth a darn could have fit in the trunk of a car.

The good stuff is now on the internet, on the auction sites so sellers can get full price.

 

[M29since14]

Whenever I would say to my mom "they don't make things like they used to" she would say, "they never did."

Your Mom was/is right! (Moms almost always are, as we all know. )

The cost of poor quality has always been a factor, and the odd thing is that it attracts so little attention!

If you get to checking around, experts will speculate that the cost of poor quality - throughout modern society - has ranged as high as 30%, at certain times. That is a staggering figure, and it would not surprise me if it actually is even higher. The problem extends into every facet of daily life, no matter what you are buying. This topic, as some will recall, was very popular for a while after the first space shuttle exploded. Motivating humans to do something about it is, always has been, and probably always will be, a huge problem for which there is no apparent solution.

You simply cannot pay everyone enough to make them give a damn. Some either will, or they won't. Just as troubling, currently, there is this popular notion, foolish beyond any description, that the process insures a good product, and that no matter what happens, the man with feet on the ground, so to speak, is never to blame for a quality problem. With that kind of doctrinaire "logic," progress with the basic problem will never come. Poor quality is always a people problem - at some point along the line between raw material and finished product. Someone had control and failed to exercise it.