Why would my .22 rounds be tumbling?
- Thread starter Larks
- Start date
WD40 is a known Carciginate, spelled it wrong I bet. but true. You do not want it on you as well. I use other brands for safety instead of this product especially on my guns. GM Canada ran it off of our properties many years ago now due to some serious health concerns over it.
You have leaded barrel. My shooting buddy has a Model 41 that was doing the exact same thing as yours. Due to the ammo shortage, he had tried different ammo and somewhere along the line had leaded the barrel enough that it was sizing the bullet down where it would not engage the rifling and hence the keyholing.
flagman1776
Member
Agree leaded barrel.
Removing the lube is guarenteed to make it lead. I used to be in the cast bullet business. After you get the barrel clean... I suggest you run a patch with Break Free CLP through the bore, chamber ramp & the exterior excepting grip surfaces. Just leave the least amount of film. I learned this long ago in a gun mag...
I learned to do so on my guns particularly at qualification with low bid dept reloads (probably swaged & not cast). Some officers spent hours cleaning their guns after. I could practically wipe the powder & fouling off with a clean paper towel after... The Dept Armorer tried it... the next qualification he had a gallon bottle & a pump sprayer.
That said, I would not use exposed lube type of ammo in a semi-auto...
Removing the lube is guarenteed to make it lead. I used to be in the cast bullet business. After you get the barrel clean... I suggest you run a patch with Break Free CLP through the bore, chamber ramp & the exterior excepting grip surfaces. Just leave the least amount of film. I learned this long ago in a gun mag...
I learned to do so on my guns particularly at qualification with low bid dept reloads (probably swaged & not cast). Some officers spent hours cleaning their guns after. I could practically wipe the powder & fouling off with a clean paper towel after... The Dept Armorer tried it... the next qualification he had a gallon bottle & a pump sprayer.
That said, I would not use exposed lube type of ammo in a semi-auto...
I agree, sounds like lead is the problem. Try this. Use some hyper velocity rounds ,10 or so , at the end of your next range session. Follow up with some CLP and some Chore Boy (pot scrubber). Wind a strand or two around your bore brush. It has worked for me. Pulls the lead right out.
Many on this forum have related good experience with Chore Boy.
Many on this forum have related good experience with Chore Boy.
silentflyer
Member
Possible that some of the WD40 is getting into the powder in the round, and not all the powder is burning clean. Lower velocity, and erratic speeds causing some rounds to tumble?
Thanks for the responses guys.
I can advise that the barrel is definitely not leaded, take my word for it, however I did give it my usual thorough clean last night again in preparation for doing ammo testing today.
And the ammo testing actually seemed pretty conclusive, though the results weren't at all what I'd expected.
I didn't get a whole heap of photos because it's a very wet day so was more interested in getting the rounds down range between rain squalls and forgot to take pics of the first test set with what I had left of the cleaned CCI SV rounds.
But suffice to say that, as expected, the 20 or so cleaned rounds that I ran through performed as before - i.e. a similar number of tumbled/keyhole rounds.
I cleaned again thoroughly between ammo types and next ran through a box of CCI SV's straight out of the box.
Surprisingly though, I still got a similar ratio of tumbled/keyhole rounds throughout the whole box - these first four pics are all of the uncleaned CCI SV, fresh out of the box test (please ignore accuracy, as I said I was racing rain so they're all very rushed shots):
BUT........
after another thorough clean I ran through a box of SK Standard Plus (again straight out of the box) and the results were entirely different. I only bothered taking one photo as the rest were pretty much exactly the same - no tumblers/keyholes at all:
Also no ejection failures throughout the ammo testing
So in summary, it seems that the tumbling has more to do with the type of ammo and, surprisingly, much less to do with cleaning the rounds with WD40, as the fresh out of box CCI SV's performed much the same as the cleaned CCI SV's, whereas the SK Standard Plus resolved the problem.
My only problem now - I have rather a lot of CCI SV's to get through.....
I can advise that the barrel is definitely not leaded, take my word for it, however I did give it my usual thorough clean last night again in preparation for doing ammo testing today.
And the ammo testing actually seemed pretty conclusive, though the results weren't at all what I'd expected.
I didn't get a whole heap of photos because it's a very wet day so was more interested in getting the rounds down range between rain squalls and forgot to take pics of the first test set with what I had left of the cleaned CCI SV rounds.
But suffice to say that, as expected, the 20 or so cleaned rounds that I ran through performed as before - i.e. a similar number of tumbled/keyhole rounds.
I cleaned again thoroughly between ammo types and next ran through a box of CCI SV's straight out of the box.
Surprisingly though, I still got a similar ratio of tumbled/keyhole rounds throughout the whole box - these first four pics are all of the uncleaned CCI SV, fresh out of the box test (please ignore accuracy, as I said I was racing rain so they're all very rushed shots):
BUT........
after another thorough clean I ran through a box of SK Standard Plus (again straight out of the box) and the results were entirely different. I only bothered taking one photo as the rest were pretty much exactly the same - no tumblers/keyholes at all:
Also no ejection failures throughout the ammo testing
So in summary, it seems that the tumbling has more to do with the type of ammo and, surprisingly, much less to do with cleaning the rounds with WD40, as the fresh out of box CCI SV's performed much the same as the cleaned CCI SV's, whereas the SK Standard Plus resolved the problem.
My only problem now - I have rather a lot of CCI SV's to get through.....
Last edited:
mrrick
Member
I'm of the old school that says the less you clean a .22lr barrel,
the better off you are. Pre-lubed .22 bullets shouldn't leave lead
unless the rifling is rough.
I have several .22s and at most will run a couple of Hoppes
patches thru them, followed by dry patches very occasionally.
I have no problem with accuracy of tumbling.
Just my experience.
the better off you are. Pre-lubed .22 bullets shouldn't leave lead
unless the rifling is rough.
I have several .22s and at most will run a couple of Hoppes
patches thru them, followed by dry patches very occasionally.
I have no problem with accuracy of tumbling.
Just my experience.
Comrad
Member
And I always thought CCI was good?
I have seen this problem with leading, I wouldn't clean off the wax.
Oldshot
Member
The wax is there for a good reason, so don't remove it. Years ago there was a problem with some Russian 22lr or maybe it was when Wolfe was made in the GDR. The solution was a drop of gun oil down the mag to add lube to the bullet tips.
Suggest you try some JB Bore Paste to get the lead and fowling out. It really works great if the bbl is warm, so bust a few caps first and clean it on the line. Follow the directions on the label and use a lot of Hoppe's to get it all out.
The ammo quality may be one cause of your problem. See if you can score some older CCI green tag or similar "match grade" stuff as a comparison.
Suggest you try some JB Bore Paste to get the lead and fowling out. It really works great if the bbl is warm, so bust a few caps first and clean it on the line. Follow the directions on the label and use a lot of Hoppe's to get it all out.
The ammo quality may be one cause of your problem. See if you can score some older CCI green tag or similar "match grade" stuff as a comparison.
I don't agree on the target aspect! Anyone(like me) that's spent many, many hours scoring .22 targets at competitions can tell you- you don't see that on recycled paper targets.
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The wax on .22 LR bullets is for lubrication. This is an ancient (mid-19th century) style of bullet which is the same diameter as the case, held in place by a narrow heel. The lubricant on most bullets can be enclosed inside the case. You will get severe leading if you remove this lubricant. Plated bullets are also externally lubricated, but less is required and is often harder.
I've had a lot of trouble feeding cheaper grades of .22 LR ammunition, but only where lubricant if found on the cases. Problems included FTF and FTE, with good and poor grade pistols. The most common problem finds the next bullet stuck half way into the chamber. Even revolvers can get gummy, which can cushion the hammer blow causing failure to ignite.
You are probably safe wiping the brass down with WD40, but leave the bullet wax intact. CCI cases are usually very clean (mine are also nickel plated). I rarely have a feeding issue with them, and have never taken time to clean them. It helps they are in boxes which keep the bullets separated, rather in a bulk container like cheap ammunition.
I have an High Standard Citation. It's no SW 41, but still a very fine target pistol. I'm lucky to get two rounds of white or yellow box ammunition before a jam. CCI - no problem. It even works in my SIG Mosquito (which is not the world's best .22 pistol by any measure).
I've had a lot of trouble feeding cheaper grades of .22 LR ammunition, but only where lubricant if found on the cases. Problems included FTF and FTE, with good and poor grade pistols. The most common problem finds the next bullet stuck half way into the chamber. Even revolvers can get gummy, which can cushion the hammer blow causing failure to ignite.
You are probably safe wiping the brass down with WD40, but leave the bullet wax intact. CCI cases are usually very clean (mine are also nickel plated). I rarely have a feeding issue with them, and have never taken time to clean them. It helps they are in boxes which keep the bullets separated, rather in a bulk container like cheap ammunition.
I have an High Standard Citation. It's no SW 41, but still a very fine target pistol. I'm lucky to get two rounds of white or yellow box ammunition before a jam. CCI - no problem. It even works in my SIG Mosquito (which is not the world's best .22 pistol by any measure).
