Winchester Model 94 barrels?

[lrrifleman]

I have a small dilemma. I have an old Winchester Model 94 in 25-35, that appears to have been made in 1919. I have had this rifle for 33 years, and I have yet to fire it. I do have a fair amount of ammo, and plan to test it at the range this spring. I do know that the barrel is dark, but I don't think that it is corroded due to black powder. I am looking at this as a short range (under 100 yards) deer rifle. I have only found replacement barrels from MGW, but none are in the proper chambering.

Does anyone here know of a reputable shop that you could, and would, recommend that relines barrels?

 

[Mistered]

Have you ever cleaned this rifle in the 33 years you have owned it? Reason is the 25-35 was never a black powder cartridge so that should not be the cause of the 'dark' barrel problem. While there could be some pitting inside the barrel it will not necessarily inhibit it's accuracy which should be very good to excellent. I would start by cleaning the rifle thoroughly which should be a complete tear down at this point unless it has been properly maintained through all the 33 years and see what the real condition of the barrel is before thinking replacement or relining which may or may not be an option.

 

[lrrifleman]

Up until my accident in '07, I religiously cleaned it at least 4 times a year. That puts it cleaned about a hundred times since I bought it used. I don't plan on doing anything to the barrel until I know how it shoots.

I know that the 25-35 was never a black powder cartridge, so I seriously doubt that is the reason behind the dark barrel, but I suspect that the primers may have been corrosive.

Since I woke from my accident, my approach to almost everything has been to prepare for the worst and hope for the best. This approach has served me well.

Thank you for your advice.

 

[Mistered]

Give it a good cleaning with a bore brush and patches. When good and dry get a bore light into the breech or a piece of shiny white card board as a reflector and really see whats going on. A certain amount of metal darkening will occur naturally over the years and not be a problem. I bought an 1899 Mod 94 last year that had not been cleaned in over 50 years. After a good bore scrubbing it cleaned up nicely and other than some minor pitting was 'dinging' some 2' gongs at 50 yards recently!

 

[Drm50]

What Mistered said. I have bought 3 old lever actions in the past
40yrs that I ended up keeping to this day. 2Wins & a Marlin, all
hadn't been shot for years and had dark bores. The Marlin was
the oldest 1904, 32/20Win cal, cleaned up good but still had a
dark bore. Shoots like a target gun, that's why it's still with me.
The others a 1894 Win 38/55 & 1895Win in 3006 are same way.
Dark but no pitts, I did remove a lot of crud from barrels. Used
GI bore cleaner and many repeated brushings and scrubbings.
Some of the few guns that have a permanent home. Try your
25/35 out before you get into rebarreling, ect.

 

[2152hq]

Try it first after some good cleaning as others have said. The results may surprise you especially since you're not looking for a 500yrd target rifle.

If you then still decide you need a new bore:
John Taylor does excellent relining work as well as other bbl work. Does a lot of work for those on the MArlin and Winchester lever action forums.
Taylor Machine

Another option if you don't mind stepping up in caliber is a re-bore/re-rifle to a larger bore.
The 25-35 is the same basic case as the 30-30, 32Special and 38-55 as well as a popular re-bore option, the 35/30-30.
JES reboring in WY does excellent work and has a fast turnaround. He's done a couple for me,,303Brit's to 35cal/303 and 375/303.
Not bad prices either in the world of re-bore work and in most instances like this will only need the bbl as the headspace of the rimmed case stays the same.
Home - Reboring by J E S

Just a couple options if the 25-35 doesn't perform,,but give it a go and I think it may work out OK. It's a good cartridge and a pleasant one to shoot.

 

[30-30remchester]

Don't be too quick to replace the barrel till you try it. I had a 94 rifle in 38-55 that had a horrible barrel. Badly pitted and dark. It would tear up a cleaning patch every time you ran it down a the barrel. I got quite a few 3" groups from this ratty barrel at 200 yards.

 

[Mistered]

And interestingly on my 1899 I mentioned after several rounds I notice the 'pitting' largely in part to be dissappearing so I don't really know what it was but a lot of it is gone.

 

[LoboGunLeather]

Much of my collection consists of rifles from the 19th and early 20th Century, including quite a few Winchesters in both black powder and smokeless powder variations. Visual observations of bore condition can be very deceiving; there is no substitution for range evaluation.

Take that wonderful old rifle out and shoot it a few times before you start thinking about changing anything! No lever action Winchester (or Marlin, for that matter) can be counted on to produce groups under 3" at 100 yards, and a "deer rifle" that consistently puts 5 shots on a 9" pie plate (size of the heart-lung area of the average deer) will keep the freezer full any time.

 

[steelslaver]

Memories, I shot my first deer with a government issue model 94 saddle carbine in 25-35

 

[ky wonder]

I have used vinegar in the barrels of old Winchesters to brighten them up use a good stopper in the muzzle so that the vinegar will stay in the barrel and prop the old girl up in a corner and fill from the open breach
let it sit for a while to give the vinegar a chance to work.

done this last year on a old 94 in 32-40 it turned the bore to a dull gray much better than the old black bore but not like a shiny new bore

if you swap out the barrel you loose the antique value of the gun!

 

[DWalt]

I hve done the same thing on several dark rifle bores - sort of. I cleaned them thoroughly using a brass brush, then degreased them with acetone. With the muzzle plugged, I filled the bore with citric acid solution (and I suppose vinegar might also work). Naval Jelly would also work, as they are all weak acids. Let the barrel stand for a day or so. That should remove any rust and brighten everything up. I have a Savage Model 99 takedown in .303 Savage. When I got it, the barrel looked like the proverbial sewer pipe, but after the citric acid treatment the rifling was much more evident, the metal was brighter, and it shot good enough groups to take hunting. A Savage 99 is not a target rifle anyway. I did the same thing on a Model 94 Winchester of much more recent vintage (1965), but never could figure out why the bore was so bad on it, definitely not because of corrosive primed cartridges. It cleaned up OK also, at least better than what it was when I bought it.

 

[lrrifleman]

Thank you for the kind words of encouragement, wisdom, and advice. I honestly don't want to rebarrel or reline this rifle, as I suggested earlier, I want to prepare for the worst. It is a sweet handling carbine, and I hope an easy shooter. When I bought it, having children wasn't even a thought, but I see it as a perfect rifle that my son and daughter can take their first deer with.

All that said, she is 97 years old, and her antique value is shot, what with a shortened magazine tube, a missing saddle ring, and at least being reblued at least once. All I need now is a set of 310 tool dies in 25-35 and I'll be set!

 

[patrickd]

If you really want to know what's going on in your barrel find a good gunsmith with a bore scope. Most real gunsmiths have them. For a few dollars he and you can see up close and personal exactly the condition of your bore. Brush it out real good and de-grease the bore just prior to using the endoscope in it. It will show you virtually everything inside the barrel. You can't really see much from just looking down the barrel other than whether it shines or not.

 

[Bill Bates]

I have found soaking the bore for a good 24 with Sharp Shoot R Wipe-Out foam bore cleaner followed by some JB Bore Paste really helps on old dark bores. I've been surprised how well some completely rough dark bores will sometimes clean up.

 

[Mistered]

All that said, she is 97 years old, and her antique value is shot, what with a shortened magazine tube, a missing saddle ring, and at least being reblued at least once.

We still need a pic! My 1966 Centennial and 1899 M-94.

 

[Win94ae]

I have an old 30-06 that had a dark bore.

It was accumulated fouling and corrosion, from who knows how long.
I got tired of the dark bore and went on a marathon cleaning session, taking 3 days, and now looks like this.

It shoots exactly as it did before, about 1.1MOA consistently. I feel better knowing the bore is free of the crud... I should have slugged the bore before cleaning.

Good luck!