I want to get an old west replica pistol. Advice please

I have a few C&B and cartridge replicas. Among the best, IMHO, are the Pietta and Uberti revolvers. Check out both company's sites, as well as Taylro's and Cimmaron. They both make some very fine replicas. In fact, it's said that when Colt first started making their 1873s again in the 50's or 60's, the guns were made under license by Uberti. I have an 1858 Remington Pietta C&B, an 1858 Remington Pietta 5.5" barrel conversion in .45 Colt (Built by Gary Barnes out of Texas), a 4 5/8" Uberti Taylor's Colt 1873 .45 Colt, a 3 1/2" birds head Uberti Colt 1873 .45 Colt and a Uberti Cimmaron S&W Schofield 5 1/2" in .45 Colt. They are all really nice guns.
 

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I shoot SASS with a set of 1860 Army clones and have no problem with the pain in the behind clean up that so many reference to.

A sink or bucket of hot soapy water, run a brush through it just like any cartridge gun and in a very short time you are done. In about 10 minutes both of mine are clean and ready for the next match!

So, to those that say" in the pain in the behind" mode....what is so difficult about that?

To the OP...if you like the appearance and feel of the cap and ball revolvers, don't let the naysayers dissuade you.....they really are fun and way more accurate than most will give credit for.

They are very easy to take care of......AND they have their own reloading press built into the gun and there are NO casings to deal with...no sizing problems, no split brass, no I can't find brass for my XXX caliber....No FFL concerns etc.

Randy
 
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Keep in mind that C&B revolvers, even newly-made ones, are generally unregulated in most areas, as they are not firearms as defined in GCA-68. Most cartridge revolvers (those made after 1898) are considered as being modern firearms.
 
I've had (and still have) a number of cap and ball revolvers over the years.

Several observations:

1. I prefer actual FFFg black powder to any of the substitutes. Pyrodex in particular produces a very hard fouling that will start to impede cylinder rotation on a tight fitting revolver after 2-3 cylinders worth of shooting. A wet cloth or dry bushing are in order if that happens.

2. Clean up isn't hard but it does take 15 minutes or so. A bucket of hot water and dish soap, a little scrubbing with a bronze brush, a hot as you can get it tap water rinse long enough to heat the metal to the water temp, then pat it all dry and let the heat do the rest. I try to keep the water out of the holes into the interior of the revolver, and I put a few drops of oil in each when I re-oil the pistol after it is dry. About once or twice a year I break it down for a detailed internal cleaning. Doing this mine have been rust free for decades.

3. I own a pair of 1847 Walker Colts, an Uberti and one of the Colt Signature Series (Uberti parts assembled my Iver Johnson in the US for Colt. Uberti makes great replicas, and the Colt Signature series are as good as it gets.

I also own a few Pietta revolvers - an 1858 Remington, an 1860 Colt Army and and 1851 Navy. Quality varies with the Uberti revolvers depending who ordered them. As someone stated above Cimarron branded replicas are top notch. Pietta revolvers also vary from "ok" to "poor", again depending on the brand. You get what you pay for and at the low end you'll get soft nipples that deform and brittle springs that break.

My first cap and ball revolver was a Ruger Old Army. Modern sights, based on the Super Blackhawk, available in stainless steel it is by far the most practical cap and ball revolver ever made and with 45 grains of powder capacity it's the heaviest hitting revolver, equal to the Colt Dragoons and second only to the Walker Colt. It's not the most traditional, but it is by far the most practical to shoot.

You can also get 1858 Remingtons in stainless as well as in an adjustable sight model and if you can't find an Old Army and want a practical field pistol, that's the route you want to take.

4. Stay away from brass frames, especially in .45 Caliber 1851 revolvers, where the originals were .36 caliber. They look pretty but they won't last.

5. Be aware there are several ".45 caliber" dimensions. You'll find some (usually Pietta) that need a .451" ball, others that need a .454" ball (usually Uberti), and some that need a .457" ball (usually the Colt Walker and 1st through 3rd model Dragoon pistols) and the Ruger Old Army). You absolutely must have a ball that fits the cylinder tight enough so that then you seat it, it cuts a thin ring off the ball all the way around. If not you'll get poor accuracy and potentially a chain fire.

6. Let's talk about chain fires. I hear people attribute this to loose fitting caps, but that's not the cause. The path from one cap out under the nipple, up and over to the next chamber and then up and past the next cap and down into the chamber is so long and convoluted and the spark that might be left doesn't have the heat to ignite the charge. As an example, I have an 1859 Sharps Berdan rifle where the trip down through the block, with a 90 degree turn to the middle of the block and another 90 degree turn to the powder is so long that even a musket cap won't light up a charge of Pyrodex. It's so marginal that it's black powder or nothing. A number 10 or 11 cap lighting up the adjacent cylinder after four 180 degree turns in mostly open air doesn't happen.

What does cause chain fires is loose fitting balls, and the lack of a lubricant over or under the ball. Filling the space between the ball and the cylinder with Crisco or similar grease is the simplest solution and it keeps the powder fouling soft.

Spit Ball does the same, smells better and won't go rancid on you, but both will run in a holster on a hot day if you carry the revolver all day. In that case, using a lubricated felt wad under the bullet works just fine - but it won't keep the powder fouling as soft for an extended shooting session.

7. BP era revolvers have a notch for the hammer between the cylinders where the hammer rests after you load it up so you can load all six. Some folks still will only load 5, but 5 out of 6 of them don't realize the purpose of those notches.

-----

Getting a black powder revolver and a conversion cylinder is the best of both worlds, and it adds a lot of variety with some very interesting pistols and conversions available. But be aware that they are intended for black powder era pressures so stick with standard pressure .45 Colt and .38 Special.

You also still have the option of shooting them with black powder loaded cartridges, and clean up is the same as with a cap and ball revolver.


Colt Signature Series 1847 Walker.

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I'd recommend finding a USFA or going ahead and getting in ng a Standard Mfg piece and shoot both smokeless and BP. Nice thing about BP, as St. Elmer said, is you can scoop as much powder as the case can hold, strike it level with a pocket knife, cram a bullet in any old way and shoot safely. Plus, BP just looks and sounds cooler. Use Ballistol and water for dropping in fires cases and to clean up.
 
I've got a Uberti 1858 Remington C&B that I haven't touched in years. I'd be more than happy to part with it for $125.
[email protected]
Because it's C&B, I can ship it right to your house - no FFL needed. Photos available.

Not a bad offer, but I'm still trying to make my mind up as to what I want. I'm leaning to a cartridge conversion, but I fund some videos on you tube I want to watch before I decide. I would like to see some pictures of your pistol, and I send you an e-mail so you could send me a few pictures if you don't mind.
 
"I have an 1859 Sharps Berdan rifle where the trip down through the block, with a 90 degree turn to the middle of the block and another 90 degree turn to the powder is so long that even a musket cap won't light up a charge of Pyrodex. It's so marginal that it's black powder or nothing."

For my Sharps, I find that mixing a little BP in with the Pyrodex eliminates any ignition problems. I have done it for many years with all of my BP guns, even revolvers.
 
This one has the style I'm hoping to find.

That would be a good choice. Study the picture closely. The main frame is case hardened steel. The grip frame is made of brass. There are a number of replica revolver built where the main frame is also made of brass. Pass on these, unless you can buy one cheap ($100-$125).

You can buy a steel frame Colt copy, like the one in the picture and you can buy a conversion cylinder so that you can also shoot .45 Colt out of it. However, the loading and unloading can be slow, as opposed to buying a strictly cartridge revolver. Be aware that buying a black powder revolver AND a conversion cylinder will cost about the same as getting a cartridge only revolver.
 
Cimarrons are the best of the cloned. Authentic and fun to shoot.

Cimarrons are made by Uberti - my Cimarron/Uberti Model "P" (5-1/2" barrel) is a joy to shoot in .45 Long Colt and always attracts an interested crowd at the range. :)

For low-cost plinking, I also have a Hy Hunter SAA replica (made in Germany in 1962 by Sauer & Sohn) in .22LR - similar appearance and feel to the Uberti. Carved my own grips. ;)
 

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revolver

I've had (and still have) a number of cap and ball revolvers over the years.

Several observations:

1. I prefer actual FFFg black powder to any of the substitutes. Pyrodex in particular produces a very hard fouling that will start to impede cylinder rotation on a tight fitting revolver after 2-3 cylinders worth of shooting. A wet cloth or dry bushing are in order if that happens.

2. Clean up isn't hard but it does take 15 minutes or so. A bucket of hot water and dish soap, a little scrubbing with a bronze brush, a hot as you can get it tap water rinse long enough to heat the metal to the water temp, then pat it all dry and let the heat do the rest. I try to keep the water out of the holes into the interior of the revolver, and I put a few drops of oil in each when I re-oil the pistol after it is dry. About once or twice a year I break it down for a detailed internal cleaning. Doing this mine have been rust free for decades.

3. I own a pair of 1847 Walker Colts, an Uberti and one of the Colt Signature Series (Uberti parts assembled my Iver Johnson in the US for Colt. Uberti makes great replicas, and the Colt Signature series are as good as it gets.

I also own a few Pietta revolvers - an 1858 Remington, an 1860 Colt Army and and 1851 Navy. Quality varies with the Uberti revolvers depending who ordered them. As someone stated above Cimarron branded replicas are top notch. Pietta revolvers also vary from "ok" to "poor", again depending on the brand. You get what you pay for and at the low end you'll get soft nipples that deform and brittle springs that break.

My first cap and ball revolver was a Ruger Old Army. Modern sights, based on the Super Blackhawk, available in stainless steel it is by far the most practical cap and ball revolver ever made and with 45 grains of powder capacity it's the heaviest hitting revolver, equal to the Colt Dragoons and second only to the Walker Colt. It's not the most traditional, but it is by far the most practical to shoot.

You can also get 1858 Remingtons in stainless as well as in an adjustable sight model and if you can't find an Old Army and want a practical field pistol, that's the route you want to take.

4. Stay away from brass frames, especially in .45 Caliber 1851 revolvers, where the originals were .36 caliber. They look pretty but they won't last.

5. Be aware there are several ".45 caliber" dimensions. You'll find some (usually Pietta) that need a .451" ball, others that need a .454" ball (usually Uberti), and some that need a .457" ball (usually the Colt Walker and 1st through 3rd model Dragoon pistols) and the Ruger Old Army). You absolutely must have a ball that fits the cylinder tight enough so that then you seat it, it cuts a thin ring off the ball all the way around. If not you'll get poor accuracy and potentially a chain fire.

6. Let's talk about chain fires. I hear people attribute this to loose fitting caps, but that's not the cause. The path from one cap out under the nipple, up and over to the next chamber and then up and past the next cap and down into the chamber is so long and convoluted and the spark that might be left doesn't have the heat to ignite the charge. As an example, I have an 1859 Sharps Berdan rifle where the trip down through the block, with a 90 degree turn to the middle of the block and another 90 degree turn to the powder is so long that even a musket cap won't light up a charge of Pyrodex. It's so marginal that it's black powder or nothing. A number 10 or 11 cap lighting up the adjacent cylinder after four 180 degree turns in mostly open air doesn't happen.

What does cause chain fires is loose fitting balls, and the lack of a lubricant over or under the ball. Filling the space between the ball and the cylinder with Crisco or similar grease is the simplest solution and it keeps the powder fouling soft.

Spit Ball does the same, smells better and won't go rancid on you, but both will run in a holster on a hot day if you carry the revolver all day. In that case, using a lubricated felt wad under the bullet works just fine - but it won't keep the powder fouling as soft for an extended shooting session.

7. BP era revolvers have a notch for the hammer between the cylinders where the hammer rests after you load it up so you can load all six. Some folks still will only load 5, but 5 out of 6 of them don't realize the purpose of those notches.

-----

Getting a black powder revolver and a conversion cylinder is the best of both worlds, and it adds a lot of variety with some very interesting pistols and conversions available. But be aware that they are intended for black powder era pressures so stick with standard pressure .45 Colt and .38 Special.

You also still have the option of shooting them with black powder loaded cartridges, and clean up is the same as with a cap and ball revolver.


Colt Signature Series 1847 Walker.

1d9cea9f.jpg

a25f06ef.jpg

BB57 just nailed it on cap and ball revolvers......

I too have much better success with real Black Powder than any synthetic, accuracy is also much better.....can't explain as to why...just that it is!

Randy
 
John,

I was given a Pietta 1861 Colt Navy by my father before he died. It is a steel frame 36. It has yet to be shot. The workmanship is quite good. In my mind, it is a dinosaur that will be held in reserve for when a revolver is needed. It looks like a miniature 1860 Army.

One thing I really love is the cap maker I picked up. Using an aluminium soda can and roll caps, it is possible to make your own percussion caps.

At the moment, I am looking at a Taylor's/Uberti Cattleman to full the Single Action Army void in my collection. A 44 Special is preferred, but it will probably end up being a 45 Long Colt.
 
I've got a Uberti 1858 Remington C&B that I haven't touched in years. I'd be more than happy to part with it for $125.
[email protected]
Because it's C&B, I can ship it right to your house - no FFL needed. Photos available.

Thanks for the offer and the pictures, but I've decided to go for a cartridge conversion. It's a nice looking pistol you have,but I think cap and ball might be to much for my old hands.
 
The 2nd gen colt Army it something I could live with, and the 1847 Colt Walker would be my dream buy.

Are there conversion cylinders available for either of these pistols?
 
Cap & Ball revolvers are a PITA...for me, at least. They require more attention than I'm willing to give. They're slow to reload, and while they may have been cutting edge technology in the 1850s-1860s, they're dated today. I had two of them, I think Pietta, (the ones with the trademark under the loading lever) and while very accurate at SD range, the physical investment wasn't worth it. I gave one away to my buddy, who likes it. The other one is in my safe and will stay there.

With two of them in the same caliber, I noted that the cylinders were not identically bored. In one, the balls (.375?) were properly tight, with the other, the same balls were loose enough to cause a problem. Like moving forward under recoil and jamming up the cylinder. During the War, Confederate cavalry units carried five or six of them, but no carbines, which they used to pretty good effect. Don't know about Union cavalry.

They are well-made, and the fit and finish of mine was great. Not my cup of tea, though.
 
Simple.


Bill Ruger built the Ruger Old Army (ROA) to be the finest CB ever manufactured, not a replica of old questionable designs. He succeeded. Cartridge conversions available.

The 1858 Remington is popular because it had the first full top strap, unlike the others. Cartridge conversions available.


Prescut
 
Biggest reason people have trouble with fouling on Black powder guns of any kind is they insist on using petroleum based lubricants. Use Crisco, lard, any kind of animal fat. Or spend the money for Wonder lube. It’s not petroleum based.
 
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