BIL who's never been much of a hunter & he doesn't reload either asked about buying a rifle . Of course I asked him what he wanted to do with it . Seems he wants a general purpose rifle capable of 300yd accuracy . Well I had him shoot my Rem 700 30/06 . Seems it's a bit more than he wants , especially the 180 loads . I believe a 270W would work for him & do 90% of what an '06 will with less recoil . Added plus for him is ammo readily available pretty much regardless of locale . Can't say the same for any of the 7 or 6.5mm's as he doesn't handload . List of possibles within his budget are :
1) CZ 557
2) Weatherby Vanguard S2
3) Win 70
4) Browning X-bolt
5) Howa 1500
6) Savage 110
7) Tikka T3X
Am particularily interested on some of the stocks these come with . Flimsy plastic is one thing & well made composite is something else . All these have reps as good shooters , but I haven't shopped for a bolt action in years .

My choice would probably be the Winchester M70, but I am not a great admirer of the .270, versus the .30/06.

I don’t think an occasional user would be poorly served by any of the rifles you mention. I specified the M70 because they “feel good” to me. Maybe he should go somewhere and handle as many of them as he can, before he decides?

The X-Bolt is a nice rifle, too. A little unconventional.

Ruger American in 243 or 308 will fit his needs completely with exceptional accuracy + priced lower then any previously listed here -

I would choose between 1 & 7, holding back on 3, the M70 Win because a pre 64 would have been top choice but I lost track of rep of new ones. Ruger 77 series should get a shot too. Out of those listed Savage would be my last choice.

M70 all day

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213th FBINA

General Purpose - 300 yards... I vote for the .308... 7.62 NATO
for rifle... 1st vote for Savage... (what I hunt with...)
2nd vote would be the CZ...
can't really say anything about the rest one way or the other...
no hands on experience... some I just feel tend to be over rated...

308 is more available and Winchester model 70 is the way to go

I have a Savage 110 with the accutrigger in 308 and it was accurate right out of the box, A good rifle for the money.

The 308 is a great caliber and can use a shorter action.
I have been well served by my Ruger rifles.
My 2 308s are Remington Mohawks. Great little guns if you can find one.

About caliber... What is he intending to hunt? The .308 is a good choice, but most .308's are a little lighter in weight than a 30-06 (long action length), so kick about the same, something to consider if recoil with the 'o6 is an issue.

I just recently got into the 6.5 Creedmoor, and like it. Plenty of energy for deer sized game, and I have found it is very available and popular, at least in the shops in PA. Closely approximates the .260 Remington - a real deer killer. Mild recoil, it depends on efficient, high BC bullets at moderate velocities for flat trajectory and retained energy.

No real bad choice among the rifles listed, it's really a matter of personal preference - he really needs to handle them first, see what feels good to him. My choice of those listed? I like the CZ if wood, the Tikka if synthetic.

Larry

I didn't see it on your list but I too like the Ruger American. I own a .30-06 and it's great budget choice.

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Support Israel!

I think, along with others, that the .308 is the most versatile. I have an old Ruger 77 in .308 and have taken many a buck with it. I also have some Howa's, really like them, and fairly inexpensive, good quality. I wouldn't buy one with the Nikko Sterling scope, cheap scope and doesn't hold zero. The CZ 557 has an excellent reputation, but don't know about cost.

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Kevin in Oregon

Another vote for the Ruger American.You get a lot for the price! Caliber?? .308 is very hard to beat, short action also...Since mine is .223 not sure, but they are probably available in .308

The savage is a lot of rifle for the money... would probably be my choice for someone that doesn't do much shooting.. as for caliber I find a .243 is great for most medium sized game and for the recoil sensitive.

Agree with several above, you need Ruger on the list.

Also a 150 grain bullet in .30-06 will take 100% of North American game with similar recoil to a .270.

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Live long and prosper

I think we need more information...

You mention he is "not much of a hunter" and wants 300 yard accuracy - does that mean he wants a hunting or target rifle? If the latter a .223 bolt action would do the trick with low recoil.

Many of the lower-priced synthetic stock rifles have a reputation for excellent accuracy (Mossberg, Remington, Ruger, Savage, Weatherby/Howa). If he is wanting to hunt and has good judgement I agree a .243 is a good choice, widely available and low recoil. (Guys, recall he tried a .30-'06 and thought that was too much - that or a .308 seems out. )

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

I see a lot of used bolt rifles around. If he keeps his eye open and checks around he should be able to find just what he wants for a good price. Esp. in old standby calibers.

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No baby we aint

With the information in boatbum101's post, I am guessing his BIL's new gun may well be joining these ranks soon.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

HOWA HUNTER 6.5CR Threaded Barrel 22B | HWH65CT - Buds Gun Shop

This is what I'll be getting next.

All of the major rifle manufacturers offer a low cost entry level rifle. They all seem to have the serious money in the barrel and action, not so much in the synthetic stock and magazine.

I own 3 Savage Axis rifles and can tell you that they all shoot exceptionally well, even the one without the AccuTrigger which is a .223 and used heavily on Montana Prairie Dogs.

I fire about 3000 rounds a summer and have had it for 5 years now...still shoots 5 rounds I can cover with a nickel at 100 yards!

Decide on what caliber you want and then buy it. You cannot go wrong with any of the above mentioned rifles. (The .308 or .243 are excellent choices by the way.) Readily available cartridges across the US.


Randy

TIKKA T3X Lite .270 Win Bolt Action Rifle, Veil Alpine Camo - JRTXVA318
this is my recommendation for the new guy, from the list furnished.

Get a Limbsaver slip-on recoil pad for range work. He'll never notice the recoil, when squeezing off that one shot, for the kill.
I'd stick with the Remington 700, in .30-06, for the versatility of the round, and the accuracy of the platform, but any of the rifles you mention would certainly fit the bill.

For hunting IMHO the 270 covers more capabilities than either the 308 or 243 . Granted not a flexible as an '06 but pretty dang close until you get to moose & neither would be a choice for larger bears . 6.5 CM & 260 don't even equal the old 6.5 Swede when loaded to current CIP level . Just as the 7mm-08 vs the 7 X 57 . I also believe your more likely to find a box of 270 than the others in any small town shop .

The Howa and the Vanguard use the same action, I believe, so between those two it would come down to which stock you liked better. The only one on your list I own is the Tikka. Mine is a SS .308. It's been a good shooter so far but I'm not a big fan of the shrouded/enclosed bolt. Too hard to single load at the range when shooting off the bench.

I bought a Tikka T3 on closeout when they brought out the T3X's . 6.5 x 55 Swede . Hunter model with walnut stock . I upgraded recoil lug , installed pillars & Devcon bedded action . Very accurate , but I'm not a fan of plastic bolt shroud , plastic mags & bottom metal . All of which I'll most probably replace in time . I like the caliber , load for it & have shot it for years . Had a VZ 24 action & was going to build a Swede but found that closeout cheaper than I could of bought a good barrel , etc . Modern action that can be loaded to current CIP pressures .
We looked at both current production M70 & Rem 700 . Not impressed @ asking price level . Browning X-bolt I've got doubts about it being all show & no go . For it's price point the CZ 557 is pretty . Nice wood , fit & finish . If they shoot as good as they look it might just get the nod .
Another option is find an older Rem 700LA with a good action as I have a new SS 24" factory mag profile takeoff 270W barrel . Probably come out a wash on the money by the time we got a stock & rest of parts . Bottom line it's BIL choice .

Here are my feelings on what a serious hunting rifle should be and what features it must include. It is all about reasonable accuracy, reliability and safety in a package I don't mind hauling up the mountain.

First, it must have a control round feed action and a large claw extractor. So, I'm looking at a Mauser 98 style action like: the Zastava M70 Mauser, Rigby Highland Stalker, Winchester Model 70, Ruger M77 Hawkeye or MK II, Kimber, and now defunct Montana Rifle Co. I want positive feeding and extraction, every time.

It should have good trigger, preferably user adjustable to 3 pounds. It should have safety that locks the bolt. I want the rifle in battery when that safety gets pushed off. Having a three position safety that allows the bolt to cycle while being safe is a plus.

I'm not a fan of detachable or blind magazines on hunting rifles. I want a hinged floor plate. I don't like blind magazines because to unload the rifle your cycling rounds through the chamber. Detachable magazines can get lost, forgotten or drop out at very inopportune times.

I like my hunting rifles to weigh 7 to 9 pounds max when setup with a good scope. Much lighter than 7 pounds and I find are harder to shoot accurately from hunting positions. I'm old and a 9 pound setup isn't about has much as I want to pack up the mountain, day in and day out, on a hunt.

A rifle should be reasonable accurate. A hunting rifle it doesn't need to a super tack driver. I just need minute of an antelope out to about 300 yards. A rifle setup that will give me 1- 1.5 MOA will do that. I'm old enough to remember a time when if a factory rifle shoot 1 MOA was a gun you could really brag on to your buddies. These days 1/2 MOA seems to be the goal and 1 MOA is garbage. Guess what a reliable 1 MOA rifle will kill game everyday at reasonable hunting ranges. (Threads on "reasonable hunting range" tend to be like best caliber and best load threads and I hope bringing up doesn't take this thread in a new direction.)

I'm a wood and blued steel guy but I do get synthetic stocks and stainless. If I were buying a working hunting rifle these days I might even buy a synthetic stocked stainless rifle with maybe a hi tech spray painted finish.

With all of that said, a few rifle factory rifles that checks off all of my boxes are the Winchester Model 70, Ruger M77 Hawkeye and the inexpensive commercial Mauser 98 Zastava M70 . They have control round feed actions with large Mauser style claw extractor and hinged floor plate. With careful scope selection I could get it setup in the 8 to 9 pound range. The only thing I might upgrade would be the triggers if I couldn't get a good clean and crisp 3 pound pull. The Zastava has a great adjustable trigger.

And a photo just because. Here one of my current favorite rifles. I haven't taken any game with it but it just so fun to shoot. Other that a less than great trigger it checks all of my boxes for a hunting rifle. Me and my 9.3x62mm Ruger M77 Hawkeye African And a Zastava M70 I bought for a grandson.

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Bill Bates

Number one would be the Savage 110 in 308 or 30-06 depending on what he is hunting. They are more accurate than the others on the list out to and beyond 300 yd. Savage also offers a "custom Shop", which is excellent to work with and inexpensive compared to others. A non listed rifle left hand,SS,accu-trigger, accu-stock, threaded barrel,heavier profile barrel, 30-06 ( could have been other calibers) for $ 770.00 It is accurate with many loads, and could be a one hole @ 300 yd with handloads. Over the past 25 years I have sold and recommended Savages over Remington, Winchester, simply based on accuracy, reliability and option. I would avoid a 270 since for the slight decrease in recoil, you lose many options of bullet weights and energy that you get with the 30-06. You can buy 06 in every little store, many grocery stores ( NOT walmarts) in most free states. Be Safe,

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I BACK OUR BLUE

I have a Kimber Stainless Select in 308. Great rifle. Light weight, super accurate as long as you don’t heat the thin barrel. Recoil is very tolerable, but I think Kimber does a great job with stock dimensions to make recoil tolerable.
It is probably more money than the OP has in mind for a gun.
Point being most any major maker offers a fairly light weight rifle and almost all produce accuracy out of the box that serves well in a hunting rifle. Sub MOA is NOT a requirement for a big game rifle. The topic sells a lot of print and garners tons of clicks, but Bill Bates makes a good point about minute of Antelope. It is all you really need. 4” groups at 300 yards drops deer and antelope sized game every time if the shooter does their job.

Well budget is somewhat of a consideration for sure , but I'd rather see him spend a little more to get something that'll give him years of service .
For over 50yrs I've been of the thought that if you're going to own 1 rifle make it a 30-06 . It's capable of taking 95% of game in North America . I have 2 . BIL is not as recoil tolerant , but he hasn't been a serious rifle shooter . If in his mind a 30-06 is too much , I fail to see how a 308 will help . Ditto with a 280 . The 6.5's shoot wonderfully but most limit one on larger game unless one has the experience for precise shot placement & chooses their shots . While the 6.5 X 55 has taken polar bears & moose it wouldn't be a first choice for most . I plan to let him handle & hopefully shoot as many different choices as possible before he buys . Unfortunately most of my rifles have too much horsepower for him .

7x57 will do for all but dangerous game in NA. Mild recoil and a huge variety of bullets to choose from.

This my 7x57 that I got from my dad who cut the stock down and added the curved bolt so a scope could be mounted on it. I've taken a lot of whitetail put to 150 yards. Not a long shooter and would put my limit to 250 yard shot on deer size game.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

If he is really that sensitive about recoil, maybe he needs a .30/06 with a muzzle brake? A lot a factory rifles come with brakes nowadays. I don’t see the need for one on an ‘06, but we’re all different. Maybe he just needs to toughen up a bit and ignore the recoil? (Just kidding. )

I'm particular to Weatherby so I say go with that. Regarding the chambering; in my opinion the .308 is a true all-around rifle but if it's too much punch, many swear by the .270.

I don't think you can't go wrong with either... unless he wants to go to Africa.

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Jorge

We all recommend are favorites, but I'll join the club and vote for either the Tikka or Vangaurd S2. They're my favorites in the "affordable" rifle category.

I think he wants what can’t be had. A rifle that’s accurate to fairly long range, powerful enough for any game he might encounter with little recoil.
Range and power usually equals recoil.
Eliminate the animals that he will never hunt then to go find that rifle that fits.
He might consider a semi-auto to reduce recoil.

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“Look life in its iron face”

If he thinks the .30-06 is too much, the .308 isn't going to be measuarbly better After all, the Army and Winchester designed it to be a short version of caliber .30 M2 ball. .270 and 7mm Mauser both have reputations as good killers and mild recoil. The .270 may be getting to be like the 7x57 in that not every hardware store is likely to have it. Jack O'Conner has been dead a long time and the guys who read his articles hair is gray if they have any at all.

I'd go for a Model 70 in 7x57, but a Savage in .243 would suit him better if nothing bigger than deer is likely.

I have three Model 70s. A standard model in 30-06, a Featherwight in .257 Roberts and an African in .375 H&H. I prefer the Roberts over the .243 but for someone who is just going to buy ammo .243 would be a lot easier to find.

The CZ 527 in 7.62 x 39 is a nifty little carbine in a readily available and inexpensive, yet reasonably effective round. Unlike such rifles as the Rugers, (which, BTW, are darned good) the CZ is designed to use cheap Eastern-bloc ammo, such as Tula, and Wolf.

I have two, one in 7.62 Sov and the other in 223 and I love them both.

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Let's be careful out there

I agree with considering the 7.62x39, 300 yards is near the end of the effective range for deer, but with good ammo they are accurate enough.

Just a little bit less than a 30-30 in performance. The .243 is muy bueno also, I have no experience with the 6.5 Creedmore or Grendel but they also have good reports.

CZ makes a great rifle!!!! I've got 10...... from .22.lr (4), .17hmr (1),.22mag(2) and .223/5.56 (3). Five with FS/mannlicher stocks


My Deer rifle here in Pa. is a Ruger 77 International/mannlicher in .243 I've had since the 1980s. Wish I had one in .308

CZ's are the best 'bang for the buck" going in my opinion.

Mauser action in three sizes...... rim-fire, mid size .223 and 7.63x39, and all the rest in short or long action. The 527 and 550s all have single set triggers.....

I was on the High School and College rifle teams so accuracy is important..... but this is for hunting so sub-minute of angle isn't as important. That said all my cz's will do MOA or better.

Caliber..... to hunt what??? Not mentioned in the OP if in another post I missed it. BIL doesn't reload so I'd go with a common readily available caliber suitable for his game(s) of choice.

.243 is a good choice for a non-reloader. Plenty of off the shelf ammo options are available. Good up to deer size game.

7mm-08 is at least as good of a choice if you re-load. It's between the .243 and .308. Commercial ammo can be spotty.

.223 is a good choice if just punching targets and low recoil is a must. Plenty of commercial ammo.

.25-06 is a great all purpose round, but it's better for a reloader.

.30-06 and .308 - can do almost anything, but might be overkill on smaller critters. If recoil is a problem go with a smaller round or heavier rifle.

Any one of the brands mentioned will do the trick. I'm particular to the Savage 110.

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My sgntr is mor thn 30 chrctrs

I would take him to places like Academy, Cabelas, larger gun shows, etc,and let him pick what he likes best and fits him, LOP, weight, balance, etc.
Let him try several different models and go over the pros and cons of each.

Recoil is easily overcome by a Limbsaver or Pachmayr Recoil Pad...Keep in mind, When Hunting, felt recoil is greatly reduced by layers of clothing.

The standard Sniper Rifle back in the day was the Remington 700 in 7.62x51 (.308) with a 3x9 Leupold.....Easy to Shoot and Accurate....The Savage Bolt Rifles have a good Rep for Accuracy also...

As far as glass goes, Leupold makes good Scopes with a lifetime warranty....keep in mind, if you go for a 50mm Objective to gain more light, it will NOT fit in a standard saddle scabbard... 42MM is GTG. Leica and Zeiss is an upgrade, but you get what you pay for when it comes to glass.

For Deer/Antelope, a lot of Hunters like the 25-06...inherently accurate caliber.

With a lot of People switching over to semi-auto, there should be a good selection of used Bolt Rifles to choose from.

As others have said, we need to know what he is going to hunt. How much power does he need? Then he ought to shoot the caliber he tentatively selects to make sure it is comfortable for him before he makes a purchase. As has been suggested, the .243 is a fine caliber choice for recoil sensitive people if it is enough to do the jobs he selects.

They are all good rifles capable of fine accuracy. From what you say, he will probably never hunt anything with it, and just randomly shoot some targets. If he wanted to hunt anything up to and including Deer, a .243 will handle the chore from prairie dogs to white tails. Ammo is available in various loading's to fit the use. It doesn't kick enough to turn him off.

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H Richard
SWCA1967 SWHF244

Sounds like the 7mm.-08 would be just about right. Plenty of range, less recoil than the .30-06 or .308, accurate and a proven killer of most of the large beasties hereabouts.

If he doesn't like the recoil of commercial 30-06 ammo, he won't like most .308 offerings either. With its increasing popularity and ammo availability, a rifle in 6.5 Creedmoor might be the way to go.

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Release the Kraken

If he doesn't reload calibers I would look at in no particular order are .30-06, .308, .243 and 6.5 Creedmoor. If he plans on hunting elk I might skip the .243 win.

All can be found about anywhere. All come from the factory with a wide selection of great bullets. All will do the job if he does his part.

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Bill Bates

Most of the ammo companies offer reduced recoil factory loads in popular calibers like .30-06, .308, .270 and the like. He could shoot a .30-06 rifle with recoil like a smaller caliber, then move up to the regular strength if he gets a chance to go for elk or moose.

When I was a young feller going to college in Montana, my main hobby was
big game hunting. Elk, deer, antelope, bear, etc. etc. I had a Winchester
model 70 with a Weaver K4 sight. I don't remember ever missing anything
I shot at. Great rifle/scope combination. I don't know if the new M70s are
as good as in the old days, but if I had it to do over again, I would find out.
By the way, that was in the late 1950s.

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In Omnia Paratus

Remington 141 in .35 Remington or a Ruger American in 7-08 will kill anything in the US with a good shot . Ya'll killing many of them Mooses and Polar Bears in Florida or are you just bragging ?

Since you told us what he can't kill with what he ain't getting why not tell us what he wants to kill with what he is gonna get .

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Grumpy Old Man With a Gun

I want to like this three times but they only let me do once .

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Grumpy Old Man With a Gun

I must have missed something because I saw the rifle list but not the caliber options.

I have a VERY strong personal prejudice towards .308 Winchester as a general purpose caliber but .243 Win will suffice as well. My very old Remington Model 788 in .308 is and always has been a tack driver. I didn't see Remington on the list but that's okay, a CZ 550, a pre-64 Winchester Model 70, great choices, but I wouldn't turn down a good deal on any of the other brands, either.

General purpose can mean a lot of things but whatever it means one thing for sure is you want ammunition availability. .270 and .30-06 are still popular but short action calibers like .308 and .243 are equally or even more popular and should be reasonably available on line or at retail all the time. Handloading is a whole nuthuh smoke; I don't do it because I wouldn't trust any round I built myself, I'm terribly unhandy, but if he can do it then great, more power to him, but the OP says that's not in the cards.

Not having a .30-06 or .270 I cannot compare recoil to the shorter actions but I have a .35 Whelen and I assure you the .308 is gentler.

I understand the little lecture above by Bill Bates about the following items - - - I don't know the gentleman and we have not crossed paths before on this Forum but I am making an educated, presumptive guess that (a) he is VERY knowledgeable about rifles and (b) a very experienced hunter with considerable time afield.

What I don't know is whether the person known as BIL will use his rifle as much as Mr. Bates - so that matters some.

An excellent consideration but not truly important for a general purpose rifle that will see limited use. Current, high quality rifles will do the job regardless of the extractor. If we're talking dangerous game rifle that's a different story.

Again, for a general purpose rifle (GPR) the trigger should be reasonably decent but 4 pounds on an 8 pound rifle is reasonable. Mil-spec on ARs is even higher than that but 3 pounds could be too light for an inexperienced, casual shooter/hunter.

I dunno, I can go either way on that so I'll go with it but then you have to do the research to ensure you know which rifles do this. I admit that I have no idea about the guns on the OP's list, I have experience with some but not lately and don't recall much about that technicality.

Same thing as the last item. I have no preference on 3 position safeties versus tang safeties or the safeties that Remington uses which probably have a name but I don't know it. If BIL just has the one GPR he won't have a problem - but I know that since I have rifles with different safeties before I take one shooting or hunting I sit with it and remind myself about each feature.

Now here's a fifty-fifty agreement with Mr. Bates. I like detachable magazines, and I'm diligent enough to say that I never lose any, not counting having my house fire in 2018 and even then I lost two magazines solely because I forgot that they were in the gun case pocket and not with the guns that we rescued. Oh, well.........anyway, I like the ease of loading and unloading detachable magazines. One caveat is that if you're in the woods hunting and you don't shoot you better damn well remember to eject the unspent round in the chamber when you remove the magazine.

Where we agree is the hinged floor plate. I really like those a lot and I really dislike military-type Mauser-style blind magazines that you can't unload without working the action. My customized (maybe sporterized is the proper term) 98 Mauser causes me to have to do that and I don't like it. Mr. Bates is dead on there!

I like Mr. B's caliber choices but, as noted, for general purposes I think that .308 is amazing and will take everything in North America as far as I know. Scopes are personal things; I used a 4X Weaver type scope for years and years but I have variable Leupolds that work great. I don't dial them up too far because I don't like long distance hunting, anyway; if I can't get up close and personal I don't take the shot. So reasonably minimal magnification works well for me and I actually do consider my very old Remington Model 788 to be a perfect GPR.

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Come and take it!!