From the Wonder Nine to the 229

bushmaster1313 · Feb 23, 2023

My understanding is that the single stack Smith & Wesson Model 39 ushered in the era of the Wonder Nines as the precursor to the double stack Model 59. Here is my 39-2, purchased from a Forum Member:

My further understanding is that today, the Sig Sauer P229 has become a popular weapon among armed professionals. This week I took home a Sig Sauer P229 in 9mm:

And for comparison, here is an Ithaca 1911 from 1943 along with the 39-2 and the P229:

I know the purists would want to see a 9mm Browning Hi-Power in the above photo but, sadly, a Hi-Power has yet to follow me home.

mk70ss · Feb 23, 2023

All beautiful firearms you have there. I also bought an Sig 229 Legion bout six months ago. My duty gun (retired LEO) for my last 10 years was an Sig DAK (double action only model), which served me very well. The Legion edition is even better. Congrats on yours.

Muley Gil · Feb 23, 2023

IIRC, the M59 was the first Wonder Nine-SA/DA with a larger magazine capacity.

bushmaster1313 · Feb 23, 2023

Muley Gil said:
IIRC, the M59 was the first Wonder Nine-SA/DA with a larger magazine capacity.

You are correct
OP modified accordingly

Ivan the Butcher · Feb 23, 2023

My first S&W was a 39-2 I bought used for $125 in 1980. I divested myself of 9mm in about 1992 and stuck with 45 ACP. I gave in to Poly Peer Pressure and bought a M&P 9c used ($325 OTD) a few years back.

My only Sig 229 is in 357 Sig with a spare 40 S&W barrel (never used). I do miss my 39! I don't miss the other 11 9mm I got rid of!

Ivan

BB57 · Feb 23, 2023

Muley Gil said:
IIRC, the M59 was the first Wonder Nine-SA/DA with a larger magazine capacity.

The Hi Power was introduced with a 13 round double stack magazine but was single action. The Walther P.38 and S&W 39 were both DA pistols but retained the single column magazine.

The HK VP70 was arguably the first “Wonder Nine” as it met the criteria of being a DA pistol with a double stack magazine. The S&W 59 was introduced the following year in 1971. The CZ-75 is arguably one of the best of the original Wonder Nines, along with the Beretta 92 introduced a year later in 1976.

I don’t have a VP-70, but I own several CZ-75 variants including an early CZ-75 Pre-B, as well as Beretta 92 Compact L and M pistols and an S&W Model 59.

The CZ-75 is by far my favorite.

I also like the single stack Beretta Compact M (technically not a Wonder Nine), and the double stack 92 - provided it has ultra thin grips and a short reach trigger. The Beretta 92’s major flaw is that it is a bit larger than required for the task and has a wide grip frame and long trigger reach that don’t fit as wide a range of hands as the 1911, GP35, and CZ-75.

The S&W 59 is the least favorite wonder nine I own. That’s an artifact of overly large grip frame (although not has bad as the Beretta 92) and comparatively poor reliability.

For basic reliability the open top slide Beretta 92 is extremely hard to beat.

ISCS Yoda · Feb 23, 2023

This is what I remember:

Wonder Nine

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Wonder Nine refers to any semi-automatic pistol that is chambered in 9×19mm Parabellum and has a staggered column magazine, as well as a double-action trigger for at least the first shot.

The term was coined by firearms author Robert Shimek, and became popular in American firearm-related magazines during the 1980s and 1990s by those advocating their use by police forces. At the time most American police departments were still using revolvers, with the majority chambered in .38 Special or .357 Magnum.

The simplicity of being able to fire the first shot just by pulling the trigger (a prominent feature of double-action revolvers), larger ammunition capacity, and faster reloading of ammunition with the use of box magazines are the "wonderful" features of a semi-automatic pistol.

Examples include the Heckler & Koch VP70 (1970), Smith & Wesson Model 59 (1971[1][2]), CZ-75 (1975), Star Model 28 (1975), Beretta 92 (1976), Steyr GB (1981), FN HP DA (1982), SIG Sauer P226 (1984), Ruger P85 (1985), Walther P88 (1988), IWI Jericho 941 (1990), Vektor SP1 (1992), Heckler & Koch USP (1993), Bersa Thunder 9 (1994), Walther P99 (1997), and Steyr M (1999).
Notes

This pistol-related article is a stub. You can help Wikipedia by expanding it.

Borrowed from Wikipedia under the fair use doctrine that fact that they allow it completely.

Further, this exists online:

Origin of the term/word "wonder nine," "wondernine" or "one der nine" has been debated more than once. Most often credited with the origination are Jan Libourel and the late Robert T. Shimek, both of whom were longtime writers and editors for gun-magazine staples like Guns & Ammo and Gun World.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-...ne" or,staples like Guns & Ammo and Gun World.

I was an avid reader of Guns & Ammo back in the day and I remember Libourel and Shimek but I specifically remember Col. Cooper's ridicule of the 9mm and his use of the term "wonder nine". In that 2017 Forum thread I said much the same thing.

JJOG · Feb 23, 2023

I have a German Sig P228 that is in my carry rotation..

sodacan · Feb 23, 2023

The S&W model 59 was their "wonder nine". I immediately knew why it got that appellation after I bought one. I wondered why I bought it. Not the best effort from S&W. The Sig P229 is a great pistol for me. This Stainless Elite (9mm) is a brick, but is a really soft shooter. The P228 is every bit its equal, and the P6 isn't too shabby either.

pawncop · Feb 23, 2023

I would add the Glock 17 (1982) to the list.

S-W4EVER · Feb 23, 2023

The first 9mm I bought was a Model 59 when I was in college. It was always reliable and accurate (although I sent it back to the factory a couple times due to recalls) and it fits my hands perfectly. Good pistol.

I bought a SIG P228 CPO a few years ago (looks brand new) and it’s a nice pistol too. (I bought it because it’s similar to the Army M11). I also like the Beretta M9’s, 92S, 92FS, 92 FS Compact Type L, 92FS Compact Type M, & 96FS (I’ve got ‘em all).

I like quality firearms, especially stuff adopted by Uncle Sam.

BLACKHAWKNJ · Feb 23, 2023

Bought a Model 59 in 1979 to go with my Browning HP, sold it in 1981, didn't like that alloy frame. Bought my M659 in 1985-still have it. A double stack grip is a stretch for a lot of people. I think the Browning HP is the largest grip that fits the largest number of shooters.

armadillo · Feb 23, 2023

I got a M-59 about 1976. They had a lot of problems with the early ones and I sold it because I had no confidence in it.

A few years later another officer needed money and sold me a M-39. What a great gun - the best trigger ever on a DA semi-auto.

When my agency switched from revolvers to 9mm in the 80's they tried to get me to take a M-469, but after I shot different different brands, I opted for a P226. The M-469 was not a M-39 for sure.

I now have the M-39 along with a P228 9mm. Both shoot very well.

Darkenfast · Feb 23, 2023

I almost bought a Model 39 back in 1980. It sure felt good in the hand. I ended up with a 2 1/2" Model 19 instead. Sexiest snub around, but in hindsight, I probably would've shot the 39 better. They did not have the greatest reputation back then, especially when it came to feeding hollow-points. Many of the pistols of that day still needed to catch up to the ammunition.

inspcalahan · Feb 23, 2023

There's a 639 out there somewhere that I wish I could have back...but everyone has this story with something...

That said, if I were reduced to one double stack 9mm and only one...the 229R Legion would be it.

jdh · Feb 23, 2023

VP70 was a machine pistol. Yes there was a semi-auto only version for civilian sales. However it being designed as a full auto removes it from the wonder 9 category.

sipowicz · Feb 24, 2023

My brother and I were big Starsky and Hutch fans. He loved that 6 inch Python and I lusted for that 59. My brother did buy the Python but after handling the 59 I immediately lost interest and decided on a Browning Hi Power. Oh well, I couldn’t be a Starsky with a HP but I could be a Serpico….way cooler

BB57 · Feb 24, 2023

ISCS Yoda said:
http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-...ne" or,staples like Guns & Ammo and Gun World.

I was an avid reader of Guns & Ammo back in the day and I remember Libourel and Shimek but I specifically remember Col. Cooper's ridicule of the 9mm and his use of the term "wonder nine". In that 2017 Forum thread I said much the same thing.

At the time I agreed with Cooper and was very much a 1911 in .45 ACP fan.

Times changed however as 9mm hollow point performance improved. Eventually I recognized I could make three A zone hits with a 9mm in the same time it took to make two A zine hits with .45 ACP.

I however never did see any real advantage of a Wonder Nine over a Hi Power, and still don’t.

BB57 · Feb 24, 2023

jdh said:
VP70 was a machine pistol. Yes there was a semi-auto only version for civilian sales. However it being designed as a full auto removes it from the wonder 9 category.

Well, it’s one way to try to claim the S&W 59 was the first wonder nine.

But it’s like saying that the AR-15 really is an assault weapon because it was originally designed to be full auto.

The VP-70 was semi auto, while the VP-70M military version was select fire. That’s the same relationship shared by the civilian AR-15 and the M16.

glenwolde · Feb 24, 2023

Being originally a "machine pistol" with three round burst capability doesn't disqualify the VP70 in my mind. The semi-auto U.S. import version was the first DA double-stack to market regardless of its heritage. They likely sold more of them than the original configuration worldwide. Everybody wanted one of those hideous things.

The Browning is disqualified as it does not have any type of DA trigger.

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