I traded in a couple of little used guns at a local gun shop the other day, they ordered for me a CZ 457 "Lux" .22 Magnum rifle, and a Girsan Hi Power clone. More to follow on the CZ .22 Magnum rifle, but today I shot the Girsan and found it "Worthy". Looks just like a surplus Israeli Belgium made Hi Power I once owned, but this one shoots better, probably because the Israeli Browning was pretty worn out. It has the magazine disconnect which makes the trigger a little rougher than the Springfield Armoury SA-35 which I also own, but I think I shoot it just as well as the Springfield. Price is about $200 less than the Springfield SA-35, which makes it a value I think.



Ran about 200 rounds through it this morning, a mix of 115 grain factory FMJ and my pet cast lead hand load, which the Girsan liked. Here's a steel target shot at 50 feet, standing two hand hold, probably 20 rounds slow fire and rapid. Sights are well regulated:



More steel target fun, falling plates at 50 feet:



I picked up a reproduction German Military flap holster for it from World War Supply, a mere $26 with free shipping. A good match for it I think!



Will this be my primary defensive carry pistol? Probably not, but I'll feel adequately armed when hiking about the property or doing tractor work....

I keep looking the Girsan compact version of that.

I have shot one of the steel framed versions, very nice. The alloy framed version with rail would be a tempting carry pistol.

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Alan
SWCA LM 2023, SWHF 220

I bought a Tisas/SDS "Model of 1911 U.S. Army" recently... I think Girsan, SDS, Tisas are all sisters of the same company.

I am generally not a 1911 guy, but I can tell you that the one I bought shoots better than a mint Series 70 Colt that I used to have. I really like their products. I think I read that the company will build to any price point, but they all shoot great from every review I have read, and I can believe that.

I prefer the grips on your Girsan as opposed to the SA-35. I actually swapped out my SA-35 stock grips for this type.

Attached Images

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From everything I have read about both Girsan and Tisas, they would have made John Browning proud! I've handled a few and they feel, well, normal.

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Even older, even crankier....

Very nice sir, and great pictures. I like everything about it except for the way-to-conspicuous billboard roll marks (probably laser-marks now) ...

I can't remember all the acronym/number variations of Girsan's High Power variations, but mine has a beavertail, flat trigger, no magazine safety, and an extended slide release. It shoots very well, and I've had no problems. I did read on another forum that the fiber optic front sight rod sometimes took off, but I put a very light brushing of clear nail polish in strategic spots, so far no problems. I still like the Browning on the left better, but that could be personal bias.

Kareen Israeli BHP replica



Just figured I would drop in a picture of an actual Israeli BHP replica. Some were made by the Hungarian company FEG. I'll have to dig it out of the safe soon to see what markings it has to be sure where it was made. But here it is just for a look-see comparison.

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Come and take it!!

I have a Mk III Hi Power as well as one of the less common nickel plated Hi Power, as well as a few FEG P9s and first generation P9Ms.







The Girsan MC P35 LW match I bought is very impressive even against the original Hi Powers. The trigger is superb and this particular model doesn’t come with a magazine safety. It’s a perfect concealed carry Hi Power.

Be sure to post about CZ 4547 rifle please . Give us your thoughts when you first get it and then a range report . I'm seriously considering one of these and would like some feedback from a forum member , not some random person on some other site .

The Kareen Hi Powers came in two flavors. Initially, FEG made them entirely. Then FEG supplied parts that were then assembled in Israel.

FEG also sold counterfeit Hi Powers to a few embargoed Mid east countries. They came with FN roll marks but 5 digit, B prefix serial numbers. Like the FEG P9 they are excellent copies of the Pre Mk II Hi Power and have 100% parts interchangeability with the FN made pistols.

LW Detective.

Girsan versus C series and MkIII series FN High Powers?



I've been mildly interested in the clone HPs during the years I've been trying to talk a friend out of his Argentinian lightweight detective model. Bought my original HP new in the pistol rug in the early 1970's when we were given permission for an auto pistol when working plainclothes. Been trying to wear my original HP out by carrying and shooting it ever since.

I never got interested in any of the current clones because as far as I've seen and am aware, all of them are replicas of the final MkII/MkIII FNs for starters - rather than the previous T and C series HPs which are much more svelte in the hands. Those who never owned a HP before, or only owned a MkII/MkIII may not realize the difference. But as one of those who owns a MkII and two MkIII HPs (inadvertantly, long story) as well as my original HP, there is a very big difference between them when in the hands. Just enough of a difference in size that it's obvious in the hands. Pity that none of them didn't give the T and C series pistols the replication and modernization treatment, but it is what it is.

I am going to get a chance to compare my 50 year old C series HP to the Girsan - not really fair to the Girsan because my HP has gotten extremely slick over the years simply through use. I helped a friend get out of a terrible purchase (for him at least) of a Glock G30 compact .45 ACP somebody convinced him was what he needed for self defense. It came with a very inexpensive laser/light rail sight - which wouldn't stay on the rail because the design did not have a screw or bar that went in the crosscut in the Glock rail... quickly shot loose despite tightening the tension screws as much as I dared. It was a handful for me, and I carry a Dan Wesson 10mm CBOB with 220 grain rhino rollers as my bear wrench here in Montana... not good for a new shooter.

Anyways, a dealer at the Kalispell gun show two weeks ago, took that very lightly used Glock in trade for the new Girsan with Ken paying $100 difference - very fair in my opinion.



Not what I would have chosen from Girsan's HP replica offerings if I was ordering new. I would have preferred the patridge style front sight on the OPs Girsan, versus this ramp front sight similar to that on my HP Practical. That ramp on my Practical is going away when that HP gets some light work done on it. And maybe I'd have chosen their compact version instead... but without much savings in weight, probably not.

One of the advantages to helping Ken get off to a good start is I expect my Ceiner .22 conversion kit will also fit on his Girsan... meaning a lot of inexpensive practice developing the basics is available using the pistol he purchased.

(NB: I have nothing good to say about Ceiner since my dealings with him decades ago purchasing the conversion; he is one of those people who makes you want to drive across the country so you can get in his face and sort the problem out at touching distance. But that conversion kit has served me extremely well ever since I got it.)

Anyways, for me, I don't like the replica grips on the Girsan any more than I like those as the originals on the FN HPs. For me, after all the grips I've tried over the years, the now out of production Uncle Mike's rubber boot grips are the best in fit and feel. They are/were a licensed reproduction of Spegal's boot grips; I have a set of his stocks made from some beautifully grained wood. But... nobody sees the beauty when you're carrying, and I don't care on the range when the rubber version feels better in the hand. However, it's Ken's gun and Ken's hands, not mine. I'll let Ken try my MkIII with the Uncle Mike's grips versus the Girsan originals and he can make up his own mind. There are numerous sources of micarta and similar grips available out there - I think the remaining Uncle Mike's are getting harder and harder to find.

My primary curiosity is with the trigger pull on the Girsan new out of the box and how it changes. My C series trigger scales at 5 lbs and I've never touched the magazine disconnect or anything in it. The other HPs also have their magazine disconnects in place; they're a little heavier at 6 lbs, but as I've never warmed to their difference in my hands, I haven't shot them very much.

I purchased my first HP at a time when we were carrying S&W Model 10 revolvers and people weren't demanding a 3 lb. trigger pull on a handgun intended for fighting/self defense. Nor were people running around broadcasting their theory that a magazine disconnect would almost certainly get you killed. I don't know what my C series HP had for an original trigger pull, but it will be interesting to see how the Girsan compares in a number of ways.

There's what the Girsan trigger feels like after an initial cleaning, and what the trigger pull scales at. Then seeing if there's any difference in the trigger pull while using any of my 50 year old HP magazines. And finally, if any of that changes by simply replicating hours of use by polishing the contact surfaces of the magazine disconnect (and where it contacts on Ken's new magazine). There's more moving parts in the HP trigger system than just the contact surfaces of the magazine disconnect, but other than a detailed cleaning to get out any remaining factory dirt and gunk, that's an easy place to start looking for a 5 - 6 lb trigger pull for a new shooter.

As far as the crop of recent clones goes from Canik to that abortion that FN calls the new Hi Power, the Girsan with it's apparent 100% interchangeability is about the closest to what could work for me.

Whether Dieudonné Saive who did the vast majority of the design work on the High Power would approve, we'll never know. Given how much design effort he put into making the High Power as slim and trim as possible for a service pistol, he might have wondered why the copycat pistols didn't replicate the dimensions of his original design versus the MkII/MkIII.

I suspect that Girsan, Tisas, and Springfield Armory's Hi-Power clones all have most of their parts made in the same foundry. The difference between these three makers comes in the final machining, features, and finish.

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VCDL, GOA, NRA

Agreed.

According to the Federal Trade Commission, “Made in USA” means that “all or virtually all” the product has been made in America. That is, all significant parts, processing and labor that go into the product must be of U.S. origin.

*However* the ATF definition of firearms made in the US versus those that are imported focuses on where the firearm is assembled and finished, not on where the parts or forging originate.

As a Hi Power related example, the Charles Daly Hi Powers were finished and assembled in the US initially by Dan Wesson and then later by Magnum Research. The parts however were made by FEG and imported to the US, where Dan Wesson or Magnum research did the roll marks, finish and assembly of the FEG made parts.

Per the ATF that’s sufficient to be considered “made in the US”, even though it would not meet the FTC definition of made in the US as 100% of the parts were actually forged and machined by FEG.

That’s where I suspect that Springfield armory gets by with the “Made in the US” roll mark. Assembled here? Absolutely. Made here? Not likely. I have never been able to find a video of SA’s manufacturing plant where they forge and machine parts for the Hi Power.

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Specifications do make a difference when it comes to firearms that are assembled from parts. For example, with the FEG Walther PP clones, pistols like the AP9S and APK9S imported by Interarms originated in Interarms concerns that their access to Manurhin made PPs would dry up when Walther discontinued its agreement with Manurhin to make the PP series pistols in 1986. As such, they ordered the FEG pistols with very high specifications for fit and finish and they were superbly finished pistols.

(As things developed Interarms was able to obtain the license to distribute PPK and PPK/S pistols in the US that were sub licensed to be made by Ranger Arms, a subsidiary of Mid South. Mid South also made the Walther US labeled pistols after Interarms folded. However they continued to import the FEG pistols as they were very well made and an economical alternative to the PP series.)

TGI also imported these same FEG pistols, but to lower specifications for finish. If you compare them side by side with the Interarms branded pistols you’ll not qualitative differences in the polish, edge treatment and finish.