The trainwreck is starting NOW.

[m1gunner]

How is it that NO member of congress or the president will even bother to read the proposed bill in its entirety?

If they feel it is that good for America, what say we talk about it AFTER they have all READ THE proposed LAW, and before they vote on it.

Why the hurry and secrecy?

 

[redlevel]

 

[Nightowl]

I was talking about this legislation with our HR director the other day. He said the cost of health care is right now about $400 per month per person in this country, every head. With huge efficiencies, this might drop a little. That is a lot of money to extract out of the middle class. You notice that Federal workers and unions are exempt, as I have heard.

To me this is not as much about health care as it is about people control. We have great health care in this country, it is just expensive and the insurance co's don't help much. Maybe we do need some tweeking of the system. Obama care is much, much more than that. It's a socialist system.

 

[29er]

Ha. That train wreck was around the same time Teddy Roosevelt was calling for national health insurance. At least our trains have gotten better.

 

[Spotteddog]

It's said that the definition of insanity, is doing the same thing, over and over, and expecting a different outcome. Exactly how many times is it over the last 4+ decades the left has gone to the scare Hell outta' granny about losing her medical coverage well?
You folks really have to get some new material. This arrows been drawn from the quiver so often now, there's no guide feathers left!

 

[Burley]

Dog, did you read Wickahoney's post? Doing the same thing over and over and expecting the same result might just be the new definition of insanity.

 

[Wickahoney]

Are we REALLY going to make this personal???

 

[Wheelgunner840]

When people go to these town halls and other events and spout the stuff they hear on Fox or talk-radio, they should know who they're helping and who they're hurting. They may think they're helping their granny or their neighbor, but they're not.

Is this what you want for America?

http://www.larryjohnwright.com/tvspots/HeatherSandstrom.wmv

People shouting to be heard does not mean that we are in bed with the insurance companies, just that we do not want the government intruding in decisions that should be between a free person and their doctor.

WG840

 

[shortranger]

Wow. Insurance companies are bad, congress is corrupt, and all of the protestors are simple tools.

Maybe if congress wasn't able to pass laws controlling the insurance industry in the first place, none of this would have happened. However this debate came to be framed as a fight between business and government, that is red herring. Any business that government regulates is a combination of business and government and usually exhibits the worst qualities of both.

And maybe, just maybe, the public is smarter than a lot of clever people think they are.

David

 

[Herknav]

If this bill is so great, why doesn't Congress sign up themselves and THEIR families?

 

[29er]

People shouting to be heard does not mean that we are in bed with the insurance companies, just that we do not want the government intruding in decisions that should be between a free person and their doctor.

Go back and read what the insurance exec said in my previous posts. And then click the link and read his whole interview and it'll be clear who those shouters are helping, whether they know it or not.

 

[WaterburyBob]

Ha. That train wreck was around the same time Teddy Roosevelt was calling for national health insurance. At least our trains have gotten better.

Think: Government-subsidized Amtrac.
Now there's a literal train wreck.

Show me one government program than works better than something the private sector manages in the way of quality, efficiency and waste.

 

[29er]

This is a lot like the run up to Iraq, the right-wing media spouts a lot of nonsense like granny being euthanized and in no time their listeners are hopping mad and repeating those stories on the internet.

By the time we stomped into Iraq most people thought they were behind 9/11 and it turned out the whole thing was based on nothing and we couldn't even pay for it because the rich needed tax cuts.

We aren't hearing "unpatriotic" or "unamerican" but instead "socialist" which is the almost the same thing. And when health care reform goes down in flames, our grandkids will look back amazed at how stupid we were... just like we were about Iraq.

Our IQ as a country has dropped twenty points thanks to Fox and Rush Limbaugh.

 

[woodsltc]

Our IQ as a country has dropped twenty points thanks to Fox and Rush Limbaugh.

Not to hard to see what MSNBC and Keith Olbermann has done for your IQ !!

Don

 

[FrankD45]

Our IQ as a country has dropped twenty points thanks to Fox and Rush Limbaugh.

I would suggest that you abandon rhetoric and do some research on your own. You can start by searching for Ezekiel Emanuel and reading some of his writings. For those who do not know, he is a "Special Adviser" to POTUS on health care. He also happens to be the brother of Rahm Emanuel the Chief of Staff to POTUS. He has some unique ideas on the rationing of health care which some "right wing radicals" say will become necessary under the Presidents plan. Based on my reading of his Hastings article he believes some sort of public forum will have to decide who among us should get which procedure.

You might also do some research on the true nature of the 50 million "Americans" who are without health care. It seems that somehow that number was inflated to include more than 10 million "undocumented travelers".

Without over simplifying, one might also ask why members of congress and union members will be exempted from this plan. Is it because the plan is so good or perhaps because it is flawed?

Finally, lets look at current events. Senator Dodd has been diagnosed with prostrate cancer. The statistical five year survival rate in the UK for such cancers diagnosed in 2001 was 75%. Cancer Research UK : Prostate Cancer survival statistics

In the United States, with our flawed system the five year survival rate is 100%. ACS :: Prostate Cancer Survival Rates

Forgive the length of my post, but I dislike being identified as part of a "mindless mob" doing the bidding of insurance companies.

Frank

 

[Gutpile Charlie]

Excellent post Frank! Very well said.

Charlie

 

[ladder13]

Read his entire interview. Here's a little more:

"TL: What else will we see?

WP: We will see front groups formed to attack any legislation or parts of legislation the industry doesn't like. They've done this in past campaigns. They will use front groups to rip legislation to shreds. It's inevitable that will happen again. It already is. You can be assured that the industry is behind the increasingly vocal opposition to the public plan that would compete with private insurers."

By the way, that interview was on June 24th before we saw any of the town hall meetings being shouted down.

HAHA, we've turned Saul Alinsky's tactics around and used them against your kind. NOW you're mad? HAHA

 

[ladder13]

When people go to these town halls and other events and spout the stuff they hear on Fox or talk-radio, they should know who they're helping and who they're hurting. They may think they're helping their granny or their neighbor, but they're not.

I heard Olbermann like grape Kool-aid, do you?

 

[oldRoger]

Right Frank; It could more properly be called ZekeCare than ObamaCare. Zeke will pick our treatments for us; think of the time savings for both the doctor and patient!
His position is that any test which comes up negative was wasted money
Yes; we inflate the 47 million to 50 million, we include 10-11 million illegals, 9 million mostly children who are eligible for various Fed insurance programs but haven't signed up, up to 20 million who can afford insurance but would rather not spend the money, etc, etc. Damm, we can make this into a crisis, and we don't want to waste a crisis, do we?

.The focus groups said that very few trust congress with their Medical Care.....hmmm........wait no one loves the insurance companies.... I know let's bash the insurance companies to get the sheeples mind away from congress.

 

[judge]

I have one simple question, how are they going to pay for the new programs. We can't even afford Medicare (65 and over), how are we going to pay for 100% coverage?? It's not possible - the country is broke already. When you are 10 trillion dollars in debt, with no hope to pay it back, you are broke!! Any Corporation which kept books like the Govt, would be arrested for fraud. Wake up folks, we are bankrupt and nothing is going to change that in the forseeable future.