Failures to Eject with (Pretty) New 15-22
- Thread starter rraisley
- Start date
Majorlk
Member
The rifle need to go to S&W. It's just that simple.
JaPes
Member
Agreed. The OP did everything prudent to address the issue on his own. At this point, make use of the best feature of a S&W firearm: the 1 year warranty/limited lifetime service warranty.
Gopher Slayer
Member
This
And don't take no for an answer. I would have told that guy off, and then asked to speak to his manager or a real enthusiast. In the last two boxes of 500 round Blazer bulk (not 525 value pack) I haven't had a single issue. That shows how it can be, and how it should be.
DelFuego
Member
I think I am going to stick with the CCI Blazers for some time because they do not cause me any problems. I just bought 3,000 of them from Palmetto State Armory for less than $100 including shipping and tax.
As for your issue, I would believe that there is something wrong and you shouldn't take no for an answer fron S&W.
As for your issue, I would believe that there is something wrong and you shouldn't take no for an answer fron S&W.
I'm not going to the range with this gun any more, at least until or if S&W "fixes" it. I consider it unreliable and unsafe. But I took a bunch of pictures of the parts, hoping someone can spot something. I would have preferred them inline with this post, with explanations, but that takes a lot of room so figured I'd just upload them. UPDATE: Since I can only load a max of 5 pics, I went back to doing them inline:
This shows the ejector (I'm in the middle of cleaning, so don't get too hung up on that). Figured it was the main thing you'd want to be looking at:
The bolt looks like the corner contacting the hammer is rusty and misshapen; that's apparently a reflection, because it's all rounded nicely and smooth.
This attempts to show the top of the ejector; I see no wear on it to indicate it's been hitting anything.
This pic shows that the ejector is parallel with the ejection slot, and hopefully the bolt. Not sure if it should be, though.
These show the ejector close to the bolt, as recommended.
The barrel and spring in the background are from my M&P 9C, so obviously have nothing to do with this.
I tried to measure the distance between the top of the ejector and the bottom of the bolt where it slides, but have no way of doing it. To me, it is the last thing that could be wrong. It seems like it should be a bit higher, to hit the ejecting shell better, but it is pretty parallel, so I don't know. I estimate about 0.05" clearance between the top of the ejector and the bolt, but that's just a guess.
Anyhow, there it is, in all its ugly glory. I'd love to hear I have something backwards or that the ejector needs bent up to work right. But I'm not holding my breath.
DelFuego
Member
I just took mine apart to compare it to yours and I don't see anything obvious. Any other comments?
Erno86
Member
I'm not an expert on this subject, but your extractor looks a bit dirty. May I suggest that you get a powerful degreaser {if you have not already}, while wearing eyepro, and spray behind the extractor housing groove. See if the extractor has spring tension. Or... just remove the whole extractor and clean it --- and look and see if the extractor spring is broken or seated properly.
Last edited:
Majorlk
Member
Based solely on the photographs, the bolt and everything associated with it seems clean and in proper order. The tiny bit of residue around the extractor is meaningless. Other than the ejector being slightly separated from the body of the bolt, I don't see anything wrong there, either. On mine, there is virtually no gap between the bolt body and the ejector.
The extractor is free and moves fine, and the spring works. When you mention that on your 15-22, there is virtually no gap between the bolt body and the ejector, do you mean horizontally (which I have adjusted to be as close as possible) or vertically (where I definitely do have a gap, and it does seem to me a bit low compared to the bore)?
Majorlk
Member
The gap, or lack of it, is the flat-to-bolt contact; it lies flat against the bolt recess.
DLS- I bought mine in May 2010. I went through the normal processes, different ammo, cleaning, etc. It would run ok sometimes then not. I tried about everything ever suggested on this site. Frustrated I finally sent it back to S&W. I contacted customer service and had a FEDEX return label e-mailed to me the same day. Sent it off and got it back in 15 days, at no cost to me. I don't know what they did, and they didn't say in the return letter. But I have never had a problem since, with any ammo. Also I read somewhere to only load 23 rounds in the mag. This seems to work well.
I only have five 25 round mags. I can run trough them all in no time. No problems.
Smith will make it right for you!!!
Guy22
I don't see any obvious problems in your pictures....that said, the most common reason any semi-action firearm, to "fail to eject", is usually an improper fitting extractor....If you place a fired case in the bolt recess, being held by the extractor, will it stay in place if moved around in your hand? With the bolt reassembled in the gun, Will the fired case stay in place as it is pulled from the chamber until it contacts the ejector? Will the fired case stay in place, pulled from the chamber, until it contacts the ejector with a loaded magazine in place in the gun...It it fails, and the case falls out anywhere along the line then the extractor needs attention as it is not holding the fired case securely enough.....most extractors can be massaged slightly by increasing spring tension and removing a burr or small amount of metal to allow the extractor to press harder on the rim head and thus hold the fired case in place till it contacts the ejector....this is where I'd look first........ best regards Plum
I /can/ place the case precisely in the bolt recess, under the extractor (if careful), and it will stay in place when the bolt is moved around.
Nope. It does pull it out fine (never had a problem that it didn't), as long as the barrel is supporting the case, but falls out as soon as it's free of the barrel. If I tilt the gun 90 degrees so that the ejector port is /down/, the case stays in place until it hits the ejector, but not vertical (normal operation) or at other angles. It seems to be balanced there when pulled out; I certainly can't touch it without it falling. For these tests, I placed the shell/case in the barrel, and released the bolt to slam into place, then pulled back slowly.
Didn't try it with a loaded magazine, as it failed the previous test. So, obviously my extractor is not working properly.
Now, I was fine with bending the ejector this way and that. I'm not even sure how to remove the extractor, or if I should. Should it be sent back to S&W then, or can someone point me to what to do on the web somewhere? It seems to have plenty of spring tension, the area is clear, it moves freely. But I don't know if it needs more or less clearance between the extractor and the bolt face, or less. I don't think I should be changing springs.
I just want to throw this in here as I do in many problem threads blaming ammo makers and ammo in particular, I see it over and over and over. Maybe with this gun in particular(15-22) ammo can be a problem, but I promise you, its not the ammo all the time. Ive got thousands and thousands (probably around 20k tbh) of assorted ammo through another tacticool 22 without any mishaps.
now, to the OP, if you arent comfortable with your 15-22 and working on it yourself, send it in. S&W WILL make it right for you unless you get one of the very few CS reps they have that are completely useless. I wont list names on the forum but dang some of them are awful. haha
now, to the OP, if you arent comfortable with your 15-22 and working on it yourself, send it in. S&W WILL make it right for you unless you get one of the very few CS reps they have that are completely useless. I wont list names on the forum but dang some of them are awful. haha
Majorlk
Member
You need to send your rifle back to S&W instead of monkeying around with the ejector and/or extractor when you obviously don't know what you are doing. I know that's harsh, but do you want your rifle fixed right or not?
As it is now, you are accomplishing nothing towards having a properly functioning firearm.
As it is now, you are accomplishing nothing towards having a properly functioning firearm.
Yeah, maybe a bit harsh. If you follow this thread, you'll find when I posted my experiences here, from the beginning, I was told to clean the gun before shooting (I had), to not expect a dirty gun to shoot well (it wasn't dirty), to try different ammo (I did), to try better ammo (I did - CCI AR Tactical was supposedly developed specifically for the S&W M&P 15-22). I was also told that probably the ejector NOT the extractor was not positioned properly, and several people gave reference information, and I even found videos, showing how to do that.
It didn't help. But I don't exactly call following people's suggestions as "monkeying around" nor am I completely incapable of knowing what I'm doing. Until the post about the extractor from Plumbago, giving some specific and helpful steps to check out how it should really work, I feel I acted properly posting here and trying things. But I also know when to quit monkeying around, and I know when to stop when it comes to removing or modifying parts that S&W doesn't even tell you how to remove, so will probably be calling S&W CS tomorrow. But if no one posted here trying to fix their problems, then 1) there would be little need for the forums, and 2) S&W would be inundated with guns people hadn't even tried to troubleshoot.
Last edited:
harsh but i have to agree. i know there are times where i try to fix a problem myself but if i have an easy/sure way out (s&w) after giving it a go, then im humble enough to take it.
Majorlk
Member
I've followed the thread from day one and read as you tried this and that and ignored the several suggestions that something is not right and you should send it to S&W. Instead, you ignore that sage advice and putter around some more, with no better results, even asking about removing parts that aren't user-removable.
And you wonder why patience wears a little thin.
And you wonder why patience wears a little thin.
The ONE person who pointed to what is probably the problem, Plumbago, also suggested "most extractors can be massaged slightly by increasing spring tension and removing a burr or small amount of metal to allow the extractor to press harder on the rim head and thus hold the fired case in place till it contacts the ejector....this is where I'd look first". Since everyone else kept talking about ammo and the Ejector, that's where I looked. I don't call that ignoring sage advice. When the advice turned to calling S&W, in fact I did. Now I will again. In fact, 4 days ago /I/ asked if it was time to send the gun to S&W, and other "sages" responded it probably was, along with some other things to try or look at, which I did.I've followed the thread from day one and read as you tried this and that and ignored the several suggestions that something is not right and you should send it to S&W. Instead, you ignore that sage advice and putter around some more, with no better results, even asking about removing parts that aren't user-removable.
And you wonder why patience wears a little thin.
And geez! It just realized was YOUR post that indicated the gap on the ejector looked to be larger than yours, which is the main reason why I went to these extra steps! Here I was thinking it was someone else helping with that advice, but the advice about the gap on the ejector was yours, and when I take it, I get blamed for ignoring advice and not contacting S&W instead!??
Anyhow, I guess you're right. I'll send my gun back to S&W and not bother trying to get help here. At least without getting yelled at.
