Florida Carry sues Deputy Andy Cox of Citrus PD
- Thread starter Xtasy
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P33v3
Member
That is an interesting point. While I fully support law enforcement and have family members who are in law enforcement, he (the cop) did make a statement that could be construed as a threat of death against the citizen, he did technically illegally detain him. I know of a case from several years ago in Florida where a security guard lost sight of someone who he thought was trying to steal something. The person had actually put the item back on the shelf. The second that the person left the establishment the security guard put his hand on the person's shoulder and said please come inside with me. Guess what? That was illegal detainment. Unfortunately the person he stopped was a skilled attorney. It cost the store $400,000.
Yes the citizen should have stayed in the car. However the officer did not seem at all concerned about it. The citizen should have identified he was carrying a concealed weapon the moment he was stopped with his hand still on the wheel. However, I do not believe there is that requirement in Florida.
I do think the officer needs some serious counseling. He acts like what Ronald Reagan said about the ATF "a jackbooted Government thug". He should be pulled from the street and surf a desk. His service pistol needs to be turned in.
Our police officers have a difficult job. For the most part these quiet professionals do a fine job. However, there are some people through no fault of their own other than the way they were made at the DNA level, do not have the temperament or tools to handle the job. As mentioned above the officer is extremely lucky to have stopped level headed law abiding citizens. Had the wife been armed and the least bit fearful we may have been reading about another fallen officer. Had she gotten on her cell phone and dialed *FHP for the Florida Highway Patrol the officer could have been arrested and disgraced for threatening to commit murder, kidnapping, unlawful imprisonment, etc. This type of behavior puts communities and individuals who's relationship with law enforcement is already tenuous in further jeopardy.
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Faulkner
Member
Unprofessional behavior by the officer . . . seems to indicate a lack of training. That was not a situation that warranted such behavior and language and we have terminated deputies in our department for as much.
Even though he was treated shabbily, Mr. John Q. Public was the much more calm and collected person in that situation.
Deputy should be terminated, period. Sheriff and command officers should have mandatory training in leadership, command and control of Officers (Deputies) need to have on going repetitive training and hold them to the standards developed by a Florida Law Enforcement Training Instructor. This video should be included on LEO training of what NOT to do on a traffic stop.THis Deputy reminds me of the Ex- Canton Ohio LEO that was threatening to shoot people - until the vodeo went out and the city was forced to fire him.
This Deputy was a modern day "Barney Fife" with bad language.
This Deputy was a modern day "Barney Fife" with bad language.
Kilibreaux
Member
I smell BS big time!
Anyone who chooses to carry a WEAPON of ANY kind should always be aware of every aspect of that weapon during every movement he makes!
This sounds a LOT like yet another, "I gots a permits an ahm agonna show my ***!" In fact, the officer's REACTION Is completely PREDICTABLE and EXPECTED by any normal person not trying to play games. If I were conducting a traffic stop and the bag stepped out of his car that would be my third "go on alert" signal, and when he turned around and moved in such a way as to "show me" his big bad gun I would have done what the cop did...sure enough! The PERMISSION to carry a firearm concealed does NOT...I repeat, DOES NOT give the person carrying "carte blanc" to display, or brandish, however "unintentional" the dweeb wants to pretend his actions were. NOBODY who carries weapons should EVER "accidentally" reveal his carry. Had this dweeb done a similar stunt in the local Grocery store, GUESS WHAT...he'd would have likely ended up just as arrested! Because "letting his gun peek out" is no different than PULLING IT OUT and depending upon the thoughts and beliefs of the OBSERVER, could be interpreted as a threat!
I'm all about concealed carry...but despite how this all "looks" and seems to play out in the world of broadband on a forum of "pro carry" members, the last thing "we" need is another "poseur" who chose to carry in such a way, CHOSE to behave in such as way, and CHOSE to move in such a way as to GUARANTEE the cop saw he (the dipstick) was just as big and bad as the cop!
The REASON the cop survived the investigation was because his actions were JUSTIFIED under the circumstances!
The REASON no "Federal Civil Rights Violation" suit will NOT prevail is because the COP was acting WITHIN the scope of his authority to arrest the fool!
Just because one has mommy's "permission" to carry a gun doesn't mean they've been granted immunity from every other law on the books, and it doesn't mean they CAN'T act unlawfully, or criminally given the circumstances. What THAT means is, the cop had no reason to "trust" that this doofus who was clearly "displaying" (communicating a threat) would not turn around and start shooting...how about everyone taking a look at the THOUSANDS of videos out there that go the OTHER WAY!
The world is chock full of "poseurs" - "wannabes" - wannabe "bad@$$es who jump through the hoops - dot every "i" can cross every "t" to make themselves all "legal" so they can then go around engaging in a fantasy world of self-importance.
The George Zimmerman case threw back the curtain on just such a person and just such behavior. Dude with "Little Man Syndrome" gets carry permit, creates his own personal neighborhood watch, makes it his "mission" to go out and "patrol" and engages in actions that lead up to a deadly confrontation that never had to happen, but "under the law" he was all "legal" so he was emboldened to act. Despite how the jury ruled based on evidence versus conjecture, everyone who has ever been a fist fight knows there was no way Trayvon could have held Zimmerman down and pummeled him had Zimmerman been mounting ac ACTIVE, TWO-HANDED defense, but he wasn't...you see, he was keeping one hand on his "insurance policy"...which he revealed when he stated he felt Martin "going for his gun." Zimmerman LET himself take a few hits before pulling his gun and shooting...sure he walked...based upon the law in Florida he HAD to walk, and certainly his actions leading up to the situation were all nice and "legal" but this is where the 2nd degree part pops up...that whole "Depraved Mind"...the dude who DOES EVERYTHING RIGHT AND LEGAL but inside...in his depraved mind his agenda was to create and play out a scenario of power over another human. The "proof" has been playing out in the POST trial period as we see George popping up in one "situation" after another. Just wait...he got away with the first murder, he's sure he'll get away with the next, but all his actions in the meantime now that we "know him" better will come to bear against him the NEXT TIME...and there will be a next time for George I'm sad to say.
So, despite what criticism I'm SURE to draw for not leaping on the abusive cop, poor civil rights deprived citizen band wagon, I know the "type"....we ALL know the type once we remove our "fear of government intrusion" filters.
Oh, and another point in defense of the cop...they're TRAINED to react as he did because in another circumstance, on another day, that's what will save his LIFE!
Police Officers are granted WIDE LATITUDE for one major reason...THEY are the "thin blue line" between the creeps and society! They are charged with the duty to SOLVE the problem...if someone wants to fight it out...the cops MUST fight it out! IF someone wants to shoot it out...the cops MUST shoot it out! The Police don't get to say, "oh hell, this dude is just too bad@SS for us, let's let HIM go!" Cops are charged with the duty to enforce the law up to and including their own death, or the death of the "citizen" who's amoral and criminal behavior resulted in such dire consequences! People need to THINK about that...those cops everyone likes to diss for "over reacting" might be DEAD tomorrow conducting another traffic stop because YOU supported some wimp-punk with an agenda winning a Law-changing suit that stripped him (the cop) of HIS RIGHT TO ACT!
One thing positive I will say about the cops here in Fresno is they NEVER back off, and when the little criminal "gangstas" pop up from their trash bin, the FPD goes after 'em and shoots it out...bingo, another thug off the street not costing the taxpayers a fortune to support! I WANT the police to act aggressively when it comes to criminal behavior and I don't want the cops "neutered" by manipulative civil rights cases...
I've "learned" that as long as a person doesn't start acting like a fool, or trying to be a bad-@$$, or trying to impress (intimidate) a cop during a traffic stop, and as long as a person speaks and responds respectfully and doesn't work to inflame the situation, the cop is going to treat them in like manner. I've been pulled over carrying a virtual arsenal in my car and on my person and NEVER ONCE been searched, arrested, or "deprived of my civil rights" by a police officer, and the REASON is because I wasn't trying to play out my own personal agenda on the side of the road! I might have been "carrying concealed" but I wasn't trying to IMPRESS anyone with my gun, or my "rig" or my superior status! And this is how people SHOULD carry concealed....even if you have a "permit" CARRY LIKE YOU'RE DOING SO ILLEGALLY! Carry like you KNOW you'll go to jail if "caught!" Carry because you want to have the final option to save your life or the life of another, but NOT because you want to feed your ego...because you're "looking for trouble."
And finally - for good measure, for EVERY case where someone can claim the cops are the bad guys for "dissing" a punk who tried to brandish on them, there's a MANIAC like the one in the Theater who didn't like the dude texting on his phone...SO HE SHOT HIM DEAD! Certainly with his "legally carried concealed handgun." You might want to worry about the backlash from THAT sort of misuse of the CC system, and the civil rights of the DEAD guy!
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Rastoff
US Veteran
Wow, I mean just wow. Kilibreaux, did you watch the same video I did? The one the OP posted?
Clearly not.
Clearly not.
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cmort666
Member
I do not think that word means what you think it does...
gunblade
Member
FLSTFI
Member
Kilibreaux, lucky for us you are a nurse and not a cop.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
i still like the part ill shoot u in the back
NAM68
US Veteran
Open carry is a bad idea. You are taking the chance that the police can throw you down to the ground face down and handcuff until they figure it out. Also; some nut can get your pistol away from you. Stay in your car on a traffic stop.
elm_creek_smith
US Veteran
No, it isn't.
In Oklahoma, open carry must be in a holster, and a police officer MAY ask you for your license to carry if he is concerned. He MAY NOT disarm you unless he suspects you of committing a crime. However, if he approaches you, you must notify him that you are legally armed and show him your handgun carry license if he asks for it. (You must also have on you a valid driver's license or state ID card.)
By that reasoning, all police officers should carry concealed. The real story is that there aren't any instances of the "good guy" open carrier getting disarmed by the "bad guy."
Can't argue with that.
ECS
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Rastoff
US Veteran
Are you required to have a license in OK to open carry?
This is not entirely correct. A cop can do just about anything he wants to protect his safety. If he feels that he is unsafe by allowing you to retain your gun, he can take it from you. This has been upheld by the supreme court if I'm not mistaken.
NAM68
US Veteran
I'll say it again,OPEN CARRY IS A BAD IDEA. first of all when police see it,they don't like...and I don't blame them.Also when you conceal carry they will sort it out but don't be surprised when your on the ground handcuffed.
NJDevil72
Member
In any state the police need a reason to handcuff you; in an open carry state one would think that the police KNOW they are in an open carry state and for the most part know where one can carry.
luangtom
US Veteran
Most all courts will support the "Officer Safety" response and uphold the disarming of a citizen, no matter what current law says. Officer Safety trumps what you feel is your right. I am not saying it is correct, but I am speaking from experience and what has been already shown in courts.
elm_creek_smith
US Veteran
Yes. The Concealed Handgun License was changed to a Handgun Carry License on 1 November last year.
From the Oklahoma Self Defense Act:
TITLE 21 § 1290.8 POSSESSION OF LICENSE REQUIRED-NOTIFICATION TO POLICE OF GUN
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B. The person shall be required to have possession of his or her valid handgun license and a valid Oklahoma driver license or an Oklahoma State photo identification at all times when in possession of an authorized pistol. The person shall display the handgun license on demand of a law enforcement officer; provided, however, that in the absence of reasonable and articulable suspicion of other criminal activity, an individual carrying an unconcealed handgun shall not be disarmed or physically restrained unless the individual fails to display a valid handgun license in response to that demand.
ECS
elm_creek_smith
US Veteran
Odd. The police officers I know understand that people carrying handguns openly in holsters are on their side. I don't know of a single police officer in Oklahoma who doesn't like it. Not saying there are such, I just haven't met them.
ECS
