Probably Would Have Been Better off Keeping My Mouth Shut
- Thread starter Smoke
- Start date
amazingflapjack
US Veteran
Drag through the mud? Oh well-never mind why I was interested.
He is.....
Not that it will change anything but why were you interested?
The gas station story sounds like she's destined to be a statistic we hear about in that if you carry a gun, you're more likely to be killed with it than with something else.
Unfortunately, some mistakenly think that if they are armed with a firearm, it is enough to repel an attack and never consider that they have just opened the door to their demise unless they are prepared to use it.
The good Lord may have just informed her (through you) that she may need further instruction. Regardless, I wouldn't worry about it.
Unfortunately, some mistakenly think that if they are armed with a firearm, it is enough to repel an attack and never consider that they have just opened the door to their demise unless they are prepared to use it.
The good Lord may have just informed her (through you) that she may need further instruction. Regardless, I wouldn't worry about it.
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forrestinmathews
Member
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Church security detail needs to recieve the details you ask for. Otherwise kindly let someone else put his posterior in potential harm's way. Good that you checked up on the legality of what you're doing there. Sounds just enough organized to be construed as private security and arming yourself for this purpose in my state would put you in violation of the law and outside the scope of your authority to carry concealed or openly. Make certain someone hasn't just conveniently waived their interpretive magic wand over it. Everyone in your group ought know just how far their "authority" extends. This just sounds like a legal nightmare...sorry.
Guess Colorado's more enlightened about organized security than other places.
Smoke, I think your heart is in the right place. And I commend you for volunteering. But:
Things I learned from numerous assignments supporting VIP security: never volunteer anything to the protectee or the "inner circle." You aren't there as an advisor (unless that's the assignment.) Even if they ask for advice, don't (again, unless that's your role.). If they want to say something conversational to you, fine. Just don't be the first to talk (unless it's a requirement, like telling them which direction to go.) Mind your own business and just do the assignment.
That's how the pros do it...and doing it their way will make you look like a pro, too.
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Just exactly how big is this church? The 500 member church down the street from me has a "security team" with very nice bright yellow collared shirts. They direct traffic, open and lock doors, and make sure the head count in the nursery doesn't change unexpectedly. It is possible that "security team" is being overthought. Just my opinion, based on the limited information.
andyo5
Member
So she did not thank you for the advice. So what?
I think that your advice given just before she drove away was good advise.
If she didn't appreciate it at the time, she may later on. Don't feel so bad about it.
Or is an ego thing? Are you disappointed that she did not give you praise for your expertise?
I think that your advice given just before she drove away was good advise.
If she didn't appreciate it at the time, she may later on. Don't feel so bad about it.
Or is an ego thing? Are you disappointed that she did not give you praise for your expertise?
Protected One
Member
Now remember, smoke...don't let all this "unsolicited" advice cause you to give them the look. 
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Something to Remember.
I was the senior firearms instructor for a federal law enforcement agency for nearly three decades. If there's one thing I've learned, and for which I've had constant reinforcement, it is: the most difficult people to save are those who must be saved from themselves.
I was the senior firearms instructor for a federal law enforcement agency for nearly three decades. If there's one thing I've learned, and for which I've had constant reinforcement, it is: the most difficult people to save are those who must be saved from themselves.
warbird
Member
A very accurate statement.
And of that group, those who either don't want to be saved from themselves, or refuse to admit it's needed, are probably best left to become examples to others who are on the fence.
Try not to let it get on your shoes, though.
I still don't understand the whole concept of a church security team. From my experience in church structure the insurance company and church lawyers would throw you under the bus.
Unless you have WRITTEN, contractual agreement with the Church or are and active duty LEO, I can't see how being on an armed church security team is anything more than a lifetime of liability.
Unless you have WRITTEN, contractual agreement with the Church or are and active duty LEO, I can't see how being on an armed church security team is anything more than a lifetime of liability.
She is one of those high and mighty leaders who in her mind is always right. Just the kind of people you want in a religious organization.
I'm not sure I ever read where they were armed? Several posters have made assumptions, but Smoke never said it, in my quick review . . .
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My church? We run right around 5000.
The duties of our security team are pretty much as you say we direct traffic in the parking lot, watch the children's church area and watch over the playground if the kids go out.
We also have someone drive around the lot and deter vehicle break ins (Pastor's car got stolen right out of the parking lot last year). Make sure doors are locked and follow the ushers when they empty the collection boxes at the end of service. (Our church doesn't take a public offering we believe your giving is between you and God and we have collection boxes at various places throughout the lobby to facilitate that).
We also act as bouncers if someone disrupts the service.
New Life Church (not my church) has a ministry devoted solely to helping other churches set up their security teams and helping pass on lessons they learned when they had their active shooter incident. The head of security at my church worked very closely with them when setting up our security ministry and we were very careful to stay within the bounds of Colorado law.
And yes we are armed and yes we are covered under the church's insurance rider
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