Official Police contact- What do you say?

[Fred_G]

In Louisiana, we are required to inform on any 'official' dealings with the LEO.

After a wreck, I just handed the officer my permit on top of my DL, registration and proof of insurance, and told him I am armed, not sure what to do. He just told me to keep it in the holster.

Another time I was being questioned by a LEO, but they did not identify themselves as LEO, a bit odd, but I asked her at one point, and she said she was LEO. I informed her I was armed. She just told me 'don't show me yours, and i won't show you mine'. She was cute, I was tempted to confess to something.

I would think it is best to inform the LEO. Be respectful and it is usually given back. A LEO seeing a gun on you 12 mins into a traffic stop could get ugly.

Before I got my carry permit, I got pulled over, had my SD gun under the seat, and two other handguns in the truck that I was trying to sell at work. They wanted to search for 'burglary tools', as I had driven through an area that had had a lot of breakins. I allowed them to search, told them where the guns were, and which one was loaded. We chatted about guns for a while.

Not sure if I would allow a search like that now, but who knows.

 

[LenS]

Mass is also a No Declare state and I have also been thinking about this scenario. My first impression is that since I've never been asked to step out of my car in my life, that I would be silent on the issue. But there have been situations where a pair of officers were involved in the stop with one on the driver side and one checking in on the passenger side. On the off chance that the passenger side LEO caught sight of the firearm as I was getting my wallet out of my right rear pocket, it would be VERY SMART to say something first, or to carry my wallet in the offside pocket I guess.
Good thing to consider in any case.

There are cultural issues to consider in how you handle this situation in places that don't require notification. In places like MA, most cops have little to no familiarity with guns (they only shoot 50-100 rds/year to qualify and no more, many couldn't even tell you what gun they carry) other than in the hands of bad guys. Telling some of them that you have a LTC and are carrying is very likely to end in a "felony stop" that gets very ugly. Some will be cool with the notification. So it really is a crapshoot. I was stopped while carrying by a Boston PO who was one nasty dude, he was spitting nails and I just answered yes sir/no sir and nothing more. I'm certain that he would have proned me out on the SE Xwy if he knew I was carrying. I did not ID myself as a PO either, I just gave him my DL and Reg and let him bluster away.

And if an officer is going to see your gun/holster when you reach for your wallet, you need to reassess how you carry and dress. Does someone at the supermarket/gas station/fast food store see it when you reach to pay too??

 

[S&W SS Revolvers]

I received a traffic ticket from a CO State Patrolman 2 weeks ago. I do not have a CCP yet and while what I did not harm anyone or impede traffic...it wasn't "legal". At first I was PO'd...then as he approached the vehicle and I watched his actions. I thought this guy has a lotta' guts and his name tag said since 1993.

We had a professional exchange...no BS and as I drove away I couldn't help thinking of his encounters and how much adrenaline would have been running in this man's life since 1993. There are a million other life threatning things I'd rather do than pull over some car...

Here soon I am stopping by their office not far from work just to tell them and hopefully him how much I appreciate their guts and professionalism. No kiss *** stuff...I was simply impressed.

 

[RobzGuns]

Here in my parts, there's no real verbal declaration.
The few times I've been stopped, When I hand over my DL, I also hand him/her my CHL.
The cop asks: 'Are you carrying now?'
I reply: 'Yes sir, I am.'
The cop then usually replies: 'Without touching it (or 'without showing it to me'), where on your person is it?'
I reply: 'in my Right Front pocket'.
The cop usually replies with some sort of version of: 'Okay' and that's that (for the firearm anyway ).

By this time, we've both had a chance to size each other up and things get cordial. Between being non-threatening to his/her authority, me being a retired Fire-Medic with lots of cop friends (and an IAFF Logo on the window), it usually ends with a verbal warning.

Unofficial TX recommendations:

• Leave your weapon wherever it is
• Without declaring that 'you have a gun' (which could get misconstrued), Simply hand over your Carry Permit WITH your Driver License.
• Let the Police Officer direct the conversation about the firearm. He/She may not even query about it past seeing the card.
• If he/she needs to see it, let them direct how you will do that.

 

[Silvergoose]

At least in Arkansas the police/troopers can access your driving license and determine that you also have a CC permit. This was brought to my attention when driving onto the Little Rock Air Force Base. After presenting my I.D. and driving license, security asked if I had my weapon on my person. I did not. No other questions were asked.
On another day I had been involved in a minor fender bender,struck from the rear. When the officer arrived I informed him that I had a CHL, he said"yes, I knew that before I got out of my car. Nothing else was said.

I think that police need to be informed and that as long as you are professional and polite all will go well.

 

[STCM(SW)]

I accept Ayoob's approach, I'd inform him regardless even if not required.
Doesn't hurt; if I were him I'd appreciate it. Being cooperative can go both ways in a situation like that.

Just what I do.
Think it got me out of a ticket at least once....

 

[Ματθιας]

In NM the vehicle is considered an extension of your house. It means, legally, you can have a concealed loaded weapon in your vehicle.

In the 90's, I got pulled over a couple of blocks from my house for not coming to a complete stop at a stop sign. Along with "do you know why I stopped you questions, the officer asked me if I had a weapon in the car. I told him I did. He asked If he could search my car. I gave him permission. I had a clean record and I had nothing to hide.
He opens my hatch, I had an IROCZ, and finds an unloaded one and a half month old Colt Gold Cup in my ALICE pack along with four magazines and and a couple of boxes of ammo.
He then starts to ask me all kinds of questions about my weapon, why someone "like me" would have an expensive weapon like that and if I could actually prove I was the owner. I couldn't prove I was the owner as I didn't have any paperwork with me. To make a long story short, he confiscates my weapon for "safe keeping." I wasn't cited. I broke no law. As I'm sitting on the curb, I notice, he has a 1911.

For over a month I went to the PD asking for my weapon. I had my receipt, and a copy of the 4473. I called everyday and I went every lunch hour to find out what was going on. I couldn't get a copy of the incident report I saw officer fill out for nearly a month.

Shortly after I got the report, weapon suddenly appears. When I look it over, I notice my weapon is extremely dirty with powder residue. Then, I notice that my barrel had been changed out along with my trigger, guide rod and grip safety to standard Colt parts. My magazines were no longer Colts, but beat up GI issue. I was not happy and there was nothing I could do.

When I asked my our family lawyer if there was anything I could do, he said I should be happy I got my gun back as the stuff in the evidence room had a habit of disappearing in what later became known as the "Evidence Room Scandal."

Had I not been a persistent pain with paperwork, I probably never would've gotten my weapon back.

My lesson is that I'll not admit anything in a traffic stop and I'll not consent to a search. Ever.

 

[Rifleman762]

First off, I'm truely sorry to hear some members here have (due to no fault of their own) have had bad encounters with Law Enforcement. Out of all the LEOs out there, there are bound to be a few bad apples. Just like gun owners, priests, teachers, and all other people out there, some are bound to be some bad apples. However, most of us are truely trying to do our best in a very difficult job, during a very difficult time.

Now, I'm sure there are a lot of different opinions on this subject. I can only comment to my experience and opinion pertaining to being a peace officer in California, and carrying a CCW prior to law enforcement (outside CA).

In 10 years as a LEO, I've only encountered a CCW licenced citizen once. Most LEOs I work with have NEVER encountered a citizen with a CCW. I'm sure the same cannot be said for cops working in other more 2nd ammendment friendly states.

In California, my recommendation when you get stopped is to..
-pull over as soon as feasible
-roll down driver and passenger windows
-turn off engine, and radio
-turn on dome/cab lights if dark outside
-keep hands on steering wheel when officer approaches
-be polite, and advise the officer you are legally licensed to carry a concealed weapon.
-when asked, tell the officer where your weapon is. Don't make sudden moves.

When I'm pulled over, I pretty much do the same thing. I remove my wallet /badge as soon as I stop and lay it in my lap before putting my hands at 10 and 2. This keeps me from having to reach out of view for my LEO ID. I did the same when I had a CCW.

Now, some people say not to say "gun or weapon", and that might work in many states. But in California many officers simply do not encounter CCWs. When hearing "I have a CCW permit" they might not recognize it means a legal license to carry a concealed pistol. I do think "firearm" or "weapon" is a better word to use than "gun".

Comply with officers. Some might have you exit the vehicle, and inspect your weapon while others may not.

Speaking as a supporter of the 2nd ammendment and a previous CCW holder, be very polite. Any negative interaction a police officer/citizen has with a CCW holder is potentially one less person voting to protect our 2nd ammendment rights. In California, we need all the help we can get.

 

[cracker57]

I tell my students to notify even though it is not required in WI. on the use of the word gun avoid using it. Gun is the trigger word for LEOS to draw theirs, when a cop sees a gun he yells gun and any officer will be on the ready. I tell people to turn on the dome, roll all windows down so the officer can see who is in the car, take out your DL and CCW permit place them on the dash then keep both hands on the wheel you should be able to do this before he gets to your window I remember a K-9 cop in a class who said the word gun was a trigger word for his k-9 and yes he agreed the use of the word gun should never be used.

 

[Acroyer]

In Ohio, we have to notify, sometimes yelling it over whatever the officer is saying to get it out. Our laws do not define when notification must take place, but the officer can charge with failure to notify if you can't get it out fast enough. It has happened that way a few times according to some Ohio CCW forums I frequent. I have only had to inform once when I had a flat tire and a state patrolman pulled in behind me to see what was going on. It was no big deal.

As for how I inform, I like the conversation to go this way:

Policeman: Do you know why I stopped you?
Me: Do YOU know that I pay your salary?

That always sets he right tone for the encounter.

 

[Smoke]

I used to debate this topic all over the Internet and I don't think I ever changed a single person's mind.

What generally happens (As stated in post 27) is someone has a run in with a bad cop and decides they'll never make that mistake again.

My run in was in 1991. I was arrested for a crime I didn't commit, the detective investigating the case as much as told me he didn't think I did it and still tried to pin it on me.

Long story short I was never formally charged,the case was dropped and I decided I was never going to make that mistake again.

I was pulled over by a State Trooper who went off on me because I didn't inform him I was armed. A few months later I read in the paper that he murdered his wife and killed himself in a domestic violence incident. You have no way of knowing what kind of person the cop you're interacting with is.

I really don't care if it makes the cop's life easier or that it makes him more comfortable that I automatically inform him I'm armed. It's in my best interests to maintain my boundaries and assert my Rights.

Consequently I never

Volunteer information
Answer any question I'm not legally required to answer
Consent to a search.

 

[Warren Sear]

I used to debate this topic all over the Internet and I don't think I ever changed a single person's mind.

What generally happens (As stated in post 27) is someone has a run in with a bad cop and decides they'll never make that mistake again.

My run in was in 1991. I was arrested for a crime I didn't commit, the detective investigating the case as much as told me he didn't think I did it and still tried to pin it on me.

Long story short I was never formally charged,the case was dropped and I decided I was never going to make that mistake again.

I was pulled over by a State Trooper who went off on me because I didn't inform him I was armed. A few months later I read in the paper that he murdered his wife and killed himself in a domestic violence incident. You have no way of knowing what kind of person the cop you're interacting with is.

I really don't care if it makes the cop's life easier or that it makes him more comfortable that I automatically inform him I'm armed. It's in my best interests to maintain my boundaries and assert my Rights.

Consequently I never

Volunteer information
Answer any question I'm not legally required to answer
Consent to a search.

That's it right there!

I also have had trouble with aggressive, a hole police officers.

Now, I do nothing until they ask. If I am pulled over, I keep my hands on the wheel. If they want me to roll down the window, they will ask. If they want to see my driver's licence, etc. they will ask. To my way of thinking, making no movements until told will keep them from thinking I might be reaching for a weapon, hiding drugs, etc.

No way would I ever volunteer information that I am armed, as this is not required in the state where I live.

No way that I would ever volunteer for them to search me or my vehicle.

 

[Rastoff]

And if an officer is going to see your gun/holster when you reach for your wallet, you need to reassess how you carry and dress. Does someone at the supermarket/gas station/fast food store see it when you reach to pay too??

Absolutely! We need to learn to dress around the gun.

This was brought to my attention when driving onto the Little Rock Air Force Base. After presenting my I.D. and driving license, security asked if I had my weapon on my person. I did not. No other questions were asked.

It's a good thing you didn't have your gun with you. It would have been a very different encounter if you had. It's a felony to bring a firearm onto a military installation and the gate guards are usually bored. They'd relish an opportunity to "jack you up" and put your face in the pavement.

I remove my wallet /badge as soon as I stop and lay it in my lap before putting my hands at 10 and 2. This keeps me from having to reach out of view for my LEO ID. I did the same when I had a CCW.

A lot of people say this, but since you have experience as an LEO, I have a question about that. Most men carry their wallet in their back pocket. To get it requires tilting over a little and reaching around. This is a lot of movement. Don't you think it's better to wait until he tells you to get it after informing him where it is? That way the policeman won't be wondering what you were reaching for. What do you think?

As for how I inform, I like the conversation to go this way:

Policeman: Do you know why I stopped you?
Me: Do YOU know that I pay your salary?

That always sets he right tone for the encounter.

Yes, it sets the tone alright, but not the right one. It says, "I think I'm more important than you and you are beneath me. You are my subordinate and I will treat you with no respect." Is that really the tone you want to set?

If I were a policeman and you said this to me, any chance of a warning just went out the window.

 

[Mainsail]

I don't have a hard & fast rule- I play it by ear and the officer's attitude. We don't need to inform here. If the officer talks to me about my vehicle speed with an attitude like I just got caught with his wife, I'll be just as short and provide only the info requested. If his demeanor is professional, I will be as friendly and polite as possible, tell him I'm carrying and hope for the best.

If I'm out and about carrying openly and he stops simply to give me grief, I'll politely ask if I am being detained and if not, wish him or her a nice day and walk away.

 

[Rifleman762]

Rastoff, in my experience the majority of citizens reach for their license before being approached by officers anyway. So officers see that movement all the time. I personally find better to do that little bit of movement prior to being approached than having to reach out of sight (and toward my gun) once the officer is at the window. Again, not a hard fast rule. I carry my ID/Badge/License where I can get to it quickly. It's just what I do. YMMV.

Also, I think Acroyer was just making a joke about saying "You know I pay your salary." Everyone knows that paying your taxes (which goes toward public saftey budgets) doesn't make one exempt from obeying the law.

The advice I give younger cops for dealing with citizens is the same I give citizens for dealing with cops. Be polite as possible, and courteous. Just because you can legally do something doesn't mean you should, and just because you legally don't have to do something doesn't mean you shouldn't. Use common sense and treat the person as you would want to be treated if you were in their shoes. But if you want to be a jerk and always draw a hard line, that's your right. If the cop wants to be a jerk and always draw a hard line, that's their right. Luckly, most the time neither do.

 

[Faulkner]

Policeman: Do you know why I stopped you?
Me: No, I am no mind reader.

It went downhill from there.

I find this question interesting . . . must be a TV cop thing. I have never asked anyone "do you know why I stopped you?" In all my 20+ years I don't recall ever hearing any other officer asking that question either.

By law in Arkansas the salutation should go more like this;

"I am Deputy Faulkner with the sheriff's office and the reason I stopped you is . . . . "

 

[ColbyBruce]

When I was a teenager, shortly after the dinosaurs disappeared from Earth, eighteen was the legal drinking age here in Georgia. I went to a club, Penrods, in DeKalb county with friends to celebrate someone's birthday. I was the DD, being I was Baptist and did not drink in my own community. My buddie's Rally Nova got hit in the parking lot by a young woman, so the police were called. My friend goes out to talk with the police who smell alcohol on him, arrest him for DUI, send the woman who hit his car on her merry way, and threaten to arrest me for interfering. I had gone out to unlock the car and get the license and registration info for the cops because I had the car keys. We had been in the club about four hours, it was during the winter, and the engine was stone cold.

Thankfully, a much brighter officer showed up and she actually listened to witnesses and undid everything the first officer did wrong.

Jump ahead to 2003, and my son is playing high school football with a kid whose dad looked real familiar. Yes, it was the moron officer, now an electronics salesman.

 

[ColbyBruce]

I find this question interesting . . . must be a TV cop thing. I have never asked anyone "do you know why I stopped you?" In all my 20+ years I don't recall ever hearing any other officer asking that question either.

By law in Arkansas the salutation should go more like this;

"I am Deputy Faulkner with the sheriff's office and the reason I stopped you is . . . . "

I did know why he stopped me. It was 5:30 a.m. and I was the only vehicle on the road in the city of Stone Mountain, GA besides himself. Dressed in my USPS uniform, I likely looked guilty of something; possibly responsible for the Lindbergh baby kidnapping or the disappearance of Amelia Earhart.

His chief was an acquaintance, so I went by and spoke to him that afternoon. It turned out well after all.

 

[cmort666]

1. Obey the law. If it requires notification, notify. If not, don't.
2. In Ohio notification MUST be verbal and immediate. Merely handing over ones CHL without verbal notification does not meet the statutory requirement and is a crime.
3. If the law requires notification, NOTIFY. If you have to shout over the cop to notify, do so without hesitation. People here have been charged with failure to notify for obeying a cop's ORDERS to remain silent.
4. Record the interaction so that you have a RECORD of your notification.

 

[hatt]

Don't ask don't tell. Several people I know that were eager to tell were disarmed, gun unloaded, numbers ran, gun put in trunk and other assorted nonsense for a simple traffic stop that would have otherwise taken a couple minutes.