Why a Smith?

[SCBoy]

First time post here. First of all, allow me to introduce myself. I'm an older guy, in my 60's, and a life-long shooter...mostly handguns and shotguns, but I also have a long term love affair with .22lr's. In fact, I still have and regularly shoot a Winchester Model 74 that my grandfather purchased in the early 1940's.

After retiring I got the shooting bug again and became fascinated with the AR platform. I've been researching them for quite sometime. About six months ago I got my hands on a S&W 15-22 and I've had a blast with it. It's really a fun gun to shoot & mod. A real can-killer. However, I'm almost to the point of stepping up to a real AR-15.

My question is: Why a Smith?

Don't get me wrong, my first instinct is to go with the Smith AR-15, basically because of their reputation and my years' long experience with many, many Smith handguns. But I'd like to hear your opinions.

My purpose for this gun is a reasonably accurate and reliable funshooter that would also be a dependable defensive weapon should the need ever arise.

Thanks in advance for your comments. As you all know, there is a bewildering number of brands and models out there. I'm just looking for a little advice from folks that own and shoot these weapons.

 

[Abflyboy]

I would probably choose other manufacturers over S&W when going to an AR15.

Armalite, Bushmaster, Colt, DPMS, Rock River Arms . . .

The S&W M&P Sport is definitely a well priced rifle, though. I've never fired one but I assume (dangerous, I know) that it could be upgraded with standard AR15 parts as the owner desires, if it's not a S&W proprietary platform.

 

[DocB]

I'd go with the Colt SOCOM, flat top, M4, full military specs. . .just like the one my son used every time he was deployed. The platform originally belonged to Armalite and was quickly dominated by Colt. Everybody wants to copy everyone else and make money. Go with the original. Go with the standard.

 

[cyphertext]

Why not?

You can typically get more features for your money on a Smith than you can on some other models. For example, you can get a basic Colt LE6920, or a M&P 15T for about the same price. The Colt will feature different barrel composition and all "mil-spec" parts, where the Smith would give you a free floated barrel and a quad rail hand guard.

 

[amazingflapjack]

I would only consider those with gas cylinder operating systems-there are a few good ones.

 

[Jdavis]

There are a ton of AR-15 manufacturers to choose from. They all pretty much are faithful to the Stoner design. There are variations in the methods of manufacture and materials used. You can get a basic AR for less than $400 or a top of the line model from Daniel Defense, POF, Jesse James and others for several thousand dollars. S&W offers models from a basic no frills to a top end model. Although, I do not own a S&W AR-15, I would very happy with any number of their offerings.

 

[cyphertext]

I would probably choose other manufacturers over S&W when going to an AR15.

Armalite, Bushmaster, Colt, DPMS, Rock River Arms . . .

Why? What do those makes give you that Smith does not?

The S&W M&P Sport is definitely a well priced rifle, though. I've never fired one but I assume (dangerous, I know) that it could be upgraded with standard AR15 parts as the owner desires, if it's not a S&W proprietary platform.

It is not a proprietary platform, neither are any of the S&W AR-15 rifles. They are equipped with "standard" parts. The barrel is made of a different grade of steel, and the BCG is a semi auto type, but everything is mil-spec dimensions and can be changed out for any other after market AR 15 part.

 

[cyphertext]

I'd go with the Colt SOCOM, flat top, M4, full military specs. . .just like the one my son used every time he was deployed. The platform originally belonged to Armalite and was quickly dominated by Colt. Everybody wants to copy everyone else and make money. Go with the original. Go with the standard.

Go with the original? You mean the slick sided Armalite? Anything else is just a copy...

You do know that Colt no longer is the sole source for the military, right? FN is now a supplier as well.

The AR design has been around since the 1950's... it is hard to find one today that is not built well and reliable.

 

[Arik]

Go with the original? You mean the slick sided Armalite? Anything else is just a copy...

You do know that Colt no longer is the sole source for the military, right? FN is now a supplier as well.

The AR design has been around since the 1950's... it is hard to find one today that is not built well and reliable.

FN has always been a supplier. It's only know becoming main stream knowledge. They've been making the M249, M249, M2 Browning, the M16 since 1991 and the since 2013...... for the US military for a long time

It's actually easy to find one that's not built well. Because aside from a few manufacturers who list their raw materials almost no one else does. You have no way of knowing what type of material was used to make the extractor, for instance, or where it was sourced from if it's a part not made in house. Like knives, there is a reason some are $20 and some are $200.

 

[shell627]

Whatever you get.Make sure it has a 556 chamber and not 223.It will be more reliable with a better variety of ammo.

 

[Magload]

Why? because it's a S&W. Their CS is great. I looked at high end ARs and would have loved one but the M&P fit the budget. You can always upgrade them later. Besides it will feel at home with all my M&P handguns. Don

 

[cyphertext]

FN has always been a supplier. It's only know becoming main stream knowledge. They've been making the M249, M249, M2 Browning, the M16 since 1991 and the since 2013...... for the US military for a long time

I was speaking of the M4... Colt, up until recently, has had sole supplier status.

It's actually easy to find one that's not built well. Because aside from a few manufacturers who list their raw materials almost no one else does. You have no way of knowing what type of material was used to make the extractor, for instance, or where it was sourced from if it's a part not made in house. Like knives, there is a reason some are $20 and some are $200.

I disagree with you here... If you go with the major brand firearms, you are very unlikely to get an unreliable *** AR-15. You can spout mil-spec, raw materials, blah blah blah... but that spec is for a select fire weapon made for military use. A semi auto firearm made for the civilian market does not require the same specifications. For example, barrel steel... You won't tell one bit of difference between 4140 and 4150 in a semi auto rifle, especially ones that have been chrome lined or treated with Melonite. If they are the same price, then sure, get the 4150, but if the price of the barrel costs 30% more for the 4150, you won't see 30% increase in barrel life.

Take a look at the Sport for instance. When it came out, mil-spec monkeys bashed it. But over time, it has shown that it is a reliable, well made rifle and is a great value.

 

[noscivic]

Or here is an idea, build your own. you can buy the barrel in the twist and length you want. You don't have to worry about changing the furniture to what you really want other than what came on the gun. It will end up being cheaper in the long run. I just built my wife a good AR-15 for less than $800. just my .02 worth.

Gary

 

[Shootingfun]

I would also agree with building your own if you have the knowledge to do so. The one advantage over purchasing a AR 15 from like S&W is the Customer Service and they do stand behind there products. I have a M&P 15 sport rifle that I had for just a bit over a year and it started to Key hole really bad, I shipped it back they paid for everything and replaced the barrel in the rifle and had it back to me in like just over a week.
Now with building your own if the barrel goes out you are either screwed or have to mess with taking off the barrel and sending it back to the manufacture you purchased it from and if they will not argue the fact was it installed correctly.
I would again buy my M&P Sport rifle, but if I had some more cash I would purchase a complete upper from BCM and pare it with a PSA lower and have a really nice rifle with a bit higher quality barrel.

The main issue with S&W rifles in the AR platform is there barrels, Not chromed lined. Not hammer forged and really if you ask they won't tell you what they really are. For the cost of the sport and some of there other AR platforms you do get a solid platform to upgrade in the future. S&W AR 15 rifles are a great choice, I have seen and shot with higher dollar AR 15's and my Sport has stood toe to toe to them and with my barrel issue, I have only heard of this happening 2 times me and other guy online, I read that people have 10,000+ rounds through them and they keep on running.
Now if you want a rifle that will be completely dependable, then that's the AK 47 platform.

Here is some pics of my AR and AKM

 

[jkasch]

The main issue with S&W rifles in the AR platform is there barrels, Not chromed lined. Not hammer forged and really if you ask they won't tell you what they really are.

I've been told by some very knowledgeable shooters that barrels are one of Smith's strengths. There's some debate whether chrome or nitride is more durable, but it's fairly well accepted that nitrided is more accurate, if all else is equal.

The barrels of the VTACII, TS, and Mid Moe, while not CHF, are 5R, 8:1, 4150CMV. I've never read anything but positive reviews of them. Again, there is a lot of debate on arfcom about how much difference CHF makes.

Anyway, sorry you got a bad one, but like you said, S&W took care of you.

 

[cyphertext]

The main issue with S&W rifles in the AR platform is there barrels, Not chromed lined. Not hammer forged and really if you ask they won't tell you what they really are.

This is a false statement... The spec sheets on the web site outline what the barrel is made of, what the twist rate is, and if it is chrome lined or if it is Melonited (or whatever they call it now). The Sport seems to be the only one that does not state clearly if it is Melonited or not, but S&W support has answered that question numerous times.

 

[cyphertext]

The barrels of the VTACII, TS, and Mid Moe, while not CHF, are 5R, 8:1, 4150CMV. I've never read anything but positive reviews of them. Again, there is a lot of debate on arfcom about how much difference CHF makes.

There is also a lot of debate on whether or not 4150 provides any tangible benefit over 4140 for a semi auto rifle... Most folks with a semi auto are not going to notice that little bit of extra carbon in the 4150.

 

[Badquaker]

Building your own may save you money in the long run, because your not replacing existing parts. Keep in mind that above average parts get costly.

barrels 250 - 500+
bcg - 200+
triggers - 200+
FF handguards - 200+

If you like to tinker, just bite the bullet and save some time.

 

[GTBL]

Get a Colt. If you don't, you will always ask yourself, What If I got the Colt instead? Get the Colt and you wont have to deal with the questions roaming around in your head.

 

[MrG5122]

I got a Colt. Put 500 rounds through it. Compared the accuracy, fit, finish, and reliability with the other brands I own. Traded it for what I gave for it. Luckily for me one of the upsides to a Colt is there is always someone out there who'll pay top dollar for one.