IMR Powders

[Magload]

Hodgdon reloading date site list 8 IMR powders for 223 Rem for 55gr bullets. I really wanted to load CFE 223 for my first loads but would have to order it online and for testing loads i think I should just buy different powders in one pound lots at first. I do think I would be ok with 8 pounds of CFE 223 but my gun range/ club carries a bunch of IMR in one pound lots for a good price. What should I try first. I read up on what each was for and it looks like for the bench rest shooting I want to do IMR 8208XBR would be right. I am not sure they have it. Any ideas would help. Don

 

[MichiganScott]

I'm currently doing some load work in various calibers with CFE223. I've found it to give superior velocity with exceptional accuracy in mid-weight .223 loads. It works so well in .223 that I bought 8lbs of it before I completed working with other calibers.

 

[rwsmith]

What bullet...

What bullet are you shooting? Any other aspects of the type of shooting you are doing that could make a difference?

 

[Damn Yankee]

I've had good luck with 4320. One thing you can't put to much in the case.

 

[Rule3]

Many many powders for the 223/5.56 Does it have to be IMR what about Hodgdon? Accurate etc.

Better yet what powders are available to you locally??

No sense listing ones they do not have,

It's amazing how many rounds were loaded before the magic CFE came around,

 

[fredj338]

I like many of the IMR powders, but they are best hand weighed they don't meter well. If you want a lot of ammo for an AR, then stick with the CFE223 or other ball powder. Accurate charges can easily be thrown with a measure.

 

[cmj8591]

If you are loading for a run of the mill ar15, then you will not notice much difference from one powder to the next. If the load comes from a reliable manual then it should give acceptable results. In that case, go with what is readily available and cheapest. If you are loading for a high end target gun or a varmint type bolt gun, then all of the components of your reloads will affect the accuracy. In that case, you will have to experiment to find out what load the gun likes best. Just because some article says one powder is best doesn't mean it's going to be best for your gun.

 

[BigG]

IMR 4198 has been a good powder for use in my Colt AR-15s.

 

[Badquaker]

odd ball here..... win 748 has been very good for me.

 

[Geo. T.]

Well!

In the late 60's I started loading for center fire rifles and used mostly IMR Dupont back then. These days I don't use very many of them at all. H-4895 works well and there are many that are very close in burn rate yet meter very well.

I load a lot of 5.56 every year I would say 3 to 5 thousand a year. I like Ramshot X-Terminator and LT-32 very well. I have had very good luck with H335 , BLC-2 ,Winchester 748 but I have never tried the CFF 223. For a while what you could find pretty well determined what you were going to load with.

I bought 40 pounds on lT-32 so I'll be alright for a while.

 

[scooter123]

I've had mixed results with CFE223 and in one example is downright mystifying, actually worthy of the legendary Sherlock Holmes.

First is the Mystery result. The bullet in this case is the 68 grain Hornady BTHP Match bullet. Powder is CFE223. Rifle is a Match Grade AR15 with a Shilen Match Barrel.

So, load the case with 23.7 grains of CFE223 and 3 shot cloverleafs spanning less than 0.3 inch at 100 yards are achievable when I'm shooting really really well. On a more average day using bunny ears to support the stock 5 shot groups spanning 1/2 inch are routine.

Now load the case with 25.4 grains of CFE223 and the group sizes just EXPLODE. Meaning the rifle goes from shooting 1/2 inch groups at 100 yards to shooting 10 inch PLUS groups at the same distance. Note, I have to say PLUS because the target is 10 x 12 inches. Based on the vertical spread the groups expand to something around 10 3/4 inch. Never in my life have I ever seen accuracy degrade this much as a result of simply increasing the powder charge to a point within the recommended range. If there is a Sherlock out there who can explain this I would love to hear it.

My second result is just plain disappointing. Bullet is a 60 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip Varmint bullet. With a load ANYWHERE in the load range for CFE223 as listed in Nosler's data I have not been able to get one single point where my rifle groups under 2 inches at 100 yards. Load this same bullet with a 23.8 grain charge of Varget and 3 shots groups at 3/8 inch are achievable on a good day and on average days 5 shot groups span between 1/2 and 5/8 inch. To put it simply CFE223 just doesn't produce an accurate load with this bullet in my rifle. Bit of a bummer because Varget requires hand tweaking every single charge due to it's poor metering but I've flat out given up on using CFE223 with this bullet.

The point of all this is that I would recommend you NOT go All In with any powder until you have actually done some testing with any powder you are considering. BTW, as much as a PITA it is to hand weigh every charge when loading with Varget I have yet to have any load produce accuracy I would rate as poor to moderate. Not sure why but I've found Varget to be a powder that just seems to make for really accurate ammunition.

 

[Magload]

What bullet are you shooting? Any other aspects of the type of shooting you are doing that could make a difference?

I will be using 55gr or something in that range and all shooting will be benchrest 100 and 200yds except for the times I shoot indoors at 20yds. I have not decided on bullet type yet but I am wanting, well hoping for 1/2 MOA groups. I do not fire a lot of rounds when I go to the range so the extra cost of match grade bullets might not break the bank. It is all going to be a learning experience testing loads over my chrono and checking group size. Just got a Lead Sled the dual beam one to help with the group testing. This barrel is a 1 to 8 so need to find what weight bullet it really likes best. Don

 

[Magload]

Many many powders for the 223/5.56 Does it have to be IMR what about Hodgdon? Accurate etc.

Better yet what powders are available to you locally??

No sense listing ones they do not have,

It's amazing how many rounds were loaded before the magic CFE came around,

I have never used IMR but it is what the range/club sells. The LGS is the one that gets $40 a pound for all powders and I won't buy from them is I don't have to. I could go with 4 pounds online if I also buy a bunch of primers to make up for the Hazmat fee. I prefer 1 pound jugs till I decide what I am going to stick to. Probably CFE 223 as i really like the CFE Pistol I am using. Don

 

[Magload]

I've had mixed results with CFE223 and in one example is downright mystifying, actually worthy of the legendary Sherlock Holmes.

First is the Mystery result. The bullet in this case is the 68 grain Hornady BTHP Match bullet. Powder is CFE223. Rifle is a Match Grade AR15 with a Shilen Match Barrel.

So, load the case with 23.7 grains of CFE223 and 3 shot cloverleafs spanning less than 0.3 inch at 100 yards are achievable when I'm shooting really really well. On a more average day using bunny ears to support the stock 5 shot groups spanning 1/2 inch are routine.

Now load the case with 25.4 grains of CFE223 and the group sizes just EXPLODE. Meaning the rifle goes from shooting 1/2 inch groups at 100 yards to shooting 10 inch PLUS groups at the same distance. Note, I have to say PLUS because the target is 10 x 12 inches. Based on the vertical spread the groups expand to something around 10 3/4 inch. Never in my life have I ever seen accuracy degrade this much as a result of simply increasing the powder charge to a point within the recommended range. If there is a Sherlock out there who can explain this I would love to hear it.

My second result is just plain disappointing. Bullet is a 60 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip Varmint bullet. With a load ANYWHERE in the load range for CFE223 as listed in Nosler's data I have not been able to get one single point where my rifle groups under 2 inches at 100 yards. Load this same bullet with a 23.8 grain charge of Varget and 3 shots groups at 3/8 inch are achievable on a good day and on average days 5 shot groups span between 1/2 and 5/8 inch. To put it simply CFE223 just doesn't produce an accurate load with this bullet in my rifle. Bit of a bummer because Varget requires hand tweaking every single charge due to it's poor metering but I've flat out given up on using CFE223 with this bullet.

The point of all this is that I would recommend you NOT go All In with any powder until you have actually done some testing with any powder you are considering. BTW, as much as a PITA it is to hand weigh every charge when loading with Varget I have yet to have any load produce accuracy I would rate as poor to moderate. Not sure why but I've found Varget to be a powder that just seems to make for really accurate ammunition.

I want to try Varget if I can find some.
with the testing of CFE Pistol I did a few months back I found it to be position sensitive and I got way better groups and chrono results if I pointed the gun up before each shot. Not something I want to do shooting from the Lead Sled. At least rifle loads fill the case better then 38/357 so it may not be a problem. Don

 

[Rule3]

I have never used IMR but it is what the range/club sells. The LGS is the one that gets $40 a pound for all powders and I won't buy from them is I don't have to. I could go with 4 pounds online if I also buy a bunch of primers to make up for the Hazmat fee. I prefer 1 pound jugs till I decide what I am going to stick to. Probably CFE 223 as i really like the CFE Pistol I am using. Don

But what IMR powders do they have ???

8208 good
4064 "
4320 "

CFE is a Hodgdon name

 

[Magload]

But what IMR powders do they have ???

8208 good
4064 "
4320 "

CFE is a Hodgdon name

I will have to check it out next time I am there. Looked like they had a large selection of IMR rifle powder and black powder and as usual around here no pistol powder.

Yes so far I have only used Hodgdon. Titegroup and CFE Pistol. Don

 

[MichiganScott]

I have not decided on bullet type yet but I am wanting, well hoping for 1/2 MOA groups. I do not fire a lot of rounds when I go to the range so the extra cost of match grade bullets might not break the bank.

If you want tiny groups, lose the thought about using anything but top end match bullets. I've been buying 52gr Sierra HPBT MK bulk for years now and have no plans on using cheap bullets again. If I miss my target I have nothing to blame it on other than poor shooting.

 

[Magload]

If you want tiny groups, lose the thought about using anything but top end match bullets. I've been buying 52gr Sierra HPBT MK bulk for years now and have no plans on using cheap bullets again. If I miss my target I have nothing to blame it on other than poor shooting.

Thanks Scott I will be ordering some of those. Don

 

[Rule3]

As others have mentioned, the actual rifle , twist and type and weight of bullet will make more of a difference on accuracy than the powder.

It is all a combination. You can have the best powder in the world, but a poor bullet or wrong weight for the twist of your rifle, than it will not matter.

Bolt action, semi auto AR type etc.

I may have posted this in one of your threads or maybe another' s?? Can't recall.??

Lots of good info.

223 Rem + 223 AI Cartridge Guide

 

[fredj338]

As others have mentioned, the actual rifle , twist and type and weight of bullet will make more of a difference on accuracy than the powder.

It is all a combination. You can have the best powder in the world, but a poor bullet or wrong weight for the twist of your rifle, than it will not matter.

Bolt action, semi auto AR type etc.

Amen. Accuracy starts with a good bullet, assuming tithe rifle & shooter are up to it. You'll never make a poor bullet shoot well.