My brand new 686 plus. Only the new Marlins offer the same level of disappointment.

[SLT223]

Forget how it looks for a minute. How does it shoot? Is this actually a performance problem or just cosmetic?

 

[fkienast]

I have a Marlin 336 purchased from Wal-Mart last year. The thing is a drill, accurate. No flaws.
Have you shot the gun yet? Many people have asked, but you haven't replied.

 

[two-bit cowboy]

Thanks to the OP for this and the earlier 629 posts.

Even more... I felt the over-spray from those who tossed cold glasses of water on the posts. Thank you colt_saa, Tom S., and others.

My 640 Pro had two cosmetic challenges (in my mind) so back to Springfield it went. The customer service supervisor told me they (whorls inside the extractor rod housing and a bad nick in the frame below the barrel's protrusion) were within today's specs and weren't visible when the cylinder was locked in place. True, but in 40 years of owning Smiths I'd never seen blemishes like these. The CS guy assured me if the frame ever fails due to the nick the lifetime warranty will take care of that.

I bought the revolver online to be my ccw. If this can be said of a J-frame, "it's a tack driver" at seven yards. That's what I wanted.

Thanks again to those who've focused on bottom line. You've gotten me over the angst.

Cheers,

Bob

ps: a Dremel with a 1" diameter felt polishing disk running at about 50% rpms and Mother's has gone a long way to eliminate the whorls. I'll keep working at it each time I clean it.

 

[triaxle]

I would clean the barrel and shoot that gun. It may be a tac driver.

 

[clang444]

Did you have a 3 day inspection period from the person you bought this gun online?

 

[Invisible Hand]

Shoot it then decide on the crown.
FWIW I have new Marlin bought even after reading all the horror internet stories. It is a 1895 GBL 45/70. Works flawlessly and shoots great. The checkering leaves a little to be desired but I did not expect great checkering. The days of great attention to detail in production guns at affordable prices are over. Another casualty of todays situation.

My shooting skills (or lack there of) are not a good way to determine a barrels crown. LOL

 

[Invisible Hand]

Unless this is a display piece, I would be much more concerned about how the revolver shoots than how pretty the crown is. A prettier crown will not necessarily make the gun more accurate.

Do you still own the cosmetically challenged Smith and Wesson 629 that you bought in 2013?

http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-re...d-new-629-fit-finish-seems-poor-thoughts.html

What is the rest of the story on that 629?

The 629 is one of my favorite guns. It's crown is flawless.

 

[ltj9296]

I can only speak for myself, but if it shoots better than I can hold it, then I would not worry about it.

 

[Invisible Hand]

The angles at which you photographed the barrel leave it hard to judge whether the crown is off or whether we are seeing differences in where the rifling is. I have seen barrels that appear this way but are properly cut and only appear to be off due to the depth of the relief which causes the illusion of the crown being off cut.

The factory, a VP no less, says it's fine. Several members suggest shooting it to determine if it has any detrimental effect or not, yet you resist their suggestions. Because in your mind, you feel the crown if off, I suggest you have a friend shoot it who is a good shot. Do not tell them of your fear of it being defective as that can influence them mentally. I'm willing to bet the gun shoots very well and the crown has absolutely no effect on it's accuracy.

Between this thread on the one you made on the Model 629 I see a pattern. To address your issues, I suggest you never order a gun over the internet, and you never buy locally until you have thoroughly examined the gun first before paying.

It's definitely not the rifling groves. The left and right side of the crown are uneven. I can try to take better pictures when I get the gun back next week. I agree about buying in person, and have been ever since I picked up that 629. However, I was unable to find a 4" 686 Plus locally and gave up after a 6 month search.

I don't believe for a second that the crown has no impact on accuracy. I'll go out and shoot it when I get it back.

 

[Invisible Hand]

I recently purchased a two new 686 Plus revolvers. One is 2.5", the other is 4". Both crowns look flawless, nothing like yours.

Did you purchase it from a reputable source? You're certain it's new?

I got it from Buds. It's brand new.

 

[-db-]

I'm going to swim against the current and suggest that those with the "Yeah, but how does it shoot?" response, implying that if the gun shoots fine it's acceptable, aren't looking at the bigger picture in these cases.

That reply is akin to someone ordering a brand new car and upon arriving at the dealership to pick it up he notices the paint is full of scratches and when pointed out to the dealer, he replies, "Yeah, but it drives great, that's the important thing, so who cares?"

Now, of course no one here would accept that but some will throw that same line out at others when it comes to cosmetically-flawed guns, as if how well a gun shoots is the ONLY concern anyone should ever have.

An additional thought is let's say Invisible Hand's gun ends up shooting fine. But what about resale, something the How does it shoot? crowd never seems to consider? Any potential buyer who knows what he's doing is going to question an odd-looking crown and now the seller is burdened with trying to convince the buyer it's "no big deal, the gun shoots fine, trust me" (famous last words), an issue he wouldn't have to be dealing with had the manufacturer done better work, and possibly take a hit on what he ends up getting for the gun.

And then there's the issue that arises when one considers if they let this particular shoddiness pass, there's the wondering what else might be wrong with the gun and now you've got an owner (along with those potential future buyers mentioned earlier) full of doubt.

S&W, along with all other modern manufacturers, only get away with increasingly lower standards because the buying public allows it. It's a problem that will only get worse until enough people get fed up and use their purchasing power to put an end to the downward slide. I'll be damned if I ever purchase a brand new gun and accept the flaws we see many here share with us and I don't care how many think they're clever and ask, "Yeah, but how does it shoot?", trying to tell me I should be happy with sub-par work.

 

[PatriotX]

I haven't shot it yet, and haven't been shooting in over a year, so the likelihood of me being able to determine its accuracy is slim. I got the shipping notification today and should have it back early next week. Regardless of how accurate it is, it's sure as hell not as accurate as it would be with an even crown.

You have no way to determine accuracy without firing the gun.


I would echo the other poster above me, perhaps buying guns sight-unseen is not for you.

 

[PatriotX]

I'm going to swim against the current and suggest that those with the "Yeah, but how does it shoot?" response, implying that if the gun shoots fine it's acceptable, aren't looking at the bigger picture in these cases...

Nobody forced the OP at gunpoint to accept delivery of a substandard product. Cosmetic issues could and should have been noted before transfer, and refund issued. Bud's does this all the time.


Lamenting accuracy without actually firing the gun is a bit silly as well.

 

[-db-]

Nobody forced the OP at gunpoint to accept delivery of a substandard product. Cosmetic issues could and should have been noted before transfer, and refund issued. Bud's does this all the time.

True, but that's beside the point and negates nothing I've said.

Lamenting accuracy without actually firing the gun is a bit silly as well.

The OP says he doesn't shoot well enough to know if accuracy would be affected, so that's basically beside the point, also:

My shooting is not up to par with determining the accuracy of a gun.

 

[Invisible Hand]

I'm going to swim against the current and suggest that those with the "Yeah, but how does it shoot?" response, implying that if the gun shoots fine it's acceptable, aren't looking at the bigger picture in these cases.

That reply is akin to someone ordering a brand new car and upon arriving at the dealership to pick it up he notices the paint is full of scratches and when pointed out to the dealer, he replies, "Yeah, but it drives great, that's the important thing, so who cares?"

Now, of course no one here would accept that but some will throw that same line out at others when it comes to cosmetically-flawed guns, as if how well a gun shoots is the ONLY concern anyone should ever have.

An additional thought is let's say Invisible Hand's gun ends up shooting fine. But what about resale, something the How does it shoot? crowd never seems to consider? Any potential buyer who knows what he's doing is going to question an odd-looking crown and now the seller is burdened with trying to convince the buyer it's "no big deal, the gun shoots fine, trust me" (famous last words), an isue he wouldn't have to be dealing with had the manufacturer done better work, and possibly take a hit on what he ends up getting for the gun.

S&W, along with all other modern manufacturers, only get away with increasingly lower standards because the buying public allows it. It's a problem that will only get worse until enough people get fed up and use their purchasing power to put an end to the downward slide. I'll be damned if I ever purchase a brand new gun and accept the flaws we see many here share with us and I don't care how many think they're clever and ask, "Yeah, but how does it shoot?"

My thoughts exactly. I really appreciate your input.

 

[Invisible Hand]

Nobody forced the OP at gunpoint to accept delivery of a substandard product. Cosmetic issues could and should have been noted before transfer, and refund issued. Bud's does this all the time.


Lamenting accuracy without actually firing the gun is a bit silly as well.

You're right about accepting delivery. I noticed the poor trigger immediately but figured S&W would take care of it, so proceeded. I did not check the crown. That is on me.

However, the point remains that S&W is putting out a substandard product with no regard to quality control.

 

[PatriotX]

The OP says he doesn't shoot well enough to know if accuracy would be affected, so that's basically beside the point, also:

If there's no metric to determine accuracy, how can accuracy be a point of contention?


If a car is advertised to have 300 horses, one can't complain about being shorted without measuring performance or dyno numbers.


OP not proficient with gun? A Ransom Rest or similar should do the trick.

 

[-db-]

The real lesson here for you, Invisible Hand, is to fully inspect any future guns before you commit to the full purchase, as PatriotX stated. That's how we vote with our purchasing power. Refuse to accept anything less than what you expect a new gun to be.

 

[colt_saa]

I'm going to swim against the current and suggest that those with the "Yeah, but how does it shoot?" response, implying that if the gun shoots fine it's acceptable, aren't looking at the bigger picture in these cases.

That reply is akin to someone ordering a brand new car and upon arriving at the dealership to pick it up he notices the paint is full of scratches and when pointed out to the dealer, he replies, "Yeah, but it drives great, that's the important thing, so who cares?"

Now, of course no one here would accept that but some will throw that same line out at others when it comes to cosmetically-flawed guns, as if how well a gun shoots is the ONLY concern anyone should ever have.

An additional thought is let's say Invisible Hand's gun ends up shooting fine. But what about resale, something the How does it shoot? crowd never seems to consider? Any potential buyer who knows what he's doing is going to question an odd-looking crown and now the seller is burdened with trying to convince the buyer it's "no big deal, the gun shoots fine, trust me" (famous last words), an issue he wouldn't have to be dealing with had the manufacturer done better work, and possibly take a hit on what he ends up getting for the gun.

S&W, along with all other modern manufacturers, only get away with increasingly lower standards because the buying public allows it. It's a problem that will only get worse until enough people get fed up and use their purchasing power to put an end to the downward slide. I'll be damned if I ever purchase a brand new gun and accept the flaws we see many here share with us and I don't care how many think they're clever and ask, "Yeah, but how does it shoot?", trying to tell me I should be happy with sub-par work.

I totally disagree. It is nothing like buying a car

It is much more like buying a lawn mower or a chain saw or any mechanic's tool, taking it home and then complaining about the scratch in the paint.

 

[-db-]

If there's no metric to determine accuracy, how can accuracy be a point of contention?

I'm not arguing that accuracy is a point of contention. As I stated earlier, the gun may shoot perfectly well but it's still flawed cosmetically, which carries its own set of problems. That's what my argument is.