No carry work?

TX-Dennis said:
One department manager regularly carried in her purse. She made a mistake and showed it to the wrong person who outed her. She was immediately terminated and arrested. Although she had claimed to have a license to carry she did not, thus the arrest.
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I say this a lot but if you choose to carry against company policy Absolutely No One that you work with can know about it because sooner or later (even just by accident) they'll out you.

They people I work with are nice enough but they're not people I chose to be part of my circle. I don't tell them my personal business. I don't even mention that I own guns and if the topic comes up I ignore it.
 
When our agency was wrestling with the idea of assigning officers to the schools I was sent to a meeting w/the school board. In typical naive fashion they wanted a cop in every school, but w/o their gun. I told them that was a deal breaker, I would NOT assign any officer anywhere absent ALL of their equipment. Fortunately the police chief backed me. It still amazes me how out of touch w/reality some people are.
 
You have to judge the nature and immediacy of the threat.

During the first Gulf War, I was the Facility Security Officer (clearance processing, document custodian, access control, security training, etc.) of a classified NASA contractor in Cleveland.

Shortly after the war started I was in the men's room around the corner from my office. Somebody came in and announced that everybody needed to leave the basement immediately.

Since the lab across the hall was building satellite hardware and dealt with hazardous materials, I figured there was a hazmat spill.

Arriving in the lobby, I encountered the entire company. Jokingly, I asked somebody I knew if it was a bomb threat. He answered, "Yes."

It turned out that my boss [for security] had been aware of a SERIES of bomb threats, of which he had neglected to notify me.

Having previously rejected my strong suggestion that the automatic unlocking of the employee door be suspended for the duration, my [idiot, Klansman] boss ordered everyone into the lobby... and ordered them to stay there. Having at least two braincells to rub together, I immediately perceived the target rich environment which this twit had created.

Later, I discovered that the fiasco had been precipitated by a bomb threat call to an engineer in the basement. The bomb was allegedly in his desk. The recipient immediately reported the threat, whereupon David Duke told him to LOOK IN HIS DESK FOR THE BOMB. The engineer told Duke where to go and announced that he was leaving for home forthwith.

The next day, I started carrying a briefcase to work. It contained a Series 70 Colt, several spare magazines and a ballistic vest. At the same time, I explained the situation to my boss for IT and told him that if anything happened, to come to my office in the basement... which sat behind a vault door.

At the time, not only were firearms banned in the facility, Ohio didn't have citizen concealed carry.

I decided that, faced with a tangible threat compounded by gross incompetence of management, my life (and those of others) was more important than either company policy or the Ohio Revised Code.

Nobody else can make such a decision for you.

PS - The employee door continued to unlock automatically for the entire duration of the War.
PPS - David Duke ordered me to cease cooperation with the FBI on an investigation of an employee who was an organizer for the Iraqi Baath Party.
 
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Do you carry religiously? You may not be as safe as you believe. - www.GrantCunningham.com www.GrantCunningham.com
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Excellent commentary! All true. Nothing is worse than complacency.

=================================

It is very difficult for me to give advice to anyone about what to do with respect to a company policy forbidding firearms. I wrote my present company policy so you can guess that I have a firearm with me every day, as do two others. Other places that I worked either had no specific policy or none that I was aware of and I carried every day.

One place I worked had a specific ban and I carried anyway. My call, my choice, my risk. I could never advise anyone else to do that.

If you work where there are metal detectors then, again, you don't even have a choice.

It's like on those rare instances when I have to go to the local courthouse. I leave my gun in my car. Metal detectors = no choice.

Then, there is one place, maybe two, that I am aware of that search everyone who comes through the door and there are metal detectors. But if you flash your carry license there is a separate door, no metal detector, just cut around the line and meander in. I like that one. :)
 
WHAT DO YOU VALUE MORE?

How much value is your job vs your life. I didn't CC in a hospital, because I could have lost my license to practice along with the job. Too many chances for an accidental exposure, or a Pt grabbing me, or just a hug, or a brush up against someone. Doing house calls in bad neighborhoods, or in an office type setting YOU BET. There will always be a chance of discovery. Like the old saying: if you can't afford to lose it, don't place the bet. YOUR DECISION, good luck with it.
 
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nachogrande said:
How much value is your job vs your life.
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How valuable is carrying a gun vs risking losing your job might be a better way of wording it. I imagine getting caught carrying a handgun in a school would probably carry a pretty heavy penalty and it would likely prove difficult to get another job in a school if fired for such an offense. The old "I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6" line is short sighted. I don't want either one. Getting killed obviously sucks, but so does spending any substantial time behind bars.
 
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Mister X said:
The old "I'd rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6" line is short sighted. I don't want either one. Getting killed obviously sucks, but so does spending any substantial time behind bars.
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It depends upon the credibility and the immediacy of the threat.

Would you rather be killed than arrested?

I've seen many people get out of jail, many of whom deserved to be there for the rest of their lives.

I've only seen Christopher Lee get out of his grave, and that was make believe.

When there's a quantifiable threat and those whose duty it is to mitigate that threat are only facilitating that threat, I'm not going to die for somebody else's degenerate "values".
 
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So like I said unless you're paying me to carry a gun at work or you specifically give me a written authorization to carry a gun at work I'm not carrying a gun at work but my car is my car and unless you're paying me to use it for company business what's in it is none of your business
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Here in Florida, an employer has to let you leave your gun in your car in the employee parking lot - there are a few exceptions, such as power plants (they fall under HS)

As others have stated, either find a new job, or find a new job in another state or become your own boss in your own business.
 
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cmort666 said:
It depends upon the credibility and the immediacy of the threat.

Would you rather be killed than arrested?

I've seen many people get out of jail, many of whom deserved to be there for the rest of their lives.

I've only seen Christopher Lee get out of his grave, and that was make believe.

When there's a quantifiable threat and those whose duty it is to mitigate that threat are only facilitating that threat, I'm not going to die for somebody else's degenerate "values".
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If you are fairly certain there is going to be armed violence or a good chance of it at a particular place, don't go there. If the OP's school is that dangerous for some reason, I would recommend looking for another job.
 
Or become a kung fu expert.
Looked for: cannot be seen.
Listened for: cannot be heard.
Touched: cannot be felt.
Young grasshopper Kane never needed a gun, job, food, water or house to dwell in.
And he always walked into bad places.
 
Mister X said:
If you are fairly certain there is going to be armed violence or a good chance of it at a particular place, don't go there. If the OP's school is that dangerous for some reason, I would recommend looking for another job.
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In my case:
  1. There was a known, NAMED threat.
  2. There was a pattern of threats.
  3. Management was FACILITATING the danger.
  4. There was ZERO expectation of being "protected" by authorities.
  5. I like eating food and living indoors. You can't do that without a paycheck.

As far as "get another job" goes, fast forward to 2009 and the recession. Between the day I was laid off and a week after my unemployment benefits ran out, and I got the worst job I've EVER had, I received exactly ONE employment offer, a scam commission sales job selling financial instruments. Jobs are sometimes in short supply. Since 2009, they've been in VERY short supply.

Telling people, "You can get shot or you can be homeless" doesn't buy you much credibility.

It's one thing to tell somebody not to go to a bar known for criminal activity and violence. It's quite another to tell somebody to QUIT a job, disqualify oneself for unemployment, and be homeless.

The first law is survival. The ORC comes a distant second.
 
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cmort666 said:
In my case:
  1. There was a known, NAMED threat.
  2. There was a pattern of threats.
  3. Management was FACILITATING the danger.
  4. There was ZERO expectation of being "protected" by authorities.
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  1. My comments were directed to OP and his particular situation. From my understanding, he works in a school(maybe a teacher?) and did not make any mention that he was under increased risk. If he is teacher working in high risk environment for some odd reason, it shouldn't too hard to find a better job.

    In your case, those are some very vague statements so I have absolutely no clue. Was somebody threatening to beat you up at work or something? Maybe go into greater detail about what was going on.
 
cmort666 said:
In my case:
  1. There was a known, NAMED threat.
  2. There was a pattern of threats.
  3. Management was FACILITATING the danger.
  4. There was ZERO expectation of being "protected" by authorities.
  5. I like eating food and living indoors. You can't do that without a paycheck.

As far as "get another job" goes, fast forward to 2009 and the recession. Between the day I was laid off and a week after my unemployment benefits ran out, and I got the worst job I've EVER had, I received exactly ONE employment offer, a scam commission sales job selling financial instruments. Jobs are sometimes in short supply. Since 2009, they've been in VERY short supply.

Telling people, "You can get shot or you can be homeless" doesn't buy you much credibility.

It's one thing to tell somebody not to go to a bar known for criminal activity and violence. It's quite another to tell somebody to QUIT a job, disqualify oneself for unemployment, and be homeless.

The first law is survival. The ORC comes a distant second.
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Sounds like you need to find a job in another place/state and get out of there then. Advocating breaking the law usually isn't tolerated .. ;)
 
Mister X said:
My comments were directed to OP and his particular situation. From my understanding, he works in a school(maybe a teacher?) and did not make any mention that he was under increased risk. If he is teacher working in high risk environment for some odd reason, it shouldn't too hard to find a better job.

In your case, those are some very vague statements so I have absolutely no clue. Was somebody threatening to beat you up at work or something? Maybe go into greater detail about what was going on.
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Somebody (probably an Iraqi agent) was threatening to KILL... EVERYONE.

And management was doing everything possible to facilitate that.

I have no duty to die or be homeless.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
 
Mister X said:
There are many ways to look at this issue. Some people frequently and loudly proclaim they won't go anyplace they are not allowed to carry. I honestly find such rigid thinking rather ridiculous and negatively impacting your quality of life unnecessarily.

I wouldn't want to be a law enforcement officer without having a firearm, but working in a school is an entirely different matter. There is an old saying that shouldn't go anywhere or do anything armed that you wouldn't unarmed and it's pretty sound advice. If there is a school in the United States where shootings are actually a relatively frequent occurence, I would highly recommend not working there, but that isn't the case AFAIK anywhere and the odds of being involved in a school shooting are absolutely astronomically low.

Sure, you never know and why some insist on being armed 24/7 including while in the shower, but I think their insistence to constantly be armed probably has more to do with things like politics, hobby and their psyche than it does any realistic practical need for self-protection. If these same people are so vigilante and supposedly concerned with their personal safety, then why do they drive a car. The odds of being involved in a civilian defense shooting are miniscule compared with your chances of being in a fatal car accident, but yet they all still choose to drive.

Do as you wish, but sometimes you just have to live your life and not let irrational fears and thinking rule it.

Do you carry religiously? You may not be as safe as you believe. - [url]www.GrantCunningham.com www.GrantCunningham.com[/url]
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That Grant Cunningham article deserves it's own thread. It really changed how I think about how I carry and how I view personal security. EXCELLENT
 
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