kleiss1
Member
Have you ever owned a S&W revolver before?
What does "RE" in a circle on the grip frame and other questions
- Thread starter oldblue
- Start date
pd1964
Member
Could it be an "RB"? I bought a 27-2 with that mark and it signified a blue refinish at the factory. I lettered the gun and it was sent back just a few months after it left to be reblued, no idea why. The guy I got it from didn't know either.
Here's what that stamp looked like:
The R-N or R-B in the rectangle are when they were factory re blued or re nickeled. The RE in a circle I have on the frame of my 29-2. Not sure what that means either.
Who-me or the op?
Most likely an assembler's stamp.
There is no "apparently" here, the box IS NOT original to the gun. If you look closely under the "N" there at one time was an "S" which would make sense. The box actually dates earlier than the gun which was most likely made in the late 60's or early 70's. Since the box is pre Bangor Punta (who purchased S&W from the family in 1965) the box is pre 1965 which also makes sense for an "S" serial number.
Your Gun Broker non boxed examples show that the guns alone have sold in the $1700 range so your $1600 is not out of line.
A boxed gun should typically add a couple of hundred to the package but many folks nowadays don't seem to care about the old cardboard and don't appreciate the "holy grail" of gun collecting which is finding an original complete package as it shipped from the factory. Today you can buy fake end labels and photocopied parts lists and many so called collectors are happy to put together packages. It is just not the same as finding the complete package in original condition but many collectors today just are not purists and don't seem to care. There are even reproduced screwdrivers or SAT's that one can add to the package.
I would advise the seller that he sold the gun as coming with an original box (which it is) but just not original to this gun. See if he is willing to knock off $100 since the package was misrepresented and perhaps you can get the gun for $1,500. If he says no then you have to decide if the gun alone is worth it.
Your Gun Broker non boxed examples show that the guns alone have sold in the $1700 range so your $1600 is not out of line.
A boxed gun should typically add a couple of hundred to the package but many folks nowadays don't seem to care about the old cardboard and don't appreciate the "holy grail" of gun collecting which is finding an original complete package as it shipped from the factory. Today you can buy fake end labels and photocopied parts lists and many so called collectors are happy to put together packages. It is just not the same as finding the complete package in original condition but many collectors today just are not purists and don't seem to care. There are even reproduced screwdrivers or SAT's that one can add to the package.
I would advise the seller that he sold the gun as coming with an original box (which it is) but just not original to this gun. See if he is willing to knock off $100 since the package was misrepresented and perhaps you can get the gun for $1,500. If he says no then you have to decide if the gun alone is worth it.
shouldazagged
Absent Comrade
The box would make me wonder if anything else isn't kosher, but I have a nasty, suspicious mind and a resistance to being hosed.
I've never been able to spend anywhere near that much for a gun, so bear that in mind; but I think I'm in the stop-payment-and-send-it-back camp.
I've never been able to spend anywhere near that much for a gun, so bear that in mind; but I think I'm in the stop-payment-and-send-it-back camp.
pd1964
Member
I would agree with asking for $100 back if you're happy with the gun. There's a few of those boxes on EBay so doesn't add much value if not original to the gun IMO.
Who's the seller?
kleiss1
Member
The OP. Sorry
Well that is a very well thought-out set of statements and it sounds informed by lots of experience. I think I'll just ask for a full refund and see how he reacts. Hopefully reasonably - perhaps he has a helper in the shop that is less experienced. We'll see.
As you suggest, while settling for a partial refund may make economic sense, it nevertheless may not give us the feeling that we seek when we open the safe and see that truly original set lying before us, taking us back to a time of American craftsmanship, know-how and pursuit of excellence. Guns like make good company 'round the campfire for the 1930's cast iron cookware and a Case XX 10-dot pocket knife. I'll have to give your well-considered comment some thought as I await a reply from the dealer.
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Available by clicking on the GB link in an earlier post.
Several but I'm having a hard time imagining how that's relevant or helpful. Enlighten me.
I'm in the camp of returning it.
My problem is the fraudulent labeling of the box.
Then the fraudulent add, listing the box as original to this gun.
Then the misrepresentation of the gun itself. If you found the ejector rod being eccentric, the seller also knew of it.
Yeah, I'd definitely be returning that gun, and try to inform gunbroker also.
My problem is the fraudulent labeling of the box.
Then the fraudulent add, listing the box as original to this gun.
Then the misrepresentation of the gun itself. If you found the ejector rod being eccentric, the seller also knew of it.
Yeah, I'd definitely be returning that gun, and try to inform gunbroker also.
Welcome to the Forum....hang around and we will help you spend your money...but we do need pictures, they are obligatory when questioning value of anything S & W.
My 27-2 with 3-1/2" bbl is the real deal and you won't get it from me for $1,600. Mine is 1976, s/n N 377xxx. No box, no docs, no presentation case, tools, etc.
Actually no story whatsoever on mine which is fine with me as I really don't want to hear the usual stuff about how a friend of a friend got this gun given to him after Elvis used it to demolish a TV one night, but sorry...lost the photo of the King doing the deed.
There is a seller on Fleabay (starts with a Blo...) who sells boxes and blank labels for Colts, S & W and just about anything you want. He's still in business so somebody sucks into this stuff all day long. Also as posted there are other sellers putting out repro's of manuals, parts lists, etc. but these items are 100% worthless in my opinion as a collector (well junior advancing accumulator in training).
Don't know what the circle RE stands for, maybe Reengineered and applied by the seller
Like others I'd say for sure discuss at length with the seller.
I guess decide how nice a shooter it is and negotiate accordingly. If you feel the gun alone is worth whatever (and they ARE sweet shooters, a major tad heavy for Concealed Carry)...then dicker with the dude, but trash the box...it ain't worth squat, even if someone could read the old serial number and had a matching gun...it has still been FAKED, no honest "mistake" in my opinion.
My 27-2 with 3-1/2" bbl is the real deal and you won't get it from me for $1,600. Mine is 1976, s/n N 377xxx. No box, no docs, no presentation case, tools, etc.
Actually no story whatsoever on mine which is fine with me as I really don't want to hear the usual stuff about how a friend of a friend got this gun given to him after Elvis used it to demolish a TV one night, but sorry...lost the photo of the King doing the deed.
There is a seller on Fleabay (starts with a Blo...) who sells boxes and blank labels for Colts, S & W and just about anything you want. He's still in business so somebody sucks into this stuff all day long. Also as posted there are other sellers putting out repro's of manuals, parts lists, etc. but these items are 100% worthless in my opinion as a collector (well junior advancing accumulator in training).
Don't know what the circle RE stands for, maybe Reengineered and applied by the seller
Like others I'd say for sure discuss at length with the seller.
I guess decide how nice a shooter it is and negotiate accordingly. If you feel the gun alone is worth whatever (and they ARE sweet shooters, a major tad heavy for Concealed Carry)...then dicker with the dude, but trash the box...it ain't worth squat, even if someone could read the old serial number and had a matching gun...it has still been FAKED, no honest "mistake" in my opinion.
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It's a nice looking example from the auction listing photos but maybe 95 - 97%, with muzzle wear and various spots of finish loss. The sideplate screw under the right stock panel will often have a flat head to clear the wood but a photo would help determine if is original.
Unless you have developed an emotional attachment to it (not that this has happened to any of us here
), I would be inclined to return it as well and look for a nicer example at lower cost. Good luck in your decision.
Unless you have developed an emotional attachment to it (not that this has happened to any of us here
), I would be inclined to return it as well and look for a nicer example at lower cost. Good luck in your decision.
You might also want to consider the shipping cost to send back, in my neck of the woods, around $75 or so. That's what it cost me to send a Python back to Colt several years ago!
If you can negotiate the box fakery, and save the shipping cost, you are not in bad shape.
But, if you cannot enjoy the gun as is, then it will probably be better to sent it back, if he will take it back. One thing, though, you never know how good a gun will shoot until you shoot it!
If you can negotiate the box fakery, and save the shipping cost, you are not in bad shape.
But, if you cannot enjoy the gun as is, then it will probably be better to sent it back, if he will take it back. One thing, though, you never know how good a gun will shoot until you shoot it!
+1Unless you have developed an emotional attachment to it (not that this has happened to any of us here
For comparison (which may or may not be wise), my latest purchase (last month) was for a similar model. A 3.5", 5-digit N prefix, blued, no target options, ca. 1972. Came with correctly labeled box, tools and all docs except manual. Shows to be very low round count with minimal finish wear, limited to muzzle and cylinder that appears more from box storage than holster carry wear. I reluctantly paid $1300 but obviously hadn't been shot much at all. Not to hijack but will try to post a pic later. Good luck with your decision.
ETA:
If too much hassle to return, definitely negotiate for lower price.
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SW only numbered the right grip. So, that part is correct.
I'll play the other side here regarding the box. We don't know that the seller was the one who altered the number on the box. He might have bought it that way. A high volume seller might possibly not have noticed. In my opinion you got a nice gun at a GB price and a worthless old blue box. Ask for the price of the box as a refund and go shooting.
I'll play the other side here regarding the box. We don't know that the seller was the one who altered the number on the box. He might have bought it that way. A high volume seller might possibly not have noticed. In my opinion you got a nice gun at a GB price and a worthless old blue box. Ask for the price of the box as a refund and go shooting.
