Model 39s (No Dash) old enough to be Curio-Relic status

[Bob 459]

Living in California many of the S&W Semi Auto pistols I'd love to bid on are not on the acceptable Ca DOJ list.

Not really in the market for a plastic gun I'd prefer a single stack version (439) of what I currently own (459) but that's not going to happen for another decade or two.

Since the pre July 1968 shipped 39s are past 50 years old they are exempt and no longer off limits to buyers in Ca near as I can figure.

3XXXX
6XXXX
and very low 8XXXX
Look like they are all past the line. A detailed list of acceptable range numbers in the 80,000s would be most useful to bidders-buyers.

Correct me if I'm in error please or missed the boat somehow.
Now I just need to watch the auction sites and see what turns up. No safe queens please I want a well used piece and a LEO turn in would suit me just fine.
I'll continue to search the old threads for numbers and shipped dates and compile more numbers by year and month.
Bob.

 

[batman4706]

39 Curio

My 39 is serial #651XX was made in Jan /Feb of 66 to give you an area of ref.

 

[Bob 459]

My 39 is serial #651XX was made in Jan /Feb of 66 to give you an area of ref.

Thanks @batman4706

This is what I've collected so far from digging in the old threads.



378XX Sep-63
386XX Sep-63
394XX Mar-64
61524 late 64 to early 65
62XXX probably 1965
651XX Jan /Feb of 66
660XX. = 1966
67XXX mid 1966
836XX Dec-67
841XX Dec-67
84181 = 1968
851XX Feb-68
89xxx = 1969
1059XX late 1968 to early 1969 SHIP date

Bob.

 

[model3sw]

M39 Serial Numbers C&R or not ?

Bob 459 ... the general ship dates on the 39s you post are accurate enough however there are batches that shipped out of sequence.

I'd "guesstimate" if you kept it under SN 85000 you'd be in C&R territory. Of course, the lower the SN the better.

I have 66xxx, steel frame, shipped in Feb. 1965 as one. I don't have many I lettered that are newer than this one. Mostly all mine are older ... much older.

Best Regards, Sal Raimondi, Sr.

 

[Bob 459]

Bob 459 ... the general ship dates on the 39s you post are accurate enough however there are batches that shipped out of sequence.

I'd "guesstimate" if you kept it under SN 85000 you'd be in C&R territory. Of course, the lower the SN the better.

I have 66xxx, steel frame, shipped in Feb. 1965 as one. I don't have many I lettered that are newer than this one. Mostly all mine are older ... much older.

Best Regards, Sal Raimondi, Sr.

Sal.
I knew about the first in last out shipping S&W did in the years in question with many out of sequence sets so I've watched the mid to high 80,000 coming up on gun broker but I've not bid since I don't know the exact numbers by month yet.
Passed on the 86XXX and the 88XXX

The only for sure one up currently is a pre 39 in the $2400 range and that's a bit more then I'm willing to spend on a shooter. To say nothing about my gun fund not being up to that level of coinage quite yet.
Bob

 

[Mr. Wonderful]

Hi Bob 459,

Here's a little serial number and cost info for you.

I bought a model 39 serial number 392XX (shipped December 1963 as per Roy Jinks), for $800 earlier this year. It was as new in box as you could hope for... box was a bit tattered in one area, but the gun, paperwork, second mag etc. looked like they came out of a time machine.

Keep your eyes open, and when the right deal comes around, jump on it.

Best wishes,

Roger aka Mr. Wonderful

 

[gmborkovic]

Bob, tell us about a $2400 pre 39.

 

[model3sw]

Bob459,

Any pre-39 brings a premium over the Model 39 marked pistols. Naturally, all depending upon similar condition guns.

A few years back I purchased pre39 SN:1843 ANIB with green 9mm booklet and correct box (box was about 90%, gun was ANIB) for $2000.00 from a fellow collector / member who he and I had traded .32 Auto S&W and any model 39 for at least 15 years prior. He asked $2K, there was no banter nor discussion. I could not get my hand in my pocket fast enough.

Then for pre-39s SNs: 2624 (new highest SN pre-39 recorded thus far) and lower to about SN 1500 are all about in the same price range. SN range in the 1400s and lower get a bit pricier, then the 1200s and lower bump it up ANOTHER notch. You get into the 1100s and lower serial number, the value goes up exponentially, although there is no rule that applies to the lower numbers as that is set by individual collectors' preference, I feel. Ask yourself ... what would you pay (for example) for SN 1001 ? SN: 1050 ? SN 1100 ? SN: 1200 ? SN 2500 ? SN; 5000 ? and so on. I like the low SN Model 39 marked, too. It is only within the past few days a member stated he has 2623, then Kevin Williams (the 39 author) verified he either has or seen 2624. Prior to that 2605 was the highest SN pre-39 I could validate.

As true with the entire line of 39s and pre-39s ... the lower the serial number the higher the value, no matter what the books indicate.

I like any pre-39, any Steel frame 39, or a standard alloy frame starting in the 20,000 serial number range and lower depending upon condition, box, papers and PRICE. I'm still hoping one of the 3 or 4 I have not yet lettered are discovered to be a GO pistol.

Kevin Williams got me hooked on GO pistols several years back. I had no clue before then there were any certain number of General Officer Model 39s or pre-39s. If you don't have Kevin Williams' and Dr. John Brunners, book on General Officer's Pistols try to find a copy. I think it's out of print but perhaps Kevin will be along to update this statement.

If you find any 39 NIB, it's hard to say "no". Find a pre-39 NIB and it's almost impossible to say "no" if it is priced somewhere within realm of reason.

This is Kevin's book: 9780984960521: U.S. General Officer'''s Pistols-A Collectors Guide - AbeBooks - Dr. John W. Brunner, Phd. Kevin Williams: 098496052X

and check out this old thread: Pre-39 Picture Thread

Surprisingly, there are some nice condition lower SN Model 39s and pre-39s that are nice, just not pristine, that could still be "had" at a decent price (around $1000 to $1500). Just don't expect to find one at bargain basement prices.

How 39-2s got to be worth near $1,000 the past few years I have NO clue nor can I reasons with it. Seems the 39-2s are leveling out now getting back into the realm of reason. To me any 39-2 NIB is worth $500 to MAYBE, $700 if an earlier nickel with safety, slide lock, release and other parts are also nickeled. Some later 39-2s the slide releases look brownish on some (I don't know why) until later on they got the blue bits nice and sparkly blue.

Must have been an old time dealer found he had about 1000 of them sitting in an old vault so started a hype thread on them to bolster the price. LOL !

 

[gmborkovic]

OK, thanks for info, still would like to hear from Bob. Mike

 

[Bob 459]

Bob, tell us about a $2400 pre 39.

@gmborkovic

Currently listed on gunbroker.
$2499.99 shows wear and no box.
#2265

Gunbroker also shows a few 39-2s listed from $267 to $900ish as well but they do me zero good being to new.
Stopped at the local Chain Store (Turners) to see if they'll do the transfer and got a negative so I'll need to find an FFL that will handle it.
I think one of the Indoor Ranges local to me say on their web site they will do out of state transfers for $50.00.
I'd like to have all my Ducks in a row well before I try and bid on one.

Bob

 

[model3sw]

@gmborkovic

Currently listed on gunbroker.
https://www.gunbroker.com/item/777618911
$2499.99 shows wear and no box.
#2265

Gunbroker also shows a few 39-2s listed from $267 to $900ish as well but they do me zero good being to new.
Stopped at the local Chain Store (Turners) to see if they'll do the transfer and got a negative so I'll need to find an FFL that will handle it.
I think one of the Indoor Ranges local to me say on their web site they will do out of state transfers for $50.00.
I'd like to have all my Ducks in a row well before I try and bid on one.

Bob

Yes, that one has been running awhile. It's not a pristine piece, either.

 

[Sevens]

Two things I'd like to mention... if this pistol you hope to procure is going to be a fun shooter that gets routine range work, would you consider replacing it's original top end with a newer 39-2 top end with the modern extractor? Just curious. Outside of a state that only allows a 39/39-2 if it qualifies as C&R, I would have no reason to even conjure this.

Which leads me to...
Oh, the joy of California. But if we can agree that the collective minds on this forum have "some" idea and that S&W/Jinks has a far better idea (if you pay for a letter) then I think we may be able to agree that the general gun populace and the BATFE and especially the California DOJ couldn't possibly have the slightest idea of precisely when the SN of a Model 39 makes it indeed a C&R.

To further that thought... as the clock of life continues to tick tick tick, every 39 no dash in existence is aging. In short time (relatively speaking...) every 39 no dash will unequivocally be a C&R.

It seems to me...
And sure, easier for me to spout from my home in free America...

...just seems that all you ACTUALLY need here are two FFL's willing to move a no-dash 39 from the USA to California. The rest seems to be minutiae for the politically corrupt and morally bankrupt California DOJ to ponder, but I have no idea how some such nonsense ends up on their desk to be investigated.

 

[model3sw]

Two things I'd like to mention... if this pistol you hope to procure is going to be a fun shooter that gets routine range work, would you consider replacing it's original top end with a newer 39-2 top end with the modern extractor? Just curious. Outside of a state that only allows a 39/39-2 if it qualifies as C&R, I would have no reason to even conjure this.

Which leads me to...
Oh, the joy of California. But if we can agree that the collective minds on this forum have "some" idea and that S&W/Jinks has a far better idea (if you pay for a letter) then I think we may be able to agree that the general gun populace and the BATFE and especially the California DOJ couldn't possibly have the slightest idea of precisely when the SN of a Model 39 makes it indeed a C&R.

To further that thought... as the clock of life continues to tick tick tick, every 39 no dash in existence is aging. In short time (relatively speaking...) every 39 no dash will unequivocally be a C&R.

It seems to me...
And sure, easier for me to spout from my home in free America...

...just seems that all you ACTUALLY need here are two FFL's willing to move a no-dash 39 from the USA to California. The rest seems to be minutiae for the politically corrupt and morally bankrupt California DOJ to ponder, but I have no idea how some such nonsense ends up on their desk to be investigated.

Maybe it's my age, or my dyslexia catching up with me but my brain hurts. What, exactly, are you trying to state here ? I'm completely baffled.

 

[Sevens]

I'm saying that the OP lives in California and wants a no-dash 39 but he needs for it to be old enough to qualify for BATFE Curio & Relic status.

But the actual "born on" date is murky information at best until someone pays for a factory letter from Roy Jinks.

So I am simply wondering how the CA-DOJ would have any clue if a particular no-dash 39 is eligible to be imported in to California.

The entire premise of this thread given the OP.

 

[illini24]

So what would a pre 39 in the 11xx range go for I know pictures tell all but it's in Fla. I'm in Tx. It is in pristine condition.

 

[model3sw]

I'm saying that the OP lives in California and wants a no-dash 39 but he needs for it to be old enough to qualify for BATFE Curio & Relic status.

But the actual "born on" date is murky information at best until someone pays for a factory letter from Roy Jinks.

So I am simply wondering how the CA-DOJ would have any clue if a particular no-dash 39 is eligible to be imported in to California.

The entire premise of this thread given the OP.

That's it. My brain blipped off-line with the repetition of the "California" references.

"California, the birth State of "fruits", "nuts" and the singing "California Raisins" ... and we also grow produce here."

 

[Sevens]

The entire subject of this thread.

 

[batman4706]

Why doesn't the OP just get a Curio FFL so he can have the pistol shipped directly to him?

PDFfiller

 

[Bob 459]

Why doesn't the OP just get a Curio FFL so he can have the pistol shipped directly to him?

PDFfiller

That's an idea I hadn't considered but worth exploring. Something I've read in the last few days tickles my brain that being a handgun it'll still need to go through a Ca FFL.
C&R direct ship to a class 03 C&R holder is only good on long guns here. At least that's what the back of my head says at 0 dark something this morning.
We got some really screwy laws I'm still trying to make sense of, wade through and try to understand and comply with.

Bob

 

[model3sw]

So what would a pre 39 in the 11xx range go for I know pictures tell all but it's in Fla. I'm in Tx. It is in pristine condition.

Where in Florida ? Email me from forum link to my email. Sal