...If I drink too much Jack (Daniels), I Ralph.
I don't really laugh out loud at very many things I read, but I did when I read that!
Good one! Well Played....
Altercation at the range.
- Thread starter Rastoff
- Start date
I don't really laugh out loud at very many things I read, but I did when I read that!
Good one! Well Played....
jag312
Member
One of my cases involved two neighbors. It started as a disagreement over one neighbor's cat and the other neighbor's flower bed. The disagreement got louder, then it got profane, and then one neighbor pulled out a gun. Final score; one man dead and one man in prison. How do you explain that to the wives and children?
Ralph and Jack need at least a year to grow up. Ten year old children in their 60s shouldn't have guns until they start acting like adults.
Ralph and Jack need at least a year to grow up. Ten year old children in their 60s shouldn't have guns until they start acting like adults.
Having run a couple of manufacturing plants I've found the best way to stop the violence is to fire all participants. Don't decide who did what first, who was at fault or who was not. Simple. All participants got fired. Eventually the message sinks in.
Sounds like oak tree to me. I'm 61 and shoot with the local gang bangers if someone threw me on the ground my 3 18 & 19 year old friends would have sent him away in a coroners wagon.trap is to easy and boring the real gunners shot sporting clays & have respect for others.
"I want a golden goose!!"
Absalom
SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
The problem with that solution is that it is rarely a solution outside the employment world where there is management and wage slaves.
Rastoff hasn't mentioned any details about how this situation is dealt with. Clubs, even if they are well-organized and have bylaws and properly elected club officers, only function on a consensus model, and if any conflict between members, especially if both parties have been around awhile and might be expected to have their supporters, is mishandled, it can tear the club apart. I've seen it happen, although not with a gun club.
Obviously, neither of these guys is an asset to the club and both should be disinvited, but I hope the club has procedures in place to get there which are accepted and respected by the membership. Otherwise, there could be ugly times ahead.
bigolddave
Member
A few years ago, at a trap range in Southern Wisconsin, a very good shooter who was a notorious jerk, started arguing with the puller/scorer about something. This was a registered shoot. Another shooter on the squad tried to defuse the situation, but caused an escalation. All three (the puller/scorer was also a trap shooter) were disciplined under the Conduct Detrimental clause and given a year off of registered shooting. There was no physical altercation. I would think physical would mean both are banned from the club for at least a year.
The outdoor range at which I practice is also the range where we qualify for work, and also the local Coast Guard unit qualifies there.
One day while qualifying for work, we hear a loud disagreement in the bay next to us, then a whole bunch of people start yelling. We were moving toward it when the noise died back down. It turned out two of the dudes working at the range had a disagreement while hanging out with the Coasties, and the disagreement got heated enough that one of them went to pull his gun...
The Coasties, who were standing right next to him, disarmed him and handcuffed the offender until the police arrived.
I never heard any other details about what happened or the fate of the offender, but it just goes to show some folks should probly not be carrying a gun.
One day while qualifying for work, we hear a loud disagreement in the bay next to us, then a whole bunch of people start yelling. We were moving toward it when the noise died back down. It turned out two of the dudes working at the range had a disagreement while hanging out with the Coasties, and the disagreement got heated enough that one of them went to pull his gun...
The Coasties, who were standing right next to him, disarmed him and handcuffed the offender until the police arrived.
I never heard any other details about what happened or the fate of the offender, but it just goes to show some folks should probly not be carrying a gun.
Patches?,,We don't need no stinkin' Patches...
It's come to that? A stupid piece of cloth that you can buy off of Ebay for a buck and sew on to your jacket to impress who?,,the Gun Show Ninjas??
Anyone in an animated and physical argument at a gun club / gunshow / gunshop over ANYTHING gets the boot.
The anger and availability of firearms is a bad combination. Alcohol many times is also involved as an after shooting activity.
Stupid little nothing disputes escalate,,and a firearm at hand can be the tragic end to it.
I've seen people that have killed someone over the last piece of birthday cake, the change of a TV channel,,and muddy footprints on 'my new line-o-leum floor'.
It doesn't take a whole lot to get it going.
Don't put up with that sort of behavior for a moment.
It's come to that? A stupid piece of cloth that you can buy off of Ebay for a buck and sew on to your jacket to impress who?,,the Gun Show Ninjas??
Anyone in an animated and physical argument at a gun club / gunshow / gunshop over ANYTHING gets the boot.
The anger and availability of firearms is a bad combination. Alcohol many times is also involved as an after shooting activity.
Stupid little nothing disputes escalate,,and a firearm at hand can be the tragic end to it.
I've seen people that have killed someone over the last piece of birthday cake, the change of a TV channel,,and muddy footprints on 'my new line-o-leum floor'.
It doesn't take a whole lot to get it going.
Don't put up with that sort of behavior for a moment.
CAJUNLAWYER
Member
When I was running the public defender office on an interim basis years ago my solution to a perceived "morale" problem that I communicated to the staff was simply to fire any unhappy employee. Cut THAT **** off in the bud!!! Troublemaker quit shortly thereafter and life moved on. Problem is that the state didn't like that management style and never gave me the head job, but instead condemned me to just practicing defense law without any of the headaches of putting up with the state bureaucracy. Killed two birds with one stone!
Jack Ryan
Member
People who like to get up in someone's face and call them a liar should be more careful of their step.
Send them both on down the road.
OP
Rastoff
US Veteran
No mention of how it's been dealt with because it's an evolving situation. The club's been open since the 70's and we've never seen anything like this before.
Yeah, not like a work situation at all. There could be legal ramifications at work here. Kicking them out sounds easy, but it may not be. Nothing is ever simple when assault is involved.
So then if Ralph just says or does something that makes Jack mad, and Jack, being a hothead with a short fuse, decides to take a poke at Ralph, then Ralph gets fired too, huh?
That sounds like justice. NOT!
Last edited:
CalmerThanYou
Member
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They should both get a patch that reads "I am a complete idiot" and wear it during all range sessions.
Hot heads are not an asset at the range. From a legal standpoint, from the way the situation was described in the OP, the one that did the pushing might well be able to legally justify the push. But who cares. They both proved they have judgement too poor to be members of a shooting range. Who cares about patches! I wouldn't wear them if I had them. Juvenile!!! Send them both off.
Both should be given either the little toy guns with chain and stopper that pops out or the flag that says "bang" and sent elsewhere.
