YOU NEED TO LEARN GUNSMITHING - LIKE IT OR NOT!

[chief38]

The days of walking into your trusted neighborhood Gunsmith (LGS) is coming to a screeching halt! The old timers are retiring, moving, selling, or whatever and just not there for you when you need them. I have seen so many posts on this Forum as of late, asking who they should send their S&W (or other brand) of gun to for repair, refinishing, modification etc.

There are a few LGS left but unfortunately (for the most part with rare exception) their talents, morals and ethics are not even close to the old timers. Then you have the "superstar" GS's that are nowhere locally and the firearms have to go through expensive shipping and insurance, ridiculous wait times, unreturned phone calls and emails, and BIB BIG bucks for the privilege of having them work on your firearms.

I am not implying that guys/gals with two left hands who are just not equipped to do this type of thing take the plunge but many GS-ing tasks are relatively straight forward jobs requiring nothing more than simple hand tools, knowledge and the will to learn.

There is also a learning curve and sometimes novices will botch a job - but that is also known as part of the learning process. Once something is learned it's usually a piece of cake on the next go-around.

So I want to encourage people to push themselves a little and learn how to maintain their own firearms before it becomes "mandatory" by way of new legislation, licensing fees & insurance skyrocket for GS, parts shortages, shipping restrictions, etc. etc. I think it prudent that one should start learning and doing know while the opportunity is still available. Who knows for how long we will be able to ship stuff and buy parts and certain tools.

Now that the components are becoming available for loading ammunition once again, some here might also reconsider Reloading. I do believe that component prices will be fairly normal (or at least the new normal) soon and I did not invent the saying, "strike while the iron is hot"!

Just wanted to get this off my chest and possibly help some people become a little more self reliant. I think we have all learned a few lessons over this past year!

 

[USBP SW]

I have been a proponent of these ideas for several years now, since here in California, independence has become an obvious outcome of the hostile political climate. People in this state cannot rely on finding a gunsmith or even find ammunition in the caliber they need. I have spoken to many people here and I have tried to stress the importance of independence. The only thing that I would add to chief 38's post is that you should try to stock up on any frequently needed parts for your favorite firearms because the parts may not be available when you look for them.

 

[jc2721]

I agree! We really have no general gunsmiths locally so little by little I am learning to do my own work. The hardest part for me was taking a file to metal for the first time, once that "barrier" was overcome I've had fewer qualms about doing relatively minor work on my own guns--no drilling, milling or welding for me, LOL.

 

[italiansport]

If everyone took the well intended but I believe misguided advise expressed above it,in itself, would likely create a shortage. If a firearm is used regularly keeping an extra firing pin and springs on hand would make sense but beyond this??

 

[Telecaster]

If everyone took the well intended but I believe misguided advise expressed above it,in itself, would likely create a shortage. If a firearm is used regularly keeping an extra firing pin and springs on hand would make sense but beyond this??

A lot of people won't take a gun apart for something that simple. I think that's what the OP was referring to as much as customizing.

 

[armorer951]

I think we may be doing a disservice to gunsmiths across our country by confusing the career and skill of a trained, certified and equipped gunsmith, with a gun owner attempting to do simple maintenance and replace drop in parts in firearms.

In fact, the real, and quite critical skill for the typical, untrained gun owner to learn is what constitutes an actual mechanical problem, and whether or not the determined issue is something the owner should attempt to repair.....or not. This becomes even more difficult for the average shooter/gun owner when the internet is flooded with downright dangerous "misinformation" and opinion.

There's an old saying that anyone who represents himself in court proceeding has a fool for a client. Let's face it, we are not trained gunsmiths by any stretch. While maintenance and minor repairs can be well within a persons skill set, and learning these skills and acquiring this knowledge is rewarding, many modifications, changes, and repairs, if attempted by an untrained gun owner, can result in catastrophic failures and even loss of life and limb.

 

[Muss Muggins]

I've been to the S&W factory revolver armorer school, the Remington 870 course, the Glock course, and some general firearm repair courses. I have many of the proper tools, but . . . I am by no means a gunsmith, and I don't pretend to be. I know enough to mostly keep my stuff running, but sometimes it gets above my head. The same with with every other thing I own that needs maintenance.

In the words of somebody cool, "A man needs to know his limitations . . . "

 

[dwh]

Repairing anything mechanical is not for everyone and it shouldn't be. What I've found to be true most of the time. Is that those that are the most opposed to attempting their own repairs probably shouldn't do so in the first place. I was tried of the long waits for an action job. So I bought the shop manual and over time 4 gunsmith special model 10s. They where already broken so I can't do any more harm.I learned something from everyone of those guns and they all function perfectly when I was done. Yes it cost me my time and some money. But now I can repair the timing adjust the trigger pull smooth the action. As long as you avoid power tools and take your time most things can be undone. I did the 9422m below with files,sand paper and a sharpie. I didn't khave layout dye. The after is better than the before. So why not try to improve your skill. Just don't start on Elmer Keith's gun and you'll be ok.

 

[H Richard]

I think the need is to know your limitations. I have, through necessity (no local gunsmith), taught myself the basic's of S&W revolvers, and 1911 mechanics. I don't hesitate to totally disassemble and perform various (minimal) repairs, adjustments and replacement of parts and fitting. Any other handgun I don't touch. I always make certain I can field strip and clean every gun I own, but I don't attempt much in repairs. Luckily, I have been lucky over the years and have had not many major problems to have to repair. I do have a few machinist, tool maker friends that have helped me over the years.

 

[USBP SW]

I hope that nobody misunderstands what I am trying to say. I would never suggest that anyone take on tasks that places them in danger. However, I live in a populated area of California, there are about three gunsmith in about a hundred mile radius and with a several month wait for them to work on something, it's just not practical to rely on a gunsmith for minor repairs. Additionally, I don't suggest that people run out and purchase every part for everything they own. I suggest that they have on hand only what they would likely need to keep things running. I have on hand, the tools and shims to correct endshake, firing pins, rivets and rear sight blades. Beyond that, I have relied on finding parts from various sources as the need arises and contingent on my abilities. On occasion, a gunsmith has said that he would do the work if I find the parts. I base the necessities on what I have needed in the past.

 

[tennexplorer]

I would suggest that the one week NRA sponsored courses at Murray State, Piedmont and a couple of other schools are a great way to rapidly increase one's knowledge. Also they make a pretty good vacation.

And to Chief38, my sincerest thank you for starting this topic.

 

[teletech]

I think there is a lot of conflation between armorer and gunsmith, so there's that and we can argue semantics on that front. I suspect the OP was more referring to armorer level work. I'd be thrilled if people even understood how their firearms worked more than half the time.
It's a mixed bag, on the one hand you don't have widely experienced gunsmiths around much anymore and there are years of experience in tweaking up a thing so the timing or alignment is just so, but on the other side of that is the internet where you can find a walk-through of detail strip, parts replacement, and customization for almost anything under the sun, information that used to take up shelves of books and the videos are often vastly better than what books there were, so if you have mechanical aptitude a lot of things are much easier to work out than they used to be.

 

[kbm6893]

American Gunsmithing Institute (AGI) CD's are another invaluable source of firearm information. They usually cover complete disassembly .....assembly....along with general firearm information for a specific model.

I have one for several of the firearms I own. Just for when I need them. Who knows when the antis will pull the plug on YouTube.

Klyde

Whenever I find a particularly good video on YouTube, I download it in case one day they're not available anymore. I have my own folder with dozens of videos.

 

[bigwheelzip]

Ya kin fix everthin wit YouTube an a Dremel.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

 

[Johnnu2]

I'm a tinkerer who knows his limitations. I use the myriad videos and manuals. HOWEVER, nowhere have I been able to find ANY info/help/video/manuals for Freedom Arms. I've been looking for years in all the right places..... NADA. I've even posted this concern on various forums, asking if anyone knows why this is so. No one has yet answered that question. It's almost as if the people in the know are afraid to respond, and everyone else is in the same boat as me. Anyone here have any idea why Freedom Arms info is non-existent? (yes, I own two, and have asked FA for detailed assemble/disassembly info... unsuccessfully).
Rant over,
J.

 

[chief38]

While Gunsmith's might take my post in a negative way it was not really meant to rally against them. It was meant to give some who are capable a little push to learn a skill they might or will need in the future and might not be readily available locally due to laws, politics, restrictions on shipping, etc.

First off, many of TODAY'S LGS (I truly hate to say this) are butchers!! I have seen more than a few badly done jobs that left the gun in worse condition than it went there in. Even though they call themselves "Gunsmiths" IMHO they are not.

The old timers who are experienced, ethical and super skilled have retired, moved, or are so backed up they are virtually unavailable to the general public.My only intent here was to suggest that my approach is really the way of the future - but of course I might be wrong. I don't think I am but I hope I am!

What I will refer to as "super-star" GS's (like Turnbull) are so backed up and so so costly many here can simply not afford them or be able to wait over a year to get their guns back! Add the very costly shipping both ways and a repair or mod could cost more than the gun itself!

 

[Bekeart]

Advise I was given by an OLD gunsmith.

Advise I was given by an OLD gunsmith.
Many years ago I loafed and swapped stories a gunsmith with 90 plus years of age. I learned a lot from this man. Some of it applied to servicing my own firearms.

He gave me some good advice - summarized below:

Before you Start:
1) Know WHAT you are planning to do/
2) Know WHY you are planning to do it.
3) Know HOW it should be done.
4 Know IF the work is WITHIN your skill level.
5) Know WHEN to STOP!

You can not undrill an incorrect hole.
You can not replace filed metal.



Bekeart

 

[Jerry in SC]

I'm a tinkerer who knows his limitations. I use the myriad videos and manuals. HOWEVER, nowhere have I been able to find ANY info/help/video/manuals for Freedom Arms. I've been looking for years in all the right places..... NADA. I've even posted this concern on various forums, asking if anyone knows why this is so. No one has yet answered that question. It's almost as if the people in the know are afraid to respond, and everyone else is in the same boat as me. Anyone here have any idea why Freedom Arms info is non-existent? (yes, I own two, and have asked FA for detailed assemble/disassembly info... unsuccessfully).
Rant over,
J.

Owned four at one time, even Bowen told me there's nothing much that can be done other than reducing the trigger pull and some cosmetic changes. FA is very cautious about owners tinkering with their revolvers, especially the 83. FA was sued because of the lack of a Ruger type hammer block in the 83.

What exactly are you wanting to do?

 

[vinn]

G.I. in 1945 "refrad" troops, took up gunsmithing in school. AT THAT TIME; the certificant was "4 yrs. aprentaceship as a machinest AND 2 yr's at gunsmithing. the best work was done thru the years. God bless them.

 

[chief38]

Hey, ya gotta start somewhere!