Local place had Norma 9MM 124 gr FMJ in stock cheap recently so I bought a few boxes, trusting the Norma name. Out of several boxes this was the only issue. Relative had it in a Beretta 92 series. He pulled the trigger and nothing happened. After a wait he pulled it again but no fire. I dissected the dud today. Had powder charge and a flash hole. Apparently it looks like first strike crushed the primer, and the anvil is blocking the flashhole. Second blow did ignite the primer but since the hole was blocked, all it did was blow out the side of the primer. So that was an unusual fail for factory ammo for me. After that I fired 50 rounds of it thru my gun with no issues at all.
Norma 9MM dud
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Well that just burst my bubble , on using factory ammo for SD use.
Revolvers, anyone ?
Revolvers, anyone ?
I think if you really look at that primer you will find it was seated sideways and the flash came out the side that was open. I have had one of these in a lifetime. It was a R-P 9mm green box range ammo.
VaTom
Member
Where is the Norma 9mm made? I ordered some Norma .38 special during the flash sa!e about a month ago. It is made in Hungary. Haven't shot any yet.
It's red box range and training ammo. Made in Hungary. I assumed all the boxes that I bought there were from the same lot but not sure. The primers look strange in one box. Like the centers are pushed in so there is a lip around the edge of the primer itself, like it was compressed with a flat punch or something. The second box shows an outline of a flat punch maybe on the primers but it is faint as compared to the notable lip on the other. None of them look to be problematic but I guess it is possible that the dud primer was incorrectly seated sideways or crooked but flush. I fired 50 rounds of it thru a Glock 43 also and no problems. A quick scan of the ammo would be a good idea with any ammo for blatant primer issues. I doubt my relative was that attentive at the range with this stuff. Now he may be. Maybe because I told him Norma is a well known reputable maker. Well maybe I just got lucky and found the .01% item.
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While the major ammo makers, including Norma, inspect the heck out of their product it's still made by humans and will occasionally include faults. Part of gun handling includes how to handle a potential "dud" on the practice range. Also need to practice immediate action drills to apply in a "must shoot now" set of circumstances.
Pisgah
Member
if a shooter has not experienced a factory-loaded dud, he just hasn't shot enough. That they are rare is testimony to the manufacturer's equpment and maintenance of same. if you've ever seen a commercial high-volume loading line in operation and seen cartridges cascade out like water from a hose you'll wonder how half of them aren't duds.
tominboise
Member
Not pistol ammo but I bought some Winchester 243 SuperX ammo a couple of years ago and had four primer failures in the box of 20 rounds. The primers were dead. I eventually pulled the bullets, dumped the powder, decapped and recapped the rounds with new WW primers, put the powder back in, reseated the bullets and shot the four, just to see what would happen. They fired as normal.
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FWIW, in 60+ years of shooting had no duds until the 90's from factory ammo. Since reloading from mid 70's had No duds with my ammo and have had maybe 10 duds from factory ammo in last 2 years. nuf sed.
tndrfttom
Member
I think you are right.
A guy shooting a new AR-15 next to me at the range had two misfires where the primer went "pop" and smoke rolled out of the receiver. I told him to stop and the RO suggested that he not fire any more of his ammo (factory R-P). I took one of the rounds home and pulled the bullet, dumped the powder and de-capped the primer. The primer was seated sideways in the pocket and, luckily, blocked the flash hole in the case. This is the only time I've seen this but this guy had two of them in the same box!
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GypsmJim
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Two years ago I bought several bricks of Winchester rimfire ammo. Each box had one or more empty cases, some primed, some not, none with powder or bullet. Not one box had a 500 round count.
Back in the 1980's I bought several Remington rimfire bricks, and several boxes of unprimed centerfire brass. Not one single box of anything Remington contained 100% functional product.
I have used several spam cans of surplus military ammo going back as far as 1935, and it all has been 100% sure fire.
Back in the 1980's I bought several Remington rimfire bricks, and several boxes of unprimed centerfire brass. Not one single box of anything Remington contained 100% functional product.
I have used several spam cans of surplus military ammo going back as far as 1935, and it all has been 100% sure fire.
This. And 10 silly characters.
The very few factory duds I've had always fired on the second try. OTOH, I have a coffee can full of discarded rounds I've picked up at our public range, many of which are duds, some reloads, most factory. Hard to tell if its the gun's fault or the manufacturer's.
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I've had several factory rounds fail on me over the years, US made and foreign. Also had a number of others brought to me by customers at the gun shop and the gun shows I worked too. Sadly some errors always seem to slip through, current high demand probably isn't helping either. Even with all the inspections high speed production has risks of things going unseen. And some simply aren't even visible like a sideways or inverted primer would be (how about a case with no flash hole or a primer with no anvil? I've seen both in factory ammo)
ArchAngelCD
Moderator, SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
That is upsetting since Norma is supposed to be high end ammo. Only had a few duds ever and all were .22lr. Unfortunately one was a very expensive Eley round which only goes to show, like said above, anything made by humans or even machines can fail.
The Norma ammo failing does surprise me. I also have several boxes of 9mm but not the red box stuff, the SD stuff.
The Norma ammo failing does surprise me. I also have several boxes of 9mm but not the red box stuff, the SD stuff.
scoobysnacker
Member
I know "Norma" is supposed to be good ammo, but I'm not that familiar with their 9mm ammo. If it's made in Hungary, then it's not coming from the same factories that made the company it's name back in the day, with rifle cartridges.
It's all part of RUAG, which owns a number of different companies now. The Hungarian factories used to be MFS, I think. But since RUAG owns the names, they can slap Norma, GECO, or other such labels on the boxes.
scoobysnacker
Member
Well, I suppose I will be testing this stuff out soon for myself. Came across an online sale of the Norma white box 124gr fmj, on 'closeout sale'.
$310 for a case, with free shipping.
No, that's not the sub-$200 I clung to forever, and btw I'm nowhere near being low in stock. But it's the best price I've seen online or in stores personally (I've heard people finding 9mm at Academy for $14.99, don't know what brand).
$310 for a case, with free shipping.
No, that's not the sub-$200 I clung to forever, and btw I'm nowhere near being low in stock. But it's the best price I've seen online or in stores personally (I've heard people finding 9mm at Academy for $14.99, don't know what brand).
I've always felt that Norma ammo was over priced and over-rated. On two separate occasions (admittedly several years apart) I had new Norma 7.62x54R that would not fit in any of three Moisins my friends and I were shooting.
About 1988 a fellow officer and I were shooting new Remington/Peters .45ACP at the police range (and from S&W 4506 duty pistols) when he had a dud. When we pulled it apart the case did not have a flash hole. When we told the factory about that (and showed a Rep. the case, they insisted that such a thing was not possible due to the way their loading line worked.
About 1988 a fellow officer and I were shooting new Remington/Peters .45ACP at the police range (and from S&W 4506 duty pistols) when he had a dud. When we pulled it apart the case did not have a flash hole. When we told the factory about that (and showed a Rep. the case, they insisted that such a thing was not possible due to the way their loading line worked.
