Lead Ban Proposed...Bullets, Shot and Fishing Tackle
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I can see protecting the fish and ducks but why are they going to stop the
use of all the black powder guns, from being used ?
This does not look good for some of us.
use of all the black powder guns, from being used ?
This does not look good for some of us.
Protocall_Design
Vendor
They are trying every means they can come up with to ban guns. Banning lead bans almost all ammo for guns. Banning fishing weights makes it look more like it's not just about guns, although some tree huggers are anti fishing, as well as hunting, raising farm animals to eat, etc. Just more ways to force their views on the rest of us.
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I tried a couple of boxes of Nosler's RRLP bullets. The core is powdered copper in some matrix. Very long for weight. They were originally developed to allow steel reactive targets to be shot at closer ranges without either damaging targets or injuring shooters. Oddly, they seem to have slightly better tissue simulant penetration than M193 ball. At about 2.5 times the price per bullet (not loaded ammo).
Hornady's GMX bullet seems like a very good game bullet if you worry about lead in your meat. Load development amounted to picking a powder charge and running it across the chrono. OK, the pick was educated estimate, but it worked like gang busters.
Hornady's GMX bullet seems like a very good game bullet if you worry about lead in your meat. Load development amounted to picking a powder charge and running it across the chrono. OK, the pick was educated estimate, but it worked like gang busters.
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Chubbs103
US Veteran
We've been lead free in CA for a while.
There are lead free options. This includes muzzle loading. Some lead-free works great (high-power, centerfire) but are expensive. Some, not so much (.22lr). I have not used used any of the muzzle loading options yet.
Don't quite understand why they are worried about protecting critters who are being killed and eaten.
Rpg
Member
I've tried some of the Barnes bullets in centerfire rifles.
I've found it works OK on game, but presents real problems handloaded: the projectiles are over long and consume a lot of powder space. They require a lot of load development to find an effective combination that delivers adequate velocity with greatly reduced powder capacity. Short neck cartridges are virtually impossible. Many traditional loads won't work.
Bismuth works OK but is hard to find. Steel shot is miserable stuff and certainly wounds more birds than it kills. If you don't have a very good dog, I think it's irresponsible to shoot at birds with steel shot.
I've found it works OK on game, but presents real problems handloaded: the projectiles are over long and consume a lot of powder space. They require a lot of load development to find an effective combination that delivers adequate velocity with greatly reduced powder capacity. Short neck cartridges are virtually impossible. Many traditional loads won't work.
Bismuth works OK but is hard to find. Steel shot is miserable stuff and certainly wounds more birds than it kills. If you don't have a very good dog, I think it's irresponsible to shoot at birds with steel shot.
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Plus the fact many shotguns out there with fixed chokes should not be fired with steel shot because of damaging the barrel or creating a barrel bulge. That leaves Bismuth but heard it costs around $40 per box. Bit costly for the average joe to hunt Upland bird or ducks.
riverrat38
US Veteran
If this is for all ammo, it would considerably increase the cost of ammo the government and military uses each year.
73,
Rick
73,
Rick
Wrangler Rich
US Veteran
Could we still cast our own?
WR
WR
I just can't stand the hypocrisy. Seriously, the best environmentalists I know are hunters and fishermen. I consider myself an environmentalist and I've been fishing all my life. I work to protect what I love, which includes the outdoors. I'm also getting very sick of my rights as a nearly lifetime gun owner being trampled. I hope all gun owners, hunters and fishermen know what's at stake and vote. This isn't about keeping lead out of the environment.
bmcgilvray
Member
Never has been about keeping lead out of the environment, going back to lead shot bans for waterfowl. Could see this coming decades ago.
We've got to get control of this run away government.
We've got to get control of this run away government.
Who cares what it costs when you are spending other people's money? Remember the Army's quest for for "green ammunition?" Lead free and tungsten was the answer, until it wasn't.
How Tungsten missed the mark
Seems like everybody is too busy screaming and pulling their hair out to notice the details of the proposed rule.
"The USFWS announced new proposed hunting and fishing opportunities for game species at 19 national wildlife refuges on approximately 54,000 acres nationwide. Slipped into that proposal, though, is a phased ban of traditional ammunition by 2026." The article further specifies the ban currently only applies to the newly opened lands, but does suggest strongly that it is likely to spread to other federal lands in time.
Here again, it's an article that echos a few others I've seen but is NOT primary source material. If someone would care to post a link to the pertinent sections of the rule, I'm sure we would all benefit from seeing what's actually on the table.
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Lead was restricted here for pheasant release sites many years ago. With the closure of private land by property owners that doesn't leave many places to hunt upland birds in WA. None of my shotguns could use steel and other non toxic shot is just too expensive. I sold all of them. I had about 10 lbs of Nice Shot and sold it for some ridiculous price about 2 years ago. That told me that people still want and use a substitute that works like lead. Steel isn't that. There really is no substitute for lead unless you want to pay through the nose.
I understand the science behind the federal ban of lead for waterfowl, but so far I haven't seen any hard evidence that it creates a problem for upland bird or deer/elk/moose survivability.
It's just an ecology myth that the save-the-planet warriors have adopted to stop all hunting.
I always hunted with a dog anyway and everyone I hunted with did also. The theory that predator's kill and eat wounded upland birds is ridiculous. We only lost a few upland birds and we ate the rest. Grouse and wild pheasant is delightful. I knew a charming woman from Belgium who ask every year if I would shoot her a pheasant for Christmas dinner. She said it was a tradition in her country but she never had it here in the US.
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NFrameFred
Member
That bunch is really starting to irritate me . . . .
BrovoEchoSierra
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just one step closer
Gov. has been nuts over lead for the last couple decades.
No more lead in wheel weights, for some time, now what in the world could the be hurting? Not a thing, but they are great material for casting.
They just keep moving closer to an out right ban on anything that goes bang!
Gov. has been nuts over lead for the last couple decades.
No more lead in wheel weights, for some time, now what in the world could the be hurting? Not a thing, but they are great material for casting.
They just keep moving closer to an out right ban on anything that goes bang!
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