New Short Barrel reload for 45ACP

[flintsghost]

I am a big fan of Speers Gold Dot "Short Barrel" ammunition when I can get it. But the fact is they don't load it for every caliber and when they do it is sometimes not in the bullet I would prefer. I own several N frame revolvers that are 3" barrels. When I obtained my 625-3, I decided to try to develop a load for a Gold Dot bullet. No one had any 200 grain bullets and the only place I could find any 185 grain was direct from Speer. So I decided to try them. I was looking for a load that would get around 900 to 1000 FPS our of the 3" barrel. I decided to try this bullet with 231 and a WLP primer in any 45AR fired brass on hand. I started with 6.6 grains. I was amazed at the accuracy and I got a full burn in the 3" with 1" center to center 5 shot accuracy for a 1 hand hold rested on a sandbag at 7 yards.

I then decided to try it in 45ACP brass and shoot some through a couple of Colt Defenders on hand. I have since upped the load to 6.8 grains of 231.
I got one 5 shot group that went .9" center to center out of a 3" defender with a called flier about a half inch out of the group. The load is exceptionally clean burning and feeds well. I'm satisfied. I don't have a chronograph to tell but it feels like I've made it to the top of my FPS desires.

 

[STORMINORMAN]

I bought a bunch of the 230gr GDHP SBs years ago On $ale @ Midway (like many of my bullet purchases) and have found #5 worked very well with them in both 1911s and my Model of 1955, and in both 45acp & AutoRim cases. Even some in 45 Colt as well.

They really don't require excessive velocity to expand!

Cheers!

 

[biku324]

Longshot is also good in any barrel length for full-power 45 ACP or AR loads.

 

[jimmyj]

I am a big fan of Speers Gold Dot "Short Barrel" ammunition when I can get it. But the fact is they don't load it for every caliber and when they do it is sometimes not in the bullet I would prefer. I own several N frame revolvers that are 3" barrels. When I obtained my 625-3, I decided to try to develop a load for a Gold Dot bullet. No one had any 200 grain bullets and the only place I could find any 185 grain was direct from Speer. So I decided to try them. I was looking for a load that would get around 900 to 1000 FPS our of the 3" barrel. I decided to try this bullet with 231 and a WLP primer in any 45AR fired brass on hand. I started with 6.6 grains. I was amazed at the accuracy and I got a full burn in the 3" with 1" center to center 5 shot accuracy for a 1 hand hold rested on a sandbag at 7 yards.



I then decided to try it in 45ACP brass and shoot some through a couple of Colt Defenders on hand. I have since upped the load to 6.8 grains of 231.
I got one 5 shot group that went .9" center to center out of a 3" defender with a called flier about a half inch out of the group. The load is exceptionally clean burning and feeds well. I'm satisfied. I don't have a chronograph to tell but it feels like I've made it to the top of my FPS desires.

What kind of recoil ?

 

[Rogeronimo]

Longshot is also good in any barrel length for full-power 45 ACP or AR loads.

Longshot is what I use behind a Nosler 250gr.JHP. Designed for the LC, but I load them in ACP. They publish velocities from 612fps to 1420fps in the long colt, so I have never worried about producing an adequate working cartridge for my auto.

 

[KSDeputy]

I carry short barreled .45 pistols. I decided to load mine with Underwood copper ammunition. It is expensive, but worth it.

 

[stansdds]

W-231/HP-38, in my experience, is an excellent powder for the 45 ACP. I found that AA#5 works well too, but leaves more partially combusted granules in my 1911's.

 

[cowboy4evr]

My favorite powders for the 45 acp are as follows : Winchester Super Field , Winchester Super Target and Ramshot True Blue . I have used several other powders but I always come back to these 3 . I only use a 230 gr plated / cast bullets . Regards Paul

 

[Nevada Ed]

I only need Red Dot in my M49 snub nose with the 135 gr Gold Dot to get factory data

so I can see why w231 is working out for you in those 45 loads.

Glad that you could find some GD bullets, by the way
and that they are working out for you.

 

[flintsghost]

Recoil on my load wasn't bad at all in any of my Defenders or in 45AR in a 625-3 3". But then again I'm used to shooting full power ammunition in 44 mag and 45 ACP. My Defenders are very light, less weight than a LW commander. But the 625-3 and the other 629's I shoot normally have plenty of heft to them.

 

[bigboredad]

I could be misinformed but I believe the short barrel has to do with the bullets hp largely for the short barrel and less concerned about powder /_ velocity. In my experience the powder that gives you the best velocity for say a 6 inch barrel will also give the best velocity out of a shorter barrel. That's just my experience.

Sent from my SM-A426U using Tapatalk

 

[flintsghost]

I could be misinformed but I believe the short barrel has to do with the bullets hp largely for the short barrel and less concerned about powder /_ velocity. In my experience the powder that gives you the best velocity for say a 6 inch barrel will also give the best velocity out of a shorter barrel. That's just my experience.

Sent from my SM-A426U using Tapatalk

My understanding is that the powder charge is maximized for use in barrels of 4" and less. Maybe you should go into Speers site and look and see what they have to say about it. The fact that their short barrel ammunition is also factory chronographed in 4" barrels mainly would tend to bear that out. My experience indicates that without changing the powder to get a full burn your regular long barrel loads don't perform as well from short barrels. This is out of their website on Speer Law enforcement ammo.

"Speer® LE Gold Dot® Short Barrel Duty Ammunition
Packing a short barrel once meant less velocity and less reliable expansion. Speer’s specialized ammunition designed for back-up guns was designed to work in 2-inch barrels. We redesigned select Gold Dot bullets to make the cavity larger for reliable expansion at the reduced velocities common to short barrel handguns. You also get less "kick" to keep you on target when wielding sharp snapping .357 and .44 Magnum revolvers. And if a semi-auto is your gun of choice, our offerings are ideal for expansion in barrels as short as three inches.
Speer® LE Gold Dot® Short Barrel Duty Ammunition"

 

[BLUEDOT37]

My understanding is that the powder charge is maximized for use in barrels of 4" and less. Maybe you should go into Speers site and look and see what they have to say about it. The fact that their short barrel ammunition is also factory chronographed in 4" barrels mainly would tend to bear that out. My experience indicates that without changing the powder to get a full burn your regular long barrel loads don't perform as well from short barrels. This is out of their website on Speer Law enforcement ammo.

"Speer® LE Gold Dot® Short Barrel Duty Ammunition
Packing a short barrel once meant less velocity and less reliable expansion. Speer’s specialized ammunition designed for back-up guns was designed to work in 2-inch barrels. We redesigned select Gold Dot bullets to make the cavity larger for reliable expansion at the reduced velocities common to short barrel handguns. You also get less "kick" to keep you on target when wielding sharp snapping .357 and .44 Magnum revolvers. And if a semi-auto is your gun of choice, our offerings are ideal for expansion in barrels as short as three inches.
Speer® LE Gold Dot® Short Barrel Duty Ammunition"

.

Faster burning powders are "more efficient" than slow burning powders in a short barrel, when compared to the same load in a long barrel, but that doesn't mean it gives a higher muzzle velocity.

The load(s) that has the highest velocity in a long barrel revolver will usually be the one(s) that gives the highest velocity in your shorty, just with a lot more muzzle blast.

Speer lists short barrel handloads in their reloading manuals & in the .357 Magnum section the 135gr GDHP-SB load data (Speer #14, page 896) is presented right & you can clearly see that heavy loads of slow powder(s) will give the the highest muzzle velocity in both the short barrel (2.5") & the long barrel (6") revolver verses a faster powder (Unique), in this example.

I say it's presented right because both barrel lengths used the same powders & charge weights. They did not do this in the 44 Magnum section (Speer #14, page 950), they only used fast & medium speed powders in the short barrel section.

And the reason you get "less kick" from a short barrel load using "fast" powder -vs- a "slow" powder load is, in part, because the powder charge's lighter weight calculates into the felt recoil just like a change to a lighter bullet weight does.

A lighter bullet weight combined with a lighter powder charge weight equals less recoil.

Bottom line, a max load of fast/medium powder has a slower velocity than a max load of slow powder has in common revolver barrel lengths.

.

 

[zeke]

Guess i would ask where you got the load data to use? Your starting load is well over max that Speer lists for the 230 gn sb gdhp in 45 acp. While there are higher pressure loads listed for 45 auto revolvers by Sierra, they use slower powders.

Personally would at least use a chronograph if trying to develop very high pressure pistol reloads. Even with a chrono, trying to get 1000 fps 230 gn bullet from 3 in barreled semi in 45 acp is pushing it, and requires a slower powder.

The main difference of Speers 230 sb gdhp is the hollow point itself, developed to expand at slightly lower velocity's.

edited to consistently refer to 230 gn sb gdhp.

 

[hoytx10]

I’ve had great results with tight group by hogdon in short barreled semi autos.

 

[rockquarry]

I am a big fan of Speers Gold Dot "Short Barrel" ammunition when I can get it. But the fact is they don't load it for every caliber and when they do it is sometimes not in the bullet I would prefer. I own several N frame revolvers that are 3" barrels. When I obtained my 625-3, I decided to try to develop a load for a Gold Dot bullet. No one had any 200 grain bullets and the only place I could find any 185 grain was direct from Speer. So I decided to try them. I was looking for a load that would get around 900 to 1000 FPS our of the 3" barrel. I decided to try this bullet with 231 and a WLP primer in any 45AR fired brass on hand. I started with 6.6 grains. I was amazed at the accuracy and I got a full burn in the 3" with 1" center to center 5 shot accuracy for a 1 hand hold rested on a sandbag at 7 yards.

I then decided to try it in 45ACP brass and shoot some through a couple of Colt Defenders on hand. I have since upped the load to 6.8 grains of 231.
I got one 5 shot group that went .9" center to center out of a 3" defender with a called flier about a half inch out of the group. The load is exceptionally clean burning and feeds well. I'm satisfied. I don't have a chronograph to tell but it feels like I've made it to the top of my FPS desires.

I suppose it's possible to do what you want to do without a chronograph, but far more difficult. Shoot your benchrested groups at 25 yards if you have an interest in accuracy. That distance will quickly help you weed out bad loads. Shooting at 7 yards reveals almost nothing and is a waste of components. At 7 yards, shooters have perfect skill and the sorriest of handloads have "tiny group" capability.

Try several powders if possible and don't worry about "full burn" if you're getting the accuracy and velocity you want. Generally, the powder that provides best velocity in a long barrel will provide best velocity in a shorter barrel, rare exceptions noted.

Once you get a chronograph, don't fixate on ES and SD numbers. In fact it's not necessary to even consider them unless your group sizes are poor. Group size is always the final arbiter of a good load. A load with small ES and SD numbers can be very inaccurate. The numbers are an indication of consistency only, not accuracy. There are many, many more factors that contribute to accuracy. Good luck-

 

[zeke]

Guess i would ask where you got the load data to use? Your starting load is well over max that Speer lists for the sb gdhp in 45 acp. While there are higher pressure loads listed for 45 auto revolvers by Sierra, they use slower powders.

Personally would at least use a chronograph if trying to develop very high pressure pistol reloads. Even with a chrono, trying to get 1000 fps from 3 in barreled semi in 45 acp is pushing it, and requires a slower powder.

The main difference of Speers 230 sb gdhp is the hollow point itself, developed to expand at slightly lower velocity's.

And i am gonna have to sincerely apologize if your using 6.8 gns 231 load is for a 185 gn gold dot, but assumed you were using a 230 gn sb gdhp as that is what the Speer 45 acp sb gold dot load uses. Am not aware of a 185 gn sb gdhp.

 

[flintsghost]

Zeke, Speer loads a 230 grain in their "Short Barrel" ammunition. I chose to load a smaller bullet because I could get it. Currently that's the only size that a Gold Dot JHP is available in as a bullet from any of my sourses. Since I'm loading my own, I am not limited by what Speer chose to load.

 

[zeke]

Zeke, Speer loads a 230 grain in their "Short Barrel" ammunition. I chose to load a smaller bullet because I could get it. Currently that's the only size that a Gold Dot JHP is available in as a bullet from any of my sourses. Since I'm loading my own, I am not limited by what Speer chose to load.

Sorry again , i misunderstood. The 230 sb gdhp is different from the regular gdhps in the the hollow point is more straight sided and wider at the bottom. The 180 and 200 grain gdhp's use a similar hollow point cavity as the regular 230 gn gdhp. Their 45 acp "short Barrel" ammunition is defined by the distinctly differing 230 gn sb gdhp.

I wish i could find gdhp's in 9mm, but like you i can not find them. Already have a ample supply of the 230 gn sb gdhp. Acquired specifically for 3 in 45's.

 

[BillBro]

9.3gr of Ramshot Silohuette gave me about the velocity youre after with a 185gr Nos, but also a 5" barrel. Sorry, best I got.