Yeah, but I never leave it in my truck. What they don't know won't hurt them.
Look up the vid "Never rob a Texas Post Office". An interesting (but graphic though) concealed carry vid.
Obnoxious “Kid” Carrying In/At Waldmartan
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Yeah, but I never leave it in my truck. What they don't know won't hurt them.
Look up the vid "Never rob a Texas Post Office". An interesting (but graphic though) concealed carry vid.
That's why there is mixed feelings on open carry. There are regions and places where it isn't a big deal. Other places it's ignorant. There is blogs on You-Tube about these punks that go open carry into public areas, like Malls and festivals. Some citizen gets nervous and calls cops. Cop shows up and Punk proceeds to School Cop on his constitutional right to open carry. The cop has to investigate the complaint. He has to talk to the Punk to determine if he is a threat. The citizen doesn't know the Punk or what he is doing with a gun in public = why shouldn't he be concerned. This is the kind of place shootings are happening.
I've said since this CCW & open carry started that most open carry people are nit wits. There are gun people and people with guns and the latter are going to end up ruining it for everyone else. If you don't police yourself
there is always someone more than willing to do it for you.
I've said since this CCW & open carry started that most open carry people are nit wits. There are gun people and people with guns and the latter are going to end up ruining it for everyone else. If you don't police yourself
there is always someone more than willing to do it for you.
Would a WM freak care about someone OCing?
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So; you're an ardent 40 year-old white male OC advocate. You have your Kimber 1911 strapped on, cocked and locked, as you stop at the convenience store at Airport Road and Cerrillos in Santa Fe, NM, while on your way from Denver to El Paso. As usual, there is a group of teens, mostly boys, some girls, parked in spaces on the west side of the property; they're within 25 yards of your pump, standing, laughing, and talking as a group.
Suddenly, a 17 year-old male starts it - "Hey... you a cop?," and laughs and points. The rest of the group joins in. They're noisy and laughing; the first guy starts walking toward you with a Red Bull in his hand, laughing, "You gonna shoot me?", while you're topping off your tank.
By now he's swaggering to within 20 feet, wearing only baggy jeans, visible boxers, and a wifebeater (tank t-shirt), nothing but his Red Bull in his hands. He laughs, and says, "You gonna shoot me, bro," while the group behind him laughs and catcalls. You need to hang up your pump, open your door, and get your keys out of your pant pocket to drive away.
How are you going to act?
Now, ask yourself - would I be in this circumstance without open carry?
Suddenly, a 17 year-old male starts it - "Hey... you a cop?," and laughs and points. The rest of the group joins in. They're noisy and laughing; the first guy starts walking toward you with a Red Bull in his hand, laughing, "You gonna shoot me?", while you're topping off your tank.
By now he's swaggering to within 20 feet, wearing only baggy jeans, visible boxers, and a wifebeater (tank t-shirt), nothing but his Red Bull in his hands. He laughs, and says, "You gonna shoot me, bro," while the group behind him laughs and catcalls. You need to hang up your pump, open your door, and get your keys out of your pant pocket to drive away.
How are you going to act?
Now, ask yourself - would I be in this circumstance without open carry?
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Mike-AK
Member
Well...your profile says you are LE, so when he asked if you were a cop, you could have answered "yes." When he asked if you were going to shoot him, you could have answered "Not unless you give me reason to. I'd rather not, so why don't you go back over there with your friends?"
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We're not talking about police - we're discussing citizen open carry.
How do you act?
And by the way, any experienced 'cop' in New Mexico knows what you suggested would only throw fuel on a spark. Trying to bluff people who really aren't afraid of police (or who can't admit they might be) in a group is a markedly unsuccessful strategy.
How do you act?
And by the way, any experienced 'cop' in New Mexico knows what you suggested would only throw fuel on a spark. Trying to bluff people who really aren't afraid of police (or who can't admit they might be) in a group is a markedly unsuccessful strategy.
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Mike-AK
Member
How do I act? Big difference. I'm not a cop. You said the guy asked you if you were. I don't open carry like you do. I carry my M&P 340 IWB under an untucked shirt. I wouldn't say a word to the guy and just keep going about my business. If he continued to approach aggressively and gave me reason to feel he was placing myself or my family in imminent danger, I would use it.
Most live sheltered lives and don't understand the "Mr Rogers" school of civic behavior left a lot of people behind. These young punks aren't afraid of police or civilians. But most that open carry are out to draw attention to themselves. The "look at me" people.
Concealed is precisely the way to go, as is simply ignoring theatrical provocation.
Not so much imminent danger from a can of Red Bull. Even if he threw it (either liquid or the can) on you with no other provocation, you have no justification to use deadly force. None.
BKLooney
Member
I never OC, it just draws unwanted attention, and situations such as that or worse.
But if he threw that can of Red Bull at me...we're both going home with grass stains on our clothes!
A much more appropriate response than drawing a firearm, but you both might end up in front of a magistrate for public affray (fighting in public). Might be worth it. 
Public affray. Public affray consists of two or more persons voluntarily or by agreement engaging in any fight or using any blows or violence toward each other in an angry or quarrelsome manner in any public place, to the disturbance of others.
Public affray. Public affray consists of two or more persons voluntarily or by agreement engaging in any fight or using any blows or violence toward each other in an angry or quarrelsome manner in any public place, to the disturbance of others.
rogerwnuss
Member
that would be my worry, not taken from someone for being obnoxious, but more likely to get disarmed - or shot in the back- by a criminal who's been observing...
sousana
Member
First thoughts come from the gut, ALWAYS follow your gut.
When some nut OCs in public areas they can cause a panic that can cause injuries. People in stores grab their kids and run for exits. You can't blame these people for calling cops. I'm a Second Amendment hard core but it has nothing to do with this kind of foolishness.
This is where it gets sticky. People who do this are idiots. To me this kind of behavior is no different than yelling fire in a crowded theater. Hard to come up with a law to address this situation without having civil rights violation. While most of the real gun community are supporters of our police there is a new generation of idiots that make it their mission to bait the cops. When cops are called because of these nit wits it ties up manpower that could be better used on criminals.
This is where it gets sticky. People who do this are idiots. To me this kind of behavior is no different than yelling fire in a crowded theater. Hard to come up with a law to address this situation without having civil rights violation. While most of the real gun community are supporters of our police there is a new generation of idiots that make it their mission to bait the cops. When cops are called because of these nit wits it ties up manpower that could be better used on criminals.
sousana
Member
LOL, I've got land out west in NM, just a touch over 300 acres, once had a problem with a guy coming onto the property to fish and gather firewood. Now, had he ASKED I most likely would have allowed him to fish and gather dead firewood, now, the land is heavily posted no tresspassing allowed. The first time I caught him I escorted him off the property, the second time I had the Sheriff issue him a no tresspass, the third time I had him arrested. The fourth time I popped the hood on his truck, after taking video of him trespassing, after popping the hood, I filled the entire engine block with self hardening foam, great stuff by the way, he ended up calling the sheriffs department to press charges of destruction of property, yada yada, private property he didn't have a hand to stand on especially after 3 documented removals. Now, I have 2 retired army SF types who prefer the privacy offered by the property, they are under contract to maintain security of the property, in exchange they can live on said property and gather whatever game or fish they need to survive. Works great for all of us.
Doug M.
Member
I want to get left alone. I want to be ignored. I have attracted enough attention by having big dogs, most of which have been pretty social. The one in my avatar was not. He would get agitated by the presence of strangers, and I would work hard to communicate with them from a distance so I could go another way; I was after all, the one with the difficult dog.
I also have a firm voice and a lack of patience for stupidity. I tend to sound angry to the weak even if I am not. O/C in a semi-urban area/small city, etc. is simply not a good practice. I have been sent to calls about lawful O/C when I was still a cop, and until you have experienced the hatred from such a complainant (even worse after we told him there was no lawful basis to contact the dude carrying), it is hard to explain. Nope. Not going to O/C except maybe out on a rural hike.
I also have a firm voice and a lack of patience for stupidity. I tend to sound angry to the weak even if I am not. O/C in a semi-urban area/small city, etc. is simply not a good practice. I have been sent to calls about lawful O/C when I was still a cop, and until you have experienced the hatred from such a complainant (even worse after we told him there was no lawful basis to contact the dude carrying), it is hard to explain. Nope. Not going to O/C except maybe out on a rural hike.
Sam D
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Would a WM freak care about someone OCing?
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