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SCOTUS Rules 'Ghost Guns' are Illegal
- Thread starter biku324
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OP
Indeed - I ran (among many other things in an HQ assignment) the NMSP armory where we kept firearms used in crimes or seized in raids, etc. Only a few were reported stolen, and those were returned to those who reported them stolen.
Here's a useful data link. https://bjs.ojp.gov/document/suficspi16.pdf
Here's a useful data link. https://bjs.ojp.gov/document/suficspi16.pdf
Ok, I guess I stated it in a broad brush. They are obtained illegally. Which having a serial still doesn't stop them from doing so.
I am betting that "obtained from underground market" was likely stolen, just not by the bearer at the time.
Rosewood
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He said "most guns," you said "all guns." Perhaps you need to re-read your own post.
OP
No on both. Many states have no restrictions on private sales - many guns from those states get taken to states with tighter laws and comprise underground gun markets. As well, lots of folks committing crimes have not yet been arrested or convicted so are legally able to purchase/possess firearms. Stolen guns are entered into NCIC, and no matter when/how they are encountered, they are seized and eventually returned.
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OP
Fair point.
It seems people will always find a way to screw something up.
For decades, hobbyists were able to build guns for their own use. It was an innocent activity, totally consistent with our traditions, our heritage, and with the 2nd Amendment. Until criminals realized they could take advantage of it...
In Baltimore and other urban areas, there were enterprising thugs who set up shop buying parts kits and churning out completed guns to sell to criminals. There have been a number of news stories over the last few years about "ghost guns" being recovered at crime scenes, carried by students in schools, etc.
There is no way the manufacturers and retailers of these kits didn't know what the end product was being used for. When you're manufacturing or selling gun parts kits ostensibly for hobbyists, but you start getting orders for dozens or hundreds to be shipped to one address, it's pretty obvious what's going on.
The gun parts kit industry brought this on themselves...it serves them right.
For decades, hobbyists were able to build guns for their own use. It was an innocent activity, totally consistent with our traditions, our heritage, and with the 2nd Amendment. Until criminals realized they could take advantage of it...
In Baltimore and other urban areas, there were enterprising thugs who set up shop buying parts kits and churning out completed guns to sell to criminals. There have been a number of news stories over the last few years about "ghost guns" being recovered at crime scenes, carried by students in schools, etc.
There is no way the manufacturers and retailers of these kits didn't know what the end product was being used for. When you're manufacturing or selling gun parts kits ostensibly for hobbyists, but you start getting orders for dozens or hundreds to be shipped to one address, it's pretty obvious what's going on.
The gun parts kit industry brought this on themselves...it serves them right.
And then there are straw purchases. Here's just one of many examples here locally.
One Man's Buying Spree Exposes the Drugs-for-Guns Trade in Vermont | Seven Days Vermont
What does this do about pre 68 guns that were not serial numbered? Are these now illegal?
venomballistics
Member
seems to me that PMF's remain unchanged, and 80% lowers simply fall into the same category as a full commercial lower, requiring FFL transfer.
Remember how soft point, hollow point FMJ and teflon coated all got called "cop killer bullets" .... just change it to ghost gun.
I hear the Hoffman Tactical 3D printed lowers are pretty decent when squirted from PETG CF.
I imagine it's less labor intensive as well
Remember how soft point, hollow point FMJ and teflon coated all got called "cop killer bullets" .... just change it to ghost gun.
I hear the Hoffman Tactical 3D printed lowers are pretty decent when squirted from PETG CF.
I imagine it's less labor intensive as well
That was after they graduated from being Dum Dums...
...Ben
The term "ghost guns" is a anti-gun group made up term used to label something so they can get the "sheep" to believe it, hate it and push to ban it.
We as gun owners should never use their terms. It just gives legitimacy to a illegitimate idea.
We as gun owners should never use their terms. It just gives legitimacy to a illegitimate idea.
OP
No. They are grandfathered. I have one.
Fishinfool
Member
Just to ad fuel to the fire - The ATF estimates there are an average of 266,000 firearms stolen in the US each year.
I cant give an actual, verified number, but my experience in LE has been that a fairly significant percentage of those end up in crimes, even if the perpetrator was not the person who originally stole it. And there are quite a few folks, who for whatever reason, do not report firearms theft to the police.
R/E the original topic, as a non-licensed individual, you are still allowed to manufacture a firearm from scratch for personal use (non-resale), and I don't believe a serial number is required.
Larry
I cant give an actual, verified number, but my experience in LE has been that a fairly significant percentage of those end up in crimes, even if the perpetrator was not the person who originally stole it. And there are quite a few folks, who for whatever reason, do not report firearms theft to the police.
R/E the original topic, as a non-licensed individual, you are still allowed to manufacture a firearm from scratch for personal use (non-resale), and I don't believe a serial number is required.
Larry
But neither is true . . .
Most never show up . . .
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Where were serial numbers in 1789 (signing of the Constitution)?
bushmaster1313
Member
On my everyday carry gun, a Sig P365, the serial number is on the "Fire Control Unit" (FCU). Here is a picture of a P365 FCU from the Sig Sauer website:
IMHO it does not look much like a firearm. In fact, at first glance it's hard to tell which end is the business end.
As to the Supreme Court's "Ghost Gun" opinion, it does not directly impact me whether 80% receivers are or are not a firearm for purposes of ATF regulation. On the other hand, it matters to all firearm owners that the firearm laws of the United States are clear and make sense. Unfortunately, this decision regarding so-called "Ghost Guns" only muddies the waters.
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elgatodeacero
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This thread title is incorrect and misleading.
Here is a sober analysis of this case.
Second Amendment Roundup: Supreme Court Decides VanDerStok
Here is a sober analysis of this case.
Second Amendment Roundup: Supreme Court Decides VanDerStok
I have a question about Ghost guns. Exactly how does a ghost hold a gun? I mean, can they handle solid objects? Why are ghost restricted from owning guns, I mean, are they now part of the forbidden class?
Rosewood
Rosewood
